Changed the 7-round 4513TSW baseplate.

[18DAI]

I've been shooting several different handguns this past few weekends.

Two I shot, a 3914NL and a Colt CCO. Both felt just right in my hands and I shot some very fast drills very accurately. After some thought and handling the guns I came to the realization that the rubber grips and base plates - or bumper pads in the case of the 1911 - combined to feel better in my hands than the set up I was using on my 4513TSW V1.

I've gone back and forth over the last year with my 4513's grip options. I finally settled on the factory OEM grips with the original rounded mag base plate. Good for carry and concealment - OK for shooting fast and accurately.

While handling the CCO I noticed that my hand fit on its grip similarly to how it fit on my late production 7-round rail free 4513TSW. Only the CCO felt better due to the rubber grip and the rounded baseplate. A Wilson Combat mag IIRC.

Hmmmmm........ I wonder if a 7-round 4513TSW equipped with Hogue rubber grips and a rounded baseplate from the original 6-round mags would feel this good in the hand?

So, last night I got my 7-round rail free 4513TSW out of storage and cleaned and lubed it. Then I put a set of Hogue rubber grips on it. Finally, I took a rounded base plate fron a 6-round mag and installed it on the 7-round mag. Insert the mag and VIOLA! IT WORKS AND FEELS GREAT!!

Now I just have to run some rounds through the new setup and see if it works as well as it feels. The only concern I have is the tiny space between the bottom of the grip frame and the top edge of the plastic baseplate. It is similar to the little space on the Glock 30 when I grip it. When I shoot a Glock 30 I sometimes get my pinky finger pinched between the frame and baseplate during recoil from the shot. We will have to see how it works.

Anyways it feels and looks good and the 4513TSW hand cycled two mags full of snap caps with no problems.

If you have access to the parts to do so, give it a try and let us know what you think. Regards 18DAI

 

[Laddy Smith]

Comfort Idea

Suggestion: if you attach one of those rails to your non-rail 4513, it'll tip the balance just right and your pinky won't get an "owie."


Lad

 

[raidersrule]

Suggestion: if you attach one of those rails to your non-rail 4513, it'll tip the balance just right and your pinky won't get an "owie."


Lad

Blasphemy!!

I tried a "skinny" 4506 mag on one of my 7-round 4513 mags and the gap was pretty substantial. Enough so that I switched the two of them back to their original mags

 

[18DAI]

Yea, the flatter base pad from the eight rounders doesn't work, as well. It fits but it doesn't bring any improvements to fit or function, for me.

The original 7-round baseplate with the finger lift on the front is OK. But I always feel like it is "squeezing" my fingers a little and causing me to "torque" the pistol to the right while firing. Especially with the factory OEM grip installed.

I'm really hoping it works while shooting as well as it looks and feels.

The "gap" or space between the top of the rounded base pad and the bottom of the frame is only about 1mm. 2mm max. I don't see it as much as feel it when gripping the pistol. But gripping it is so much more natural, to me, than with the regular OEM finger lift pad on.

The drills I will be doing are controlled pairs on a six inch diameter bright green circle and a six inch bright green square at 10 yards. Last Saturday we were able to keep all the rounds within the confines firing VERY quickly. With all the pistols we used. All the way out to around 18 yards. All the guns used were single stack and had barrel lengths 4 inches or less. Mostly less. 9's and 45's. Regards 18DAI

 

[Lost Lake]

Suggestion: if you attach one of those rails to your non-rail 4513, it'll tip the balance just right and your pinky won't get an "owie."


Lad

Blasphemy!! (Raider you took the words right out of my mouth!! )

To put a luggage rack on such a beautiful gun would be an abomination. What are you going to do, hang your car keys on there? Maybe a pair of handcuffs? Or is the rail just so it won't ever fit in a holster again?

I'll take my TSW's without the spare parts please...

Carry on.

.

 

[timn8er]

I prefer mine without rails, also. The last two I bought, though, have rails. A 5906TSW & a 5903TSW. I got smoking deals on both of them, & I thought "deal with a rail, or not have these guns that I've been looking for a pretty good while"? I decided to deal with the rail & they don't bother me that much anymore. I won't be hanging any appliances on them, except maybe some track lighting...the range I shoot at could use a little more illumination.

 

[tom 45]

18DAI,

If I'm reading your post correctly it is the curve at the front of the mag base that bothers you.
The curve on the front of the CS45 mag felt like it was squeezing my little finger also so I sanded it to match the contour of the grip. It made a huge difference.
I hope you can see what I did in the photo.

 

[cpeblue]

But those rails fall off so easily .

 

[18DAI]

tom 45 thats exactly what I was trying to accomplish. I'm not as talented with sanding/forming as you evidently are, so I just went with the mag bases I had.

Your handiwork looks great!

Yesterday another investigator gave me a small Glock sock, or Hogue slip on grip as some refer to it. I put it on my 6-shot 4513 that is now wearing its OEM grip. Feels good. Takes away the slippery feeling from the factory Xenoy grip. Guess I'll shoot it Saturday too.

I think it is well known that I have no use for those stupid rails. Especially on a compact pistol designed to be easily concealed. Makes no sense to me. Ive taken them off every TSW I've purchased that still had them. Regards 18DAI

 

[Fastbolt]

I've done something similar by using some extra original 4513TSW butt plates on my CS45 mags, as well as changing them around on my CS9 & 3913 mags (I received some original 3913TSW 7-rd mags from a friend when he changed to a newer 3913TSW which used the standard 8-rd mags.)

CS9/3913 mags with assorted butt plates:





CS45:



After enough years of switching back & forth while using them for a lot of shooting, I've discovered I can't feel any difference between them any longer. I have to look to see which is in the gun at any moment. I guess I no longer worry about what my little finger is doing.

The one advantage I still find useful for the longer curved butt plates in either of the CS guns is that they're just enough longer to make fast loading more positive than when using the shorter butt plates. More of a difference among the 9mm butt plates, though. The curved tip of the .45 butt plate seems to offer just a little more purchase for the palm of my hand during loading. Might just be the shape of my palm and the leading edge of the curved butt plate.

I do much the same thing when carrying my G26/27's, SW999c & M&P 40c, BTW, often putting the mags with the flatter butt plates in the guns, and then using mags for spares which have longer butt plates (aiding in insertion of them under stress). The difference is much more noticeable in those guns than in the 3rd gen's ... to me (which matters when I'm the one using them, right?)

I used to find myself experiencing the same sort of "vertical crunch" regarding my finger-stack when using the curved butt plates on the mags in both my 6-rd 4513TSW and my CS45, but it seems lessened nowadays, as I put less emphasis on my little finger. Just one of those things, I guess.

 

[18DAI]

Shooting the two 4513TSW's Saturday went very well. It was fun too!

Before I went to the range I was checking the two pistols and noticed a few things. While technically the "same" model these pistols - the early 6 round mag and late production rail free 7 round mag - are not identical. There are a few subtle differences. Maybe a few of you will find these differences interesting.

The 6 round variants dust cover is longer than the dustcover on the 7-round gun. I didn't have calipers but it looked to be a good 1/16th of an inch longer. The 6 round 4513 was also "sharper" than the 7 round gun. The 7 round gun appearing to have a factory melt done to it. Not really visible on the slide but running your fingers over both you could feel the difference. Especially around the rear of the frame by the hammer.

It was visible around the trigger guards and mag catch. The 7 round 4513TSW having rounded contours and metal removed eliminating the sharp edges around the mag catch that the 6 round gun has. The 7 - round was barely thinner in the slide but slightly thicker in the frame. Especially around the dust cover which I attribute to the design for the rail.

The 6 round gun is a 1997 build with an MSF prefix. The rail free 7 round gun is a TDU prefix and built in 2001 IIRC.

Both have the late model guide rod without the staked head. The barrels on the two guns appeared identical except for the thickness of the barrels. The 7 round guns barrel was noticeably thicker when viewed head on than that of the 6 round gun. Also when I loaded both guns to their respective capacities, the 7 round 4513TSW with Hoge grips felt heavier than the 6 round variant. Heavier than one 45 cartridge difference, to me.

In this test for function with the new grip configurations I was not shooting for bullseye or slow fire accuracy. Both of these guns are tack drivers. Both are more inherently accurate than I am. And I've qualified Expert with both of them more than once.

This test was merely to see if I could get a more controllable grip to enable me to draw and fire the gun both VERY quickly AND accurately. The target was a human silouette with a 6 inch diameter bright green circle on the head and a 6 inch diameter bright green square high on the chest. Both areas you would aim for in an armed confrontation.

You cannot work out of the holster at this public indoor range. So, I compensated for that by laying the loaded pistol lying on the table and snatching it up to fire a controled pair at the target. I did head shots with the 6 round gun and chest shots with the 7 round gun. I set the target at 12 feet for a realistic shooting distance that would be likely in an "unfortunate incident". I loaded 6 rounds in all the mags and fired DA for the first shot every time. I fired 59 rounds in this brief experiment.

I shot the 6-round gun first. It had the factory OEM grip with a Hogue slip on grip. I love this pistol. Light weight, easy to carry, points naturally and it is bet your life reliable. Great trigger too. This one is decock only with night sights.

My first two shots with the 6 round gun were 2.75 inches apart, just to the right of mid line. Both in the green. The next two were over 3 inches apart, both further to the right, with the second one just outside the green circle. My last two were low right with the second shot outside the green circle. So, four hits and two misses picking up the gun and shooting twice as fast as I could pull the trigger. Distance from the furthest two hits was right at 5 inches. I'm good with that. The two "misses" were still A hits out on "the range where the targets shoot back".

I fired the later 7 round 4513TSW with the Hogue grips and new rounded mag base next. I shot for the green square with it. My first two round were nicely centered and vertically strung 1.5 inches apart. The second shot just slightly to the right of midline and above the first shot. My next two were about 1 inch apart but high and right. Still in the green. My last two were both high right almost through the previous two holes, but the second round was two inches from the first and outside the green square. So five hits and one miss.

The 7 round 4513TSW didn't feel as good to me in the hand as the 6 round gun did. I felt like the gun was torquing to the right while I was shooting it. The rounded mag base plate was perfect but the grip needed some work.

So I went out into the shop and found a Hogue slip on grip with two finger ridges. I took ogg the Hogue grip and reinstalled the 7 rounders factory OEM grip. Then I slid on the slip on grip. WOW! Feels pretty good! Back into the range. All six shots into the green. 5.50 inches furthest to furthest. Cool! I think I'll shoot this one again. Drop the mag slap in a new mag rack and MALFUNCTION!. The Hogue slip on grip had slid down and interferred with the fresh mag going in and locking. Not good.

I took it off and sliced an 1/8th of an inch off the bottom of the slip on grip. Replaced it and everything looked good. No problems for the rest of the session AND I shot the 7 round 4513TSW more accurately with that set up. I also shot the 7 round gun more accurately than I did the 6 round gun too. Overall. Maybe it was the full length grip frame and new rounded base pad. Maybe it was the slightly heavier weight of the gun. Maybe the larger grip and more diffitive palm swell on the new slip on grip made a difference. Dunno. I am just a shooter relating what the outcome was, for me. Regards 18DAI