Crimson Trace Lasergrips for 69xx, 39xx & CS9

[Hill_Country]

Lasers are one of those things that people seem to really like or really dislike. I really like them and one of my few complaints with the 3gen Smiths is the unavailability of a CT laser for anything except the 5900 series. Repeated inquiries to Crimson Trace convinced me that they had no intention of doing anything about it, so the thought of cutting down a 5900 CT laser to fit one of my compact frames has been kicking around my mind for a long time.

I chose to start with a 5900 CT laser on a 6906 because they are both double-stacks and I thought it would be a simple matter of cutting off the excess part of the grip and using the existing retention pin hole, but it didn't work out quite the way I expected. (Seems like few of my projects do. <G>) There are a few small differences in the 5900 and 6900 frame design - nothing big, but it wasn't a drop in, either. What I thought would be a simple weekend project has taken nearly two months, but I couldn't be happier with the results.

The 6906 has a good feel in my hand - seems solid compared to my CS9 or 908, except that the decocker on the 6906 is just a little awkward for me with the stock grips. The shape of the CT grip is very similar to the stock S&W grip, but it is just enough different somewhere that the decocker/safety lever just falls naturally under my thumb much as the single-stacks do - that was an unexpected benefit.

I haven't taken it to the range, yet, but the laser dot is just a hair right and below the iron sights at all ranges so I'm optimistic that it won't take much to get zeroed.

Here's a couple of photos - please excuse the dirt on the grips as it was getting hot in my shop and I wanted to get out of there. I'll try to get some more photos after I get to the range and get the grips cleaned up.

And, yes, I'm thinking of doing the same thing for the single-stacks, but that gets really complicated - it will be a while.

 

[Dot_mdb]

Very nice job.

Bill

 

[RufusG]

Very interesting. So was anything involved besides shortening and moving the screw?

 

[Hill_Country]

Very interesting. So was anything involved besides shortening and moving the screw?

It seemed like every time I'd solve one problem another would crop up.

Obviously, the CT grips use a plastic block with threaded inserts rather than a retention pin - the same system the Hogue grips use. Initially, I thought it would be simple to pick up the threaded insert - it wasn't. <G> And at two hundred bucks a pop, I didn't want to make to many mistakes.

The CT's also use a latch that engages the front of the internal grip opening - and requires miniature jewelers' tools to remove. And then there was the removal of the master switch and the need to fill that hole, the original retention screw holes and the gap in the butt.

After I got everything opened up inside the grip, I had to essentially bed it in epoxy since the original locating points had to be removed. Building a jig to precisely trim the butt - what I had originally thought would be the tough part - turned out to be pretty straightforward.

Overall, it was a thoroughly enjoyable project and I'm more than happy with the results. I really want to do one for a CS9, but that not only involves trimming on a second axis - both front and back - but I think the biggest hurdle is the ribbon cable across the front that will also have to be sectioned. I haven't figured out a workable way to splice that.

 

[RufusG]

Yep, that's definitely more involved than it looks, which is a testament to the good job you did.

CT is pretty good about sending out parts you need. I broke one of those blocks doing a simple install, and they had me a new one in two days. I don't know their policy on custom mods but I wouldn't be surprised if they'd work with you.

 

[Hill_Country]

CT is definitely a class operation. I called customer service a few days ago and asked to buy a couple of spare mainspring blocks to use for patterns. They wouldn't take any money and today a package showed up with half a dozen little baggies with the blocks I wanted plus grip screws, allen wrenches, cleaning swabs, etc. Nice to know that customer service is still alive somewhere.

As much as I like the 6906 with the laser, the CS9 is so much nicer to carry. So I started on the laser grips for the CS9 today. It went a little faster because I didn't have to experiment as I went along. The test will be cutting and splicing the front strap - I haven't done one of those before. Keep your fingers crossed.

 

[raven818]

Lasers are one of those things that people seem to really like or really dislike. I really like them and one of my few complaints with the 3gen Smiths is the unavailability of a CT laser for anything except the 5900 series. Repeated inquiries to Crimson Trace convinced me that they had no intention of doing anything about it, so the thought of cutting down a 5900 CT laser to fit one of my compact frames has been kicking around my mind for a long time.

I chose to start with a 5900 CT laser on a 6906 because they are both double-stacks and I thought it would be a simple matter of cutting off the excess part of the grip and using the existing retention pin hole, but it didn't work out quite the way I expected. (Seems like few of my projects do. <G>) There are a few small differences in the 5900 and 6900 frame design - nothing big, but it wasn't a drop in, either. What I thought would be a simple weekend project has taken nearly two months, but I couldn't be happier with the results.

The 6906 has a good feel in my hand - seems solid compared to my CS9 or 908, except that the decocker on the 6906 is just a little awkward for me with the stock grips. The shape of the CT grip is very similar to the stock S&W grip, but it is just enough different somewhere that the decocker/safety lever just falls naturally under my thumb much as the single-stacks do - that was an unexpected benefit.

I haven't taken it to the range, yet, but the laser dot is just a hair right and below the iron sights at all ranges so I'm optimistic that it won't take much to get zeroed.

Here's a couple of photos - please excuse the dirt on the grips as it was getting hot in my shop and I wanted to get out of there. I'll try to get some more photos after I get to the range and get the grips cleaned up.

And, yes, I'm thinking of doing the same thing for the single-stacks, but that gets really complicated - it will be a while.

I can't say how many posts you've read regarding 6906's, but there's a HUGE demand at this site for laser grips for it. And a lot of disappointment at not being able to find any.

Might want to give some thought to the demand. Probably would be worth more than a few bucks to you. And I could be counted in.

 

[Hill_Country]

I can't say how many posts you've read regarding 6906's, but there's a HUGE demand at this site for laser grips for it. And a lot of disappointment at not being able to find any.

Might want to give some thought to the demand. Probably would be worth more than a few bucks to you. And I could be counted in.

Tell ME about the disappointment (and frustration) about not being able to find any. <G>

If there's really demand, we'll work something out to produce some more. I'm a firm believer in handgun lasers and this really ices the cake for my preferred carry weapons - makes a really nice enhancement to a fine pistol.

At this point, though, I don't know how profitable it might be as I don't have a handle on how many hours it will take to do the mod. I have the jigs set up and know what has to be done so that's half the battle and it would be a shame not to put it all to use.

The 69xx (and equivalent 40xx) laser grips are a done deal if anyone wants a copy (at least after I finish the current CS9 project). I spent all day Saturday and Sunday in the shop working on the CS9 prototype and they are going to take a couple more weekends to get right.

If anyone else is interested in a laser grip for a compact or CS frame in 9 or 40 cal., I'd appreciate a PM just to get a handle on demand. No obligation as I really don't know what all would be involved or what the cost might be, but with enough quantity I might be able to get a better deal on the stock grips and reduce the price a bit when we figure out what it is.

Best,

John

 

[raven818]

Could you show a photo of what the bottom of the finished grips on your modification looks like?

 

[Hill_Country]

Sure. Be glad to post more pictures when I get it all back together - if I ever finish tinkering.

I pulled them off this weekend to play with the filler in the butt area. I have it filled with a rubber compound and I wasn't satisfied with it as it wasn't firm against the frame of the weapon. The rubber compound matches the texture of the rest of the grip, but I may take it all out and fill it with a hard black epoxy which will give a slicker finish.

Any preference as to how the butt is finished? This is definitely a work in progress and I can tweak the details. I cut the grip about 1/32 short of the bottom of the frame to insure there wouldn't be any mag interference, but it can be cut flush, too.

One advantage of filling with epoxy is that the old grip screw holes and a small area where the master switch was could also be filled with this and checkered to match the rest of the grip. The rubber compound is to soft to checker, but is not very noticeable because it is the same color and texture.

Best,

John

 

[raven818]

Any preference as to how the butt is finished?

Since anyone having a LG for their 6906 would be a happy camper, hopefully it would have the appearance, all around, that one would be proud to " show off " as custom made.

EDIT: Ya think Crimson Trace would have any problem with you using their grips ( copyright )? Just an after thought.

 

[Leo77]

CT Grip

I just sent you a PM.
I would like to do the same thing and speak with someone who has done it, very nice job by the way.
If we had enough people call Crimson Trace to tell them to design more Laser Grips for the 3rd Generation semi-autos they might rethink it if they see that their is a demand for them!!
Leo77

 

[raven818]

Go Here

I created this post JUST for contacting them..YESTERDAY. Go there and then contact them thru the link on the OP.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-...s/209831-6906-laser-optics-optics-planet.html

 

[jkwhaley]

Holy Cow!

John, this is the very reason I just joined the S&W forum!

I wanted to see if anyone had a line on laser sights for a 6906!

My old duty revolver is a Model 13, but for CCW it's a bit much.

I picked up a NIB 6906 for $400, and while I might have done better on the price elsewhere, it fits my medium sized hands perfectly and I'm happy, especially with the extended magazine to wrap my pinky around.

Only thing missing is a laser grip.

I'm definitely following this thread with great interest.

Best regards...

...James

 

[Hill_Country]

Time for the weekly update. Some bad news, mostly good, though.

The bad news is that I've come to the conclusion that the CT grips can't be modified to fit the CS9/CS40 - there just isn't enough "meat" for the retention screw to hold on to. I was afraid, too, that I might interfere with the mainspring if I got to creative.

But the good news is that the CT grip not only works well on my 908, but I actually stumbled on a more elegant solution to adapting to the thinner frame and what I thought would require cutting and splicing the front strap (which I was dreading having to do). To be honest, I thought I had screwed up big time, but in "fixing" the screw up, I found that it pulled the front strap tight. Pure luck, zero genius on my part. <G>

When I was all done, the laser hit the POA of the iron sights on the other side of the garage and that was my goal. I still need some real world experience with them, but based on just one test mag fired, they held their zero and nothing broke. So I think I can make the statement that the CT LG359 (the model for the 5900 series) can be modified to fit the 3900 and 6900 series (and the equivalent 40 series frames). FWIW, the mods seemed to improve both the 6906 and 908 grips slightly for my hand size. The 6906 decocker was just a little awkward for me, but is in the perfect position for my thumb now. The 908 stocks now fill my hand better. Very subtle changes, but definitely for the better for me. YMMV.

There are a couple of cosmetic things I'm still working on, though. There are a couple of holes for the original retention screw holes and the master switch which have to be filled. I prefer a soft rubber compound, but I can't checker that to match the rest of the grip. I can go to a harder compound which I can checker, but it will still be visible. Same thing on the butt where the gap needs to be filled. I have the soft compound in both places, now, simply because I don't have to worry about it being brittle and cracking if hit on something. I'm sure I'll get some feedback when (if ever) I quit tweaking them and get some photos posted.

Appearance wise, I'm not happy with the interior, either. It is functional, but because I tried a number of different approaches to some problems it doesn't have a well finished inside. No one can see it, but I know. Right now, I can't justify trashing these just on appearance, but I might do something.

There was enough material on the 6906 that I could counter bore the retention screw hole as deeply as the stock hole. This allowed me to install some nice black Torx head screws. (I detest slotted screws on gun stocks.) However, on the 908 I was so far to the rear of the grip that I couldn't counter bore it as deeply and one half of the screw head protrudes slightly. To compensate I switched to a pan head screw with a lower profile which protrudes less (but still protrudes slightly at the rear). I can't feel the screwhead in my hand, but it bugs me to know it is there. Anyone know if it is possible to find a Torx or hex head in a low profile like a pan head?

Pictures when I'm satisfied with the cosmetics, but I can report that it is definitely doable to install the CT grips on the single and double-stack compact frames in 9 and 40 cal. I haven't given up on the sub-compact CS series, but it will require a different approach to retaining the grips.

Best,

John

 

[Hill_Country]

John, this is the very reason I just joined the S&W forum!

I wanted to see if anyone had a line on laser sights for a 6906!

...James

James, welcome to the forum. Hope you enjoy it here as much as I do.

Your timing is about right. I had considered using the 5900 laser grip for several years, but wasn't anxious to spend a couple of hundred bucks to experiment. I called and emailed CT several times and they finally convinced me that it was unlikely that they would develop a new model for an out-of-production pistol.

Curiosity finally got the better of me and I had to try it - I even bought a trade-in 6906 just for the project. Even if the laser mod had not worked, I'm happy I had a excuse to make that purchase.

I'll do my best to get some photos posted soon and all feedback will be appreciated.

Best,

John

 

[raven818]

Looks like you're into it feet-first. Good luck. Either way, it's great to have a project ( assuming you remember to write your family once in a while ).

 

[Hill_Country]

Looks like you're into it feet-first. Good luck. Either way, it's great to have a project ( assuming you remember to write your family once in a while ).

I'm not sure if my wife is the understanding type or really wants me out of the house. She brought me a sandwich in the garage, today. <G>

Really relieved to solve the "single-stack" problem, but disappointed the CS9 won't work (yet).

Best,

John

 

[Hill_Country]

CT Laser Grip Pictures 6906 and 908

I decided I had to stop tweaking the cosmetics on these grips before I screwed them up.

Pardon the dust on them - I just wiped them down, but the camera seems to attract dust to them.

 

[Hill_Country]

And two more photos.