Bullet Sizing, .44 Magnum 29-2

[mod29]

Has anyone actually slugged a bore of a 29-2 for measurement purposes?

I have a couple of 29-2s that I believe were manufactured approx 1977 or perhaps 1978. Both have S/Ns starting with N397XXX.

I have shot Oregon Trail lead SWC bullets measuring .431 with good results, but am wondering what others are using, and if there is a better size I should consider for lead bullets.

I load light magnum loads, not pushing these at upper limits at all.

Thanks guys.

 

[Forrest r]

I've owned several 29-2's over the decades. All of them used .431" cast/lead bullets.

Slugging the bore does nothing for you. It's slugging the chambers in the cylinder that count. You want to be able to drop a bullet in the chamber and use slight/lite pressure to push it thru. Once the bullets size is established from the cylinder diameters. Any issues with the bbl can be addressed and corrected if possible.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

My 1977 M29-2 (N4173xx) has a .4165" bore, a .4295" groove & .4320" throats.

Generally you want to use lead bullets .001" larger than the throats to minimize blow-by/leading & group the best.

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[rockquarry]

I size everything at .432" for my 24-3s, 29s, and a new Colt Ananconda. As I recall, one gun (a 24-3, I think) shot slightly more accurately with a .431" bullet, but I'm not going to size differently for just one revolver. Overall, .432" bullets shoot very well.

 

[M29since14]

I use .432” bullets. I find that is about the largest diameter I can load that will always allow my cartridges to drop freely into the chambers. That size solved all of my leading problems and it is accurate and safe with any bullet and powder charge I’ve ever used in my guns.

 

[cowboy4evr]

Slugging the barrel is just as important as the measuring the cylinder throats .
I almost bought a Colt New Service revolve in 44 WCFr years ago . I had his gun smith measure the groove diameter of the barrel and cylinder throats . The cylinder throats measured .427 , the barrel measured .434 . I passed on buying it . You need both measurements and the cylinder throats need to be at least the same size as the barrel or slightly larger .
This info is right out of Veral Smith's book " Jacketed Performance with Cast Bullets " . Regards Paul

 

[carelesslove]

mod29, carelesslove, here !

Your question is a very good one ! I started shooting S&W .44 Magnums in the early-to-mid 70's - back when my eyesight was much keener. I thought I was doing pretty good, shooting my cast 0.429" bullets - in 0.432" cylinder throats.

Now, if we fast-forward to the 90s, and on to about 2020, I noticed that my later-vintage .44 Magnums were "still" shooting good groups, but my older guns were lagging, in accuracy.

Then I began intently listening to the teachings of Veral Smith of LBT and called him. I learned more in our conversation than I knew before - from years of shooting / reloading / casting.

The two members / gentlemen that responded to you, ahead of me are right on !

I started loading 2 distinct sets of .44 Magnum ammunition - one set for 0.429" to .430" cylinder throats and another set for my older .44s (including my .44 Specials) that all have 0.432" throats.

Despite my gradually failing eyesight, my groups tightened up - proving that Veral was right ! Cylinder & bore leading stopped, velocities went up, and I had the "big throated" guns shooting tight groups again - just like the newer guns.

I turned my attention to my "big throated" .45 revolvers and solved their problems the same way - by casting & sizing the .45s to the cylinder throats.

Admittedly, it is difficult to find bullets (and molds) that throw 0.432". & larger ".44 caliber" bullets, but the difference is clearly measurable.

I now have ammo cans marked & stocked - just like two different calibers - - 0.429" and 0.432", and I enjoy them both even more!

If you give this a try, I think you will enjoy your results, too !

Tom "carelesslove" Love

 

[rockquarry]

Some years ago, I had three .44 caliber moulds professionally opened up to where they cast .432" bullets; I run these through a .432" size die (a .430" die that was opened up). Well worth the expense for me.

I have a 50's or '60s model Lyman #429421 HP mould that didn't require enlarging. As-cast bullets come out at .433", I believe. Many of the older Lyman moulds cast large diameter bullets.

 

[carelesslove]

"Fatter" Molds & Bullets

rockquarry, you are absolutely "on target" and I sincerely appreciate your experience !

I currently use an older RCBS 255 KT mold, that drops .44 bullets (of moderate hardness) at 0.432". I also have an (original) Ideal 429421, that drops at 0.433" (in Linotype).

A few years ago - prior to "the Fire" - I had Veral Smith make me a custom mold (432-260-WFN-PB) that drops 0.435" bullets in moderately hard alloy. I just didn't know it was going to be one of his last.......

I size all three of these bullets to 0.432" and fire them in my older .44s - including several .44 Specials (all old, and big-throated).

This has solved all my leading, accuracy, and velocity issues and made them all a joy to shoot.


Thanks, Tom "carelesslove" Love

 

[rockquarry]

Yes, Veral Smith knows cast bullets. I've about worn out #1 and #2 versions of his booklet.

 

[mikld]

I own 3 44 Mag revolvers and size my bullets to the same diameter as the cylinder throats. Of course I slug the barrels and throats to make sure throats are bigger than groove diameter of barrel...

 

[Drm50]

Here’s a fun fact, if your cylinder is smaller than your bore you are going to have problems with accuracy. The upset is only going to cure so much. I would much rather have slightly over diameter cylinder than under size.
Modern era guns are made within a set of tolerances. Custom guns are not.
They are made to exact tolerance. If it comes off assembly line, which barrels and cylinders do, it’s a **** shoot what you are going to get. It ranges from a cherry to a lemon. Largest percentage of production falls in between. I’ve seen it many times.

 

[Skeet 028]

I have an old single cavity one piece mold made by Lyman before Elmer. They quit making molds with the handles as part of the mold in about 1927. The number is 429-388? I think. Like a 421 except ...well look at it and a 421 and they are different. It was the pre-eminent 44 SWC at the time. Mine casts 434/435 with certain lead recipes. With softer lead I size at 433. and 434 for my old Ruger SBH. Not a 421 but close 'nuff. It'll be the last mold I'll sell when I quit casting for 44s. It shoots better than I can in any 44 I have ever had....including my mid/late 70s 29-2 4 inch

 

[243winxb]

This works for me in 29-2 https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?media/44-magnum-hard-alloy-25-yards.3117/full

 

[Forrest r]

Slugging the barrel is just as important as the measuring the cylinder throats .
I almost bought a Colt New Service revolve in 44 WCFr years ago . I had his gun smith measure the groove diameter of the barrel and cylinder throats . The cylinder throats measured .427 , the barrel measured .434 . I passed on buying it . You need both measurements and the cylinder throats need to be at least the same size as the barrel or slightly larger .
This info is right out of Veral Smith's book " Jacketed Performance with Cast Bullets " . Regards Paul

When your cylinder throats measured .427", that's called a clue.

 

[Forrest r]

It got old using 2 different sized cast bullets in the 44mags & specials. Before I thinned the herd(again) I was shooting a 629-3, 29-2, 624-2?, ca bulldog and a contender with a 10" bbl.

The29-2 took a .431" bullet.

The 624 took a .431" bullet

Everything else used a .430" bullet. With lite loads I could get away with using the oversized bullets in the .430" firearms. Start picking up the pressure/hot loads and accuracy went south.

Not a hand pick/cherry picked target by any means. It's nothing more that 1 of the 50yd targets I shot that day using a cast 250gr Mihec 432-640 fn hp sized to .430".

Same bullet sized to .430" in a contender @ 100yds. Put a fastfire III on the contender to bang on steal @ 100yds. Was zeroing the reddot in starting with the top left target and ended with the bottom right.

A close=up of that bottom right target (not hand/cherry picked)

A .431" bullet isn't accurate in those firearms when the distances get longer. Even @ 25yds 1 1/2" groups or less is childs play with .430" bullets in that 629.

Ended up selling that 624 and 29-2. End the contender, was thinning the herd. I had some .431" jacketed bullets I swaged for the 29-2 laying around after I sold it. Loaded up 6 test rounds (+/- 25,000psi) and shot them in that 629. BIG MISTAKE!!!!! Accuracy sucked and I had to pound the cases out of the cylinders from overpressure. I shot 100's of those home swaged jacketed bullets sized to .429" in the 629 and contender without any issues.

Ended up tossing those .431" jacketec bullets in the pot to melt the lead cores out of them.
The 44cal jacketed bullets I made/swaged

I sold off a lot of my 44cal molds that cast .432" bullets or larger. When I start sizing the cast bullets down more that 3/1000th's in 1 pass. Accuracy goes south.

Don't know if it's old age and not wanting to bother with different sized bullets for the different 44cal firearms. Or just getting lazy & made life simpler with 1 bullet size (.430").

In the past I've had several 29-2's, a couple ruger blackhawks, a marlin lever action & several ca bulldogs that all used .431" bullets. Those days are gone.

 

[M29since14]

…When I start sizing the cast bullets down more that 3/1000th's in 1 pass. Accuracy goes south.

An old accepted principle, but well worth remembering. Sizing is like Jefferson’s concept of government. Seems that least is best. With the 29-2s, I’ve found obtaining molds that throw bullets as close as possible to my desired .432” diameter is the way to go.