Crack in barrel cone?
- Thread starter Kingsrow
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You’re going to need to find a replacement. The barrel is one piece.
Yep, needs replacing, but not a big project. What length is it?
Welcome to the Forum.
How did this happen? Were you shooting it at the time? What load were you firing?
How did this happen? Were you shooting it at the time? What load were you firing?
Do a search on Ebay for S&W barrel 19 and pick out the one you want. Unless you know what you are doing I recommend a GOOD REVOLVER SMITH do the switch
In looking closely at the picture, I do see evidence of forcing cone erosion and the outer edge of the erosion has completely covered the flat spot at the bottom of the barrel shank. My guess is this Model 19 has seen plenty of full power 125 grain loads during its life.
Correct me if I'm wrong but this the reason S&W developed the L-Frame.
That was one of the reasons and one of the reasons for the redesign of the K-frame 357's with the introduction of the 19-9 and 66-8.
As a mod 53, 22 Rem Jet, shooter I have learned to look for barrel erosion when buying a gun!
This is caused by unburnt powder leaving the brass as the bullet is moving into the barrel.
To the OP. From your picture, I can see barrel erosion on the breach face. After you replace the barrel or buy a new gun, I would suggest you reduce your powder charge and/or powder type!
jcelect
This is caused by unburnt powder leaving the brass as the bullet is moving into the barrel.
To the OP. From your picture, I can see barrel erosion on the breach face. After you replace the barrel or buy a new gun, I would suggest you reduce your powder charge and/or powder type!
jcelect
Exchipy
Member
If you’re the adventurous type, you can easily do it yourself:
While a J-Frame is shown in the photo, the process is ALMOST * exactly the same for a K-Frame. FYI, K-Frame barrels are threaded .540” x 36 tpi, so make sure you’re getting an actual K-Frame barrel for your M19, because J-, L-, and N-Frame threads are different diameters, though all are 36 tpi. The barrel length doesn’t matter, as you can easily substitute proper length ejector and center rods to match.
The way I’ve done it, with uncounted S&Ws, is:
With a pinned barrel, first punch out the pin.
Remove the cylinder, but return the crane back into the frame. That’s to fill the space for wrench support.
Pad the jaws of a sturdy bench vice with leather or heavy nylon belt material so that no part of the barrel can touch the jaws during the process.
Tightly clamp the barrel into the padded vice jaws from the right (to remove a barrel), or from the left (to install a barrel), so you’ll be pulling the wrench toward you. Be sure the barrel is positioned so that the front sight does not bear against the pad at any time during the process, as it can be bent (don’t ask me how I learned that).
Place a thinner leather or nylon strap over the front of the frame, from the top, where the barrel is threaded into the frame. Make sure the strap extends down both sides enough that the crescent wrench jaws cannot directly contact either the frame or the crane.
Resist the urge to put a length of board or similar tool through the cylinder window to use as a lever or worse, using the rear of the grip frame, instead of using a proper wrench at the front of the frame. S&W frames can be irreparably warped that way.
Place an appropriately sized crescent wrench over the padded section of the frame, snug down its adjustment (I position the wrench so its solid jaw is toward me) and start pulling. The barrel will rotate some toward you until its under barrel lug (forward ejector rod locking pin housing) makes hard contact with the pad. Then pull hard. A pipe over the wrench handle can offer additional leverage, if needed. Once it’s broken loose, the wrench will no longer be necessary. For tightening and indexing a barrel being installed, everything is reversed. It’ll take some trial and error to get the barrel indexed with the front sight pointing perfectly straight up. Try very hard not to tighten a barrel much beyond top dead center, more than maybe a degree or two (I’m told it’s bad juju).
* IMPORTANT: On K-Frames and Model 63s, there is a flat on the bottom of the barrel at the forcing cone to clear the crane. So, don’t unscrew the barrel more than a few degrees with the wrench or you’ll damage the crane. Initially break the barrel free with the wrench, then remove the crane before turning the barrel any further.
There are some other issues concerning how much torque can be applied to S&W K- and J-Frame .38/.357 barrels when tightening, to avoid warping the interior of the bore. A S&W barrel’s shoulder should allow hand tightening until just a few degrees before top dead center (maybe the 11:55 position), otherwise it may take too much torque to complete the tightening.
Oh, this is how the above-pictured 640 looks now, with its modified 3” 60-4 barrel installation completed:
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BoulderTroll
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If you’re the adventurous type, you can easily do it yourself:
You're leaving this to me in your will, right?
Such an awesome revolver!
Exchipy
Member
Thanks for the compliment. But, if you don’t wanna wait for me to kick the bucket, make for yourself exactly what you want. The hardest part is finding the right donor barrel. Then, just work slowly and patiently with grinder, file, emery cloth and steel bristle brush until it looks exactly the way you want it, always remembering that it’s much easier to remove more steel than to put it back.You're leaving this to me in your will, right?
Exchipy
Member
Fortunately, I had a spare 60-4 barrel, left over from this project:
5” Shilen with 1:14” twist
The method above is alright as long as you have the right punch (.050) a good vise and about a 14-16" crescent wrench AND the new barrel times correctly when it torques up. If the last part doesn't happen (its maybe a 50/50 shot) it means you either need some tools or a good file and the skills to use it correctly to set the shoulder of the barrel back square.
I use and actual frame wrench and a lathe to adjust the shoulder
I use and actual frame wrench and a lathe to adjust the shoulder
Exchipy
Member
Valve grinding paste works well to correct things, if the barrel tightens up just a bit too soon. However, if the barrel tightens up much past top dead center, steelslaver is correct: its shoulder must be trimmed back just a little less than 1/36th of an inch and the cylinder gap then adjusted accordingly.
Chrisj357
Member
The easiest fix is to have S&W cut your barrel down. They can cut a new forcing cone.
A few years ago I sent a M-19 to S&W for trigger work. They said the forcing cone was shot. Now my 4” is a 3 7/8” but it’s good as new. The repair wasn’t warranty so I had to pay but it was really reasonable.
a full turn is 1/36th or .0277777. If the barrel lines up 5 degrees early thats 1/72 of .027777 or just .00038. Which can be taken care of by a FLAT wipe of the face of the frame where the barrel threads in with a fine file. If it tightens up 5 degrees past, you can use a fine punch make a ring of punch marks around the ring where barrel threads in to displace a small amounts of material and cause it to tighten up. Everything else is a bigger problem.
Turning the barrel back a full turn gives you to opportunity to set the B/C gap perfectly and get rid of any forcing cone erosion. You also need to adjust center pin and ejector rod and slot for pin. I have found you often need to adjust center pin and rod even if you just replace the barrel
It is interesting just how often they do line up though.
Neither S&W or you can salvage that barrel. Thats way worse than an eroded forcing cone at this point. You would have to cut the shoulder and shroud back at least 3/8" or more re-thread, then cut the end completely off the ejector rod and knurl it. Not impossible to do, but way more effort to end up with an odd frame to barrel match up and cost way more than a good used 4" barrel
Turning the barrel back a full turn gives you to opportunity to set the B/C gap perfectly and get rid of any forcing cone erosion. You also need to adjust center pin and ejector rod and slot for pin. I have found you often need to adjust center pin and rod even if you just replace the barrel
It is interesting just how often they do line up though.
Neither S&W or you can salvage that barrel. Thats way worse than an eroded forcing cone at this point. You would have to cut the shoulder and shroud back at least 3/8" or more re-thread, then cut the end completely off the ejector rod and knurl it. Not impossible to do, but way more effort to end up with an odd frame to barrel match up and cost way more than a good used 4" barrel
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shil
Member
Ouch! Need for replacement barrel indicated! Factory no longer has any. Contact factory. Determine if they will install a barrel you provide. If yes, scour the ads for a replacement barrel and send gun and barrel to factory. That's what I would do. I've thought about this possibility since, decades ago, I cracked the forcing cone of my own Model 19. The factory took care of it with a replacement barrel, but the gun was still in production at the time. I've since "babied" my 19. I feel your pain.
For erosion that is not excessive, yes, the barrel can be milled and turned back a few turns and a new forcing cone surface cut. But for a cracked forcing cone, especially when the crack extends to the threaded portion of the shank, a new barrel is the only solution.
