Dallas sniper used "armor piercing" bullets

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Ranger514

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I just finished watch the CBS Evening News where the anchor, Scott Whatever, pushed a story about the shooter in Dallas using armor piercing bullets, and then went on to get the "expert opinion" of VP Biden :rolleyes: who says he and Obama want to eliminate "armor piercing" bullets.

So please edumacate me, cuz with the type of body armor I wore and most officers I knew wore, just about any spitzer bullet fired from a rifle would pierce a trauma plate as well as the kevlar vests we wore. Hell, some higher power handgun rounds will pierce Level IIA Body Armor.

Has anyone heard any unbiased, factual reports of "armor piercing" rounds used by the shooter in Dallas before this report? As far as I can tell it's just more media hype and misinformation for the anti-gun agenda they support.
 
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Donn said:
Sniper used an SKS. A lot of 7.62x39 rounds are steel core. They will penetrate most body armor, car doors, backstops at indoor ranges and the like. So will green tip, 62 grain 5.56. Will it damage an Abrams tank? No, but I suppose the former qualifies as armor piercing to the MSM.
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+1

The steel core in that Russian ammo is very damaging to backstops, and vests. By default, most x39 is armor-piercing due to the steel core.
 
Like most news reports, things are a bit confused. It seems fairly clear that he did not use an AR-15. Most recent reports, though, are now indicating he used a Saiga variant of an AK-74. That means caliber would have been 5.45x39. Most of the Russian ammo in that caliber is also steel-core and will penetrate about like the M855. I thought the media had been very slow to report the type of weapon he used as they are usually on that right away. Maybe the fact that it wasn't an AR had something to do with that.
 
Wyo said:
Most recent reports, though, are now indicating he used a Saiga variant of an AK-74. That means caliber would have been 5.45x39. Most of the Russian ammo in that caliber is also steel-core and will penetrate about like the M85. Maybe the fact that it wasn't an AR had something to do with that.
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That's what the photo shows, with a silver colored scope. Thanks for correcting that. I always thought the 5.45X39 was lead core with an "air space" in the nose to enhance lethality not penetration. Learning as it unfolds, unlike the "Orlando Incident" which has almost never happened. Joe
 
Wyo said:
Like most news reports, things are a bit confused. It seems fairly clear that he did not use an AR-15. Most recent reports, though, are now indicating he used a Saiga variant of an AK-74. That means caliber would have been 5.45x39. Most of the Russian ammo in that caliber is also steel-core and will penetrate about like the M855. I thought the media had been very slow to report the type of weapon he used as they are usually on that right away. Maybe the fact that it wasn't an AR had something to do with that.
Click to expand...


Very few in the media know anything about guns, except that they're all evil. But they do know proofreading.

Maybe they saw a report that the guy had an AK-74. Never having heard of this later Russian rifle, some probably thought that "AK-47" had had the numbers mistyped and failed to report on it while they checked spelling.

I saw a photo of the actual rifle today on another board. I think the idea that it's a Saiga AK-74 variant is correct. The rifle was seemingly still in good shape, not ruined by the explosion that ended the thug's life. It was on a heap of debris cleaned up in the garage where he died.
 
According to the talking heads on TV and radio, any round
that that has a Hollow point is a cop killer bullet.....

Let that sink in.

It was more than likely just FMJ rounds the shooter used.
Most of the cheap Steel core FMJ out of any AK is going to go thru vests at close enough ranges.

Just remember the source of the ballistic info you get on TV.


Chuck
 
chud333 said:
According to the talking heads on TV and radio, any round
that that has a Hollow point is a cop killer bullet.....

Let that sink in.
Click to expand...



That was my first thought when I saw the title of this thread.

Sadly, they were "cop-killer bullets", irregardless of their AP capabilities.

It's just like my old shooting buddy said when the media discovered the term "assault rifle."

"What's the definition of an assault rifle? A rifle used in an assault."
 
adwjc said:
Expert opinion(on firearms) and VP Biden are mutually exclusive.



Remember his advice on double barrel shotguns for home defense? Letting a few go off the veranda?
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My fav was how FDR went on TV to reassure citizens during the depression.
 
What we have to remember is the gun grabbers' assault on our gun rights is multifaceted. It doesn't matter to them that their arguments lack merit and are simply feel good proposals. Any rifle round is armor piercing when used against the ballistic vests issued to our law enforcement officers. They'll take any gun control they can, however, be it gun bans or ammunition bans.

What I find interesting is that the gun grabbers old campaign to ban handguns was what pushed many to gravitate to long guns when considering self/home defense firearms. Fighting gun grabbers is like a rousing game of Whack A Mole, you never know where they'll pop up next.
 
vonn said:
Control the bullets and the guns are useless! They have attempted to outlaw surplus ammo before and are hoping that they can slip through some back door gun control before they get organized opposition. Contact your politicians in Washington and put the heat on them asap.
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I understand that some nations, like Spain and Portugal, limit the amount of handgun ammo that one can buy in a year. I think the limit is 25 rounds, a common Euro packaging per box.

The idea is that that's enough to deal with a burglar, but not enough to get involved in a revolution. They worry about revolutions in some countries.

I wouldn't be surprised if some South American countries have similar laws. Some, like Mexico and Brazil, limit civilian revolvers to no more power than .38 Special. (In Brazil, a costly collectors' license allows owning guns banned for the general public.)
 
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Wyo said:
Like most news reports, things are a bit confused. It seems fairly clear that he did not use an AR-15. Most recent reports, though, are now indicating he used a Saiga variant of an AK-74. That means caliber would have been 5.45x39. Most of the Russian ammo in that caliber is also steel-core and will penetrate about like the M855. I thought the media had been very slow to report the type of weapon he used as they are usually on that right away. Maybe the fact that it wasn't an AR had something to do with that.
Click to expand...

After I read this , I looked around the the web, and 5.45x39 is pretty much unobtainium. And if you find it, it is pretty much too expensive to practice with. The perp, was not wealthy from what they say, I am just thinking his weapon was more likely a 7.62x39. Not that it matters at all now.
 
Donn said:
Sniper used an SKS. A lot of 7.62x39 rounds are steel core. They will penetrate most body armor, car doors, backstops at indoor ranges and the like. So will green tip, 62 grain 5.56. Will it damage an Abrams tank? No, but I suppose the former qualifies as armor piercing to the MSM.
Click to expand...

Well, darn. And to think I've been stacking deep all the M67 Yugo x39 because it's steel free.
 
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