Colt Revolver Question

[Rhetorician]

Hello to all:

I have a Colt New Police / Police Positive 32 cal "short colt" left to me by my dad. And I found a Police Positive 38 special as a "rent a cop" trade in at a local gun store. Both are in great shape and both are great range guns, fun to shoot and more accurate than I am. The 32 shoots an obsolete round but I would not shoot it much any way because of the sentimental value.

Here is my question: Why are these Colt's considered the "illegal step-child" at the family reunion? Not worth much when you can find them even if they are pristine. But all of the others, especially those with the "snake" moniker have seemingly gone priceless?

Opinions and observations when possible please.

rd

 

[clang444]

I believe the Colt PP was chambered in .32 New Police, which is the same as .32 S&W Long.

Colt also called their version of .38 S&W the .38 New Police.

 

[jesseatamez]

Answer

Seems to me it's supply and demand to an extent, but there is the marketing element in there too.

So small frame revolvers sold at a much faster pace than larger frames which means the larger frame guns are scarcer.

The other side is the marketing, a good example is the Colt Model 357 versus the Python, they are built on the same frame, same gun, same attention to detail, but most people aren't even aware of the "357" whereas you say the "P" word and people are willing to shell out thousands of dollars.

One other part worth mentioning is the caliber, obsolete or unpopular calibres always get shorted on value unless they are engraved or have unique providence.

In closing though, just remember what happened with S&W's, not that long ago you could buy 38/44's for pennies compared to 44's, now the 38/44's are collectors items in their own right. Give anything that is no longer in production time and it will continue to increase in value. Especially with the pool of well made older guns shrinking every day.

 

[VaTom]

Seems to me it's supply and demand to an extent, but there is the marketing element in there too.

So small frame revolvers sold at a much faster pace than larger frames which means the larger frame guns are scarcer.

The other side is the marketing, a good example is the Colt Model 357 versus the Python, they are built on the same frame, same gun, same attention to detail, but most people aren't even aware of the "357" whereas you say the "P" word and people are willing to shell out thousands of dollars.

One other part worth mentioning is the caliber, obsolete or unpopular calibres always get shorted on value unless they are engraved or have unique providence.

In closing though, just remember what happened with S&W's, not that long ago you could buy 38/44's for pennies compared to 44's, now the 38/44's are collectors items in their own right. Give anything that is no longer in production time and it will continue to increase in value. Especially with the pool of well made older guns shrinking every day.

Agree. The Colt Official Police as I understand it have the same internals as some of the higher price "snake guns". Colt made them from 1927-1969. The only Colt revolver I own is a 1956 Colt Official Police that I purchased at a local auction several years ago for less than $400. It is a 98% piece and clearly not a department carry revolver. It is a an excellent .38 and being a bit bigger frame than the K frame S&W it has less recoil. IMHO these will eventually rise in value. Some folks just don't think they are as "pretty" as the snake guns.

 

[DWalt]

"The Colt Official Police as I understand it have the same internals as some of the higher price "snake guns". Colt made them from 1927-1969."

Actually, the frame is from much earlier. The Colt "Army Special" from 1908 is essentially the same revolver as the Official Police, except for some minor cosmetic details and the name. The same frame, but having an internal firing pin, was used for the Colt .357 and the Python, also the later Colt .357 Trooper which replaced the .357.

The various Colt target revolvers, such as the Officers' Model Match and the Officers' Model Target, are also built on the same frame as that of the original Army Special.

It is correct that the Colt .357 is essentially the same gun as the Python, except for the shrouded barrel and vented rib. They used to be dirt cheap, despite the fact that there were fewer than 20,000 Colt .357s made, so they are much less common than the Python. I paid $225 for a near-perfect Colt .357 back in 1993 and it is my favorite revolver. A good Colt .357 revolver today will usually be priced in the $1000-$1500 range, still a lot less than the far more common Python. Some say that the Python is better fitted and finished than the Colt .357. To which I say "Bull Excrement." The Colt .357 was every bit as well finished and fitted as the Python, and in fact the .357 was the top of the Colt line before the Python appeared. The successor to the Colt .357 which was not so well finished was the Colt .357 Trooper, but those are pretty good guns too. I also have one of them, and like it almost as much as my Colt .357. The S&W analog to the Colt .357 vs. the Colt .357 Trooper is the Model 27 vs. the Model 28. One is a top-grade premium gun, the other is the more utilitarian version of the same gun, targeting mainly the law enforcement market.

 

[arjay]

It's worth collecting pristine examples of these,I think.The more glamorous models are at prices that younger,newer collectors can't afford and we've seen what's happened with S&W prices over the last ten years

 

[DWalt]

The PPs were made in .38 Colt New Police (.38 S&W), .32 New Police (.32 S&W Long), .32 Colt, .22 LR and .22 WRF. .32 Colt is a long obsolete caliber and is not interchangeable with the .32 S&W. As a shooter, anyone having a PP chambered in .32 Colt is out of luck. The PP Special is much the same, but with a longer cylinder to allow use of the .38 Special and .32-20. Oddly enough, some later PPSs were also chambered in .32 S&W Long. The Detective Special is basically a short-barreled PPS.

For a long time no one wanted the PP or PPS and they could be had very cheaply. I never understood why as they are sound, well-built revolvers. Back in the 1960s, I used to see them at gun shows priced in the $20-$30 range, I wish I had bought several hundred back then. At the local gun show last week, I came withing a hairbreadth of buying a very nice condition .38 PP for $295 but I didn't.

 

[reddog81]

The demand for these old guns just isn't that large. I'm sure it's a combination of the older and sometime obsolete rounds, these guns often saw hard use and many of the samples are well worn, and they were relatively common.

There are scare Colts from the same time frame and the are worth as much as the collectibles from other time frames.

That doesn't mean the are bad guns. I have a Police Positive .38 and it is a great shooting gun. It's got some finish wear, but the gun is tight and can shoot good enough to keep its own with any of the common snub nosed guns being made today.

 

[Muley Gil]

".32 New Police (.32 S&W)..."

The .32 New Police cartridge is actually the .32 S&W LONG with a flat point. Of course, the older and shorter .32 S&W will also chamber.

 

[harvester1]

Generally speaking the Colt fixed sighted guns sell for less, the smaller framed guns sell for less, and the obsolete or less powerful guns sell for less (not counting 22).This is in part because they were working guns but also because people like things with more features such as target hammers, target stocks etc. If it is a V spring Colt action it likely will hold value and appreciate.

 

[rburg]

Well, I could tell you fellas what I think of your opinions, but then the cabal of moderators would jump up and down on me. Wouldn't make my opinion less true.

I have a 32 long colt and its a great little toy. Yeah, the ammo is sort of difficult to find. Often its being sold by thieves, dressed up as a gun show vendor selling ammo. They taught me an important lesson. Never buy a box of short colt unless the crook will open the box and show you the head stamp. Most won't, and its your right to call them theives. They get sort of upset with you, but they deserve being called out.

OK, my little colt. Its an accurate and fun gun to shoot. Milder than even a 22. Maybe like a 22 shooting CB caps. It takes recoil out of the issue. If you flinch shooting one, you shouldn't be shooting at all. I've got a couple of boxes of ammo now. And some 32 S&W that were passed off on me before I became more aware. But that is on me because I was stupid and trusted the thieves.

So I don't make fun of the little 32 short and long colts. They have their place. Not really a reloadable round because I've not seen bullets. Might be capable of being cast, but its a heal style (think 22) and might involve more than I'm willing to try. So I'm keeping my little gun.

 

[DWalt]

".32 New Police (.32 S&W)..."

The .32 New Police cartridge is actually the .32 S&W LONG with a flat point. Of course, the older and shorter .32 S&W will also chamber.

Indeed it was. I also said earlier that the later PPSs were chambered in .38 S&W and .32 S&W Long. Checking my references, it does not appear that they were, only in .32 S&W Long/.32 NP. I changed my earlier posting to reflect that. I guess that makes as much sense as the small number of postwar S&W M&Ps also being chambered in .32 S&W Long. There were also postwar Colt Detective Specials chambered in both .32 NP/.32 S&W and .38 NP/.38 S&W. That was what I was thinking of earlier. One of my great regrets was from about 5 years ago when I walked away from a nice DS chambered in .38 S&W/.38 NP at a very good price. They are almost in the Hen's Teeth category.

 

[DWalt]

"So I don't make fun of the little 32 short and long colts. They have their place. Not really a reloadable round because I've not seen bullets."

Not only the bullets. There is no good candidate cartridge case capable of being reformed into a .32 Colt case. And reloading dies probably don't exist today, other than buying an expensive custom-made set.