LAYGO
Member
Notice the holster with the "bullet ramp"?
Carry - 1 in the chamber
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Notice the holster with the "bullet ramp"?
stantheman86
US Veteran
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There is NO reason not to carry with one in the chamber...........if you have a gun that you don't feel comfortable carrying "cocked and locked" than start saving for a DA revolver or a DA semi-auto pistol.
What if you get grabbed by one arm, or from behind, and don't have the ability to rack the slide? Do you think you will always get the chance to rack a slide? Surprise is one of a CCW holders best weapons.......if I get held up at knifepoint, gunpoint, by multiple attackers......and I think I have ANY chance at making a shot, I'll act like I'm pissing my pants and I can't get my wallet out fast enough, for all they know I have never touched a gun in my life, let alone am carrying one........and then out comes my Beretta Tomcat .32 Auto and 3 rounds are out before they even know what happened.......
This is also why 90% of the time I carry a DA revolver.......under stress I want as little to worry about as possible. I draw, pull the trigger, repeat......reload as necessary.....
Keeping the next chamber empty on a revolver? For God's sake, what is that gonna accomplish? In case the revolver pulls it's own trigger? You're already working with only 6 shots, maybe 5 on a snub.....why handicap yourself a possibly life-saving round?
I also love these old curmudgeons that carry a modern DA revolver like a Ruger SP101, with the chamber under the hammer empty......I'm like "This ain't 1875 and that ain't a Colt Peacemaker......" I guess some people can't forget that "Pap told me to never load the one under the hammer........" Yeah, well Pap probably had a Colt Lightning made when that rule still applied.......not a modern .357 revolver that will not go off unless the trigger is completely pulled to the rear.
What if you get grabbed by one arm, or from behind, and don't have the ability to rack the slide? Do you think you will always get the chance to rack a slide? Surprise is one of a CCW holders best weapons.......if I get held up at knifepoint, gunpoint, by multiple attackers......and I think I have ANY chance at making a shot, I'll act like I'm pissing my pants and I can't get my wallet out fast enough, for all they know I have never touched a gun in my life, let alone am carrying one........and then out comes my Beretta Tomcat .32 Auto and 3 rounds are out before they even know what happened.......
This is also why 90% of the time I carry a DA revolver.......under stress I want as little to worry about as possible. I draw, pull the trigger, repeat......reload as necessary.....
Keeping the next chamber empty on a revolver? For God's sake, what is that gonna accomplish? In case the revolver pulls it's own trigger? You're already working with only 6 shots, maybe 5 on a snub.....why handicap yourself a possibly life-saving round?
I also love these old curmudgeons that carry a modern DA revolver like a Ruger SP101, with the chamber under the hammer empty......I'm like "This ain't 1875 and that ain't a Colt Peacemaker......" I guess some people can't forget that "Pap told me to never load the one under the hammer........" Yeah, well Pap probably had a Colt Lightning made when that rule still applied.......not a modern .357 revolver that will not go off unless the trigger is completely pulled to the rear.
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Lightfoot4
Member
Well, at least with a revolver he'll probably pull the trigger again quickly if the gun doesn't go bang.
1911bphil
Member
I carry a DAO revolver (J-frame) with all five cylinders loaded. Thats one less thing to worry about when the pucker factor rises. JMHO.
firebirdude
US Veteran
haha I like it.
I think you guys are being a bit too hard on the people who carry without one in the tube. 
I mean realistically, how long does it take you to rack the slide? I guarantee it takes less time than it does to lift your shirt to grab the butt of the weapon. Less time than it would take to drop your groceries.
Racking the slide takes a millisecond. It's done with the free hand as the weapon is drawn, like cocking the hammer on a wheel gun. As the weapon moves forward the free hand swipes and puts the gun to ready.
I carry with one in the tube, but I'm not going to think for a minute that I can draw faster than someone else that still needs to rack their slide.
The ONLY downsides I can see is if somehow the weapon jams, or if you first get shot in your non-dominant hand and cannot easily rack the slide for your reply shot. Other than that I believe carrying a weapon without a loaded chamber is safer (obviously there have been accidents when the gun is live) and if it makes a person feel safer, I say live and let live.
I don't mean to get up on my soapbox, but let's not be cruel and imply if someone doesn't carry at the ready they are either less of a person or not as smart as they could be.
I mean realistically, how long does it take you to rack the slide? I guarantee it takes less time than it does to lift your shirt to grab the butt of the weapon. Less time than it would take to drop your groceries.
Racking the slide takes a millisecond. It's done with the free hand as the weapon is drawn, like cocking the hammer on a wheel gun. As the weapon moves forward the free hand swipes and puts the gun to ready.
I carry with one in the tube, but I'm not going to think for a minute that I can draw faster than someone else that still needs to rack their slide.
The ONLY downsides I can see is if somehow the weapon jams, or if you first get shot in your non-dominant hand and cannot easily rack the slide for your reply shot. Other than that I believe carrying a weapon without a loaded chamber is safer (obviously there have been accidents when the gun is live) and if it makes a person feel safer, I say live and let live.
I don't mean to get up on my soapbox, but let's not be cruel and imply if someone doesn't carry at the ready they are either less of a person or not as smart as they could be.
agksimon
Member
I think you guys are being a bit too hard on the people who carry without one in the tube.
I mean realistically, how long does it take you to rack the slide? I guarantee it takes less time than it does to lift your shirt to grab the butt of the weapon. Less time than it would take to drop your groceries.
Racking the slide takes a millisecond. It's done with the free hand as the weapon is drawn, like cocking the hammer on a wheel gun. As the weapon moves forward the free hand swipes and puts the gun to ready.
I carry with one in the tube, but I'm not going to think for a minute that I can draw faster than someone else that still needs to rack their slide.
The ONLY downsides I can see is if somehow the weapon jams, or if you first get shot in your non-dominant hand and cannot easily rack the slide for your reply shot. Other than that I believe carrying a weapon without a loaded chamber is safer (obviously there have been accidents when the gun is live) and if it makes a person feel safer, I say live and let live.
I don't mean to get up on my soapbox, but let's not be cruel and imply if someone doesn't carry at the ready they are either less of a person or not as smart as they could be.
Ask any cop if he carries with an empty chamber. I'm sure if they all did so, their mortality rate would be somewhat higher. Try timing yourself both ways and see what your speed difference is. I shoot IDPA a lot and I'm fairly good at it and I just tried both ways, with my wife timing me. It added about 3/4 of a second to my time. That 3/4 second could make you a second place winner, which is not good.
That 3/4 second is pretty fast!
I'm just saying, 99% of us will never draw a weapon in combat. If it makes you feel better to carry unloaded your entire life, then be happy!
I'd most likely be ducking and taking cover during the first 4 seconds!
I'm just saying, 99% of us will never draw a weapon in combat. If it makes you feel better to carry unloaded your entire life, then be happy!
I'd most likely be ducking and taking cover during the first 4 seconds!
agksimon
Member
That 3/4 second is pretty fast!
I'm just saying, 99% of us will never draw a weapon in combat. If it makes you feel better to carry unloaded your entire life, then be happy!
I'd most likely be ducking and taking cover during the first 4 seconds!
Go back and re-read my last post. I'm for one in the chamber, not against.
Same here.
But with regards to carrying a semi-auto without one in the chamber, I know I've had my hand slip off the slide--thus failing to chamber a round--when I've had all my wits about me. I wouldn't want to risk something similar happening under stress.
sgtvilla
US Veteran
I prefer to carry one in the chamber. If I need to draw and shoot, I'm all set. I also don't like thumb safeties. My M&P 45 does not have one. When I carry guns that do, I just leave it off (or on the fire position).
Having said that, the israeli draw (which had been mentioned in this thread) does work if you train it properly. I haven't trained properly on it (because I dont see the point since I carry one in the pipe anyway), but I have seen it done by people that have and its not all that bad.
I was looking for examples online and I found this one, that looks good: YouTube - Modified Israeli Mossad Draw (IMD)
and then I found one that looks terrible: YouTube - Pistol Carry Method : +1 VS Israeli ...
not trying to knock on the shooter, simply using them as examples. One of the reasons (in my opinion) why the first one is a little smoother (other than the fact that the dude is better), is that he uses a power stroke when actioning his slide, as opposed to the second guy who grips the back of the slide with two fingers and racks before getting that gun into his "workspace".
Having said that, the israeli draw (which had been mentioned in this thread) does work if you train it properly. I haven't trained properly on it (because I dont see the point since I carry one in the pipe anyway), but I have seen it done by people that have and its not all that bad.
I was looking for examples online and I found this one, that looks good: YouTube - Modified Israeli Mossad Draw (IMD)
and then I found one that looks terrible: YouTube - Pistol Carry Method : +1 VS Israeli ...
not trying to knock on the shooter, simply using them as examples. One of the reasons (in my opinion) why the first one is a little smoother (other than the fact that the dude is better), is that he uses a power stroke when actioning his slide, as opposed to the second guy who grips the back of the slide with two fingers and racks before getting that gun into his "workspace".
sgtvilla
US Veteran
That 3/4 second is pretty fast!
I'm just saying, 99% of us will never draw a weapon in combat.
thats why you need to listen to those that HAVE.
I think you guys are being a bit too hard on the people who carry without one in the tube.
I mean realistically, how long does it take you to rack the slide? I guarantee it takes less time than it does to lift your shirt to grab the butt of the weapon. Less time than it would take to drop your groceries.
Racking the slide takes a millisecond. It's done with the free hand as the weapon is drawn, like cocking the hammer on a wheel gun. As the weapon moves forward the free hand swipes and puts the gun to ready.
I carry with one in the tube, but I'm not going to think for a minute that I can draw faster than someone else that still needs to rack their slide.
The ONLY downsides I can see is if somehow the weapon jams, or if you first get shot in your non-dominant hand and cannot easily rack the slide for your reply shot. Other than that I believe carrying a weapon without a loaded chamber is safer (obviously there have been accidents when the gun is live) and if it makes a person feel safer, I say live and let live.
I don't mean to get up on my soapbox, but let's not be cruel and imply if someone doesn't carry at the ready they are either less of a person or not as smart as they could be.
With that kind of thinking why carry a gun in the first place?
There are MANY scenarios that we could discuss as to why you SHOULD have one in the chamber.
You have a duty to protect yourself and your family. Little hard to do with an unloaded gun.
Maybe I'll grab your weak side arm and see if you can rack the slide with one hand.
The next time your in public, see how often one or the other hand is occupied with something.
Things like your newborn son or daughter, a bag of groceries, holding hands with your loved one. Maybe you need to push or pull that loved one to cover while you draw.
I could go on. But IMHO, WAY too many people don't stop and think BEFORE they strap on a gun.
Just my 2 cents but what the hell do I know!
MotorCityGun
Member
With that kind of thinking why carry a gun in the first place?
There are MANY scenarios that we could discuss as to why you SHOULD have one in the chamber.
You have a duty to protect yourself and your family. Little hard to do with an unloaded gun.
Maybe I'll grab your weak side arm and see if you can rack the slide with one hand.
The next time your in public, see how often one or the other hand is occupied with something.
Things like your newborn son or daughter, a bag of groceries, holding hands with your loved one. Maybe you need to push or pull that loved one to cover while you draw.
I could go on. But IMHO, WAY too many people don't stop and think BEFORE they strap on a gun.
Just my 2 cents but what the hell do I know!
Good post. I have had to "recalibrate" my habits, such as, the one you mentioned above about carrying groceries out to the car. Now my jacket is always unzipped no matter how cold it is outside. Keys are kept in my left hand pocket and key fob used with left hand. Carry my briefcase strap over my left shoulder. Gloves are rarely worn. Although I CCW, I try not to "expose" my right side. Prefer to have my (strong side) back to a wall, and if no wall, then strong side (inner) arm is pressed against holster/pistol without being overt/obvious about it.
IMHO, this type of "practice" is as important as practicing at the range.
Combat_Diver
US Veteran
All my carry guns have a round in the chamber. There are times however I'll have chamber free guns with loaded mags. These are for older pre WWII designs that I'm playing with, ie-Radom P35, Astra 600, Savage 1917, etc. Again these are not my primary arms but secondary or thrid order guns stashed around the house.
CD
CD
kd4gij
Member
clcdawg
Member
You must have one in the chamber or else carry a baseball bat.
badguybuster
Member
I'd rather have it chambered and not need it, then to not have it chambered and need it.....when the proverbial excrement hits the fan, the last thing I wanna hear is.."Click". "Crap, forgot to chamber a round"!!
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