"Dealer Prep" Charges / New Cars
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Andy Griffith
Member
I think I would check around if they are trying to pull that one.
Of course, since the government put lots of new car dealers out of business, there are fewer places out there trying to undercut each other.
Don't get in a rush. However, if you are, I've got a nice used K-car that has been modified by Red Green customs.
Of course, since the government put lots of new car dealers out of business, there are fewer places out there trying to undercut each other.
Don't get in a rush. However, if you are, I've got a nice used K-car that has been modified by Red Green customs.
snowman
Member
I've got a nice used K-car that has been modified by Red Green customs.
AWD and 4-wheel steer, right?
John,
I've not heard of this, since I don't buy new, but it sounds rather shady to me. If they tried to pull that on me, I would do my best to ruin their day.
Andy
In my part of Florida that is a popular "Rip-Off".
When you purchase "NEW" it should not have to be cleaned up..
Wonder why that never caught on with gun dealers?
When you purchase "NEW" it should not have to be cleaned up..
Wonder why that never caught on with gun dealers?
LVSteve
Member
Back when Vegas was booming, certain stealerships here were even less subtle. They had a $2500 "local market adjustment" on anything that cost over $20k. None of them got my business. Most still have a $400 "doc fee".
firearmsunlimited
Member
In Phoenix and Tucson they try to pull an add-on fee ranging from $600 to $1200 for what they call the "desert protection package." It consists of window tint and some snake oil paint protectrant. I never paid for it and never will. My position is that I didn't order it, don't want it so politely tell them that they can peal off the window tint and rub out the snake oil. Of course they never peal off the window tint and the snake oil just does not re-enter the conversation.
As it relates to "dealer prep" it was my understanding that was something that the dealer was reimbursed for by the manufacturer. Sounds like a little double dipping.
As it relates to "dealer prep" it was my understanding that was something that the dealer was reimbursed for by the manufacturer. Sounds like a little double dipping.
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OIF2
Member
I always refused to pay it; it's negotiable.
Bob
Bob
amazingflapjack
US Veteran
I would try the used market. I would look at ebay motors to get educated, not just on how much to pay, but what is available. Many dealers never get the complete line of a given manufacturer. As a rule of thumb. I would set out to find the newest, nicest model of exactly what I wanted, and be prepared to pay the top dollar used price, and deal with private owners only. Make a good offer based on what you've learned, after driving it, and don't be shy about walking away if you can't get a reasnable deal. There are more out there. A good deal is one where everyone walks away satisfied. Right now, there should be many near new cars for sale due to the economy, and south florida shouldn't be an exception in that. I always apply Proverbs 3: 5-6. Flapjack.
Anything can be negotiated. I am very familiar with Harley dealerships since I am a mechanic. A lot of it is luck. Some customers think if they have cash, that they can negotiate anything. Not true, dealerships hate cash customers, they want you to take a loan. You get quoted for the loan, and the dealership gets kicked back a couple of points. IE they do your credit and charge you 6%, the dealer is getting 2% out of it.If the dealer had a bad week or month, they may, out of desperation cut a deal for cash. So don't assume cash is king, you have to luck out and catch them at the right moment.
The end of the month is a good time, the end of the model year is good time and for motorcycles, the off season is a good time. Also take note if they have a large amount of that particular model, they want to get rid of them. They tend to not deal on "hot sellers"
Shop around and get the best price, but don't jerk them. They know what that other dealer 10 miles away does to sell the product. My dealer used to try to sell at msrp, we knew a dealer 50 miles away who would right away offer $1500 off. So it would be foolish to tell the dealer I work for that the other place offered 2k off. Dealers have that wiseguy mentality, where if you push them too far, they won't even try to sell you a car.
Never, ever tell a dealer how much you want your monthly payments to be, tell them how much you want to pay for the car. You can take a particular model, tell them you want to pay $250 a month and they will play with the length of loan and fit you into $250 a month, playing with numbers. If you had just walked off the street and not even haggled, your payment might have been $200 a month.
Go on the manufacturers website find out how much the model you want, with the desired options is. You can go to an internet site and find out how much your monthly amount would be, if you pay msrp and you know what your credit score is. Once you apply for a loan, it is a slight hit on your credit score, but if you end up not buying and go somewhere else within a month I believe, there will not be a further hit.
Don't go in being a hard nose and unpleasant, the salesman won't deal with you and blow you off. Salesman work on commission. Say you want a mustang in black, but they dont have any, tell them nicely you will be able accept the undesireable red color, for 1k off. Even preface it with "I don't want to insult you, but it isn't exactly what I want, if I can get that one for say $500 less, I will take it. If not I will find another dealer with it.
If the dealer is local, has a good rep, sometimes it doesn't pay to hit them over the head. If you will need them for service be willing to meet them half way on negotiation. For example, "good" customers who did not beat you up got better treatment. They might make a non warrantee item warranteable, saving you $$$$.For example, one time a French-Canadian guy had his motorcycle with a trailer (attached to the bike) towed in. He blew his motor, primary and tranny. (his compensator bolt loosened up, probably from hard downshifting, locking the primary up) At least 15k in damage. He was demanding and nasty, in a foreign Country, NJ USA. Right in the Harley owner's manual it states not to attach a trailer. He was under warranty. He irked the service manager and the mgr told warranty he was pulling a trailer. They immediately voided his warranty. He was out 15k and had to have it towed to Canada. The warranty voidance was put into the computer, even in Canada, he will have to pay out of pocket. Unfortunately, if he was a decent guy, we would have removed the trailer, not mentioned it and he would have had it fixed with a $50 deductable. My dealer would have made $$$$$$$$ but they were so pissed at this guy they threw the money away.
Good luck with the hunt.
The end of the month is a good time, the end of the model year is good time and for motorcycles, the off season is a good time. Also take note if they have a large amount of that particular model, they want to get rid of them. They tend to not deal on "hot sellers"
Shop around and get the best price, but don't jerk them. They know what that other dealer 10 miles away does to sell the product. My dealer used to try to sell at msrp, we knew a dealer 50 miles away who would right away offer $1500 off. So it would be foolish to tell the dealer I work for that the other place offered 2k off. Dealers have that wiseguy mentality, where if you push them too far, they won't even try to sell you a car.
Never, ever tell a dealer how much you want your monthly payments to be, tell them how much you want to pay for the car. You can take a particular model, tell them you want to pay $250 a month and they will play with the length of loan and fit you into $250 a month, playing with numbers. If you had just walked off the street and not even haggled, your payment might have been $200 a month.
Go on the manufacturers website find out how much the model you want, with the desired options is. You can go to an internet site and find out how much your monthly amount would be, if you pay msrp and you know what your credit score is. Once you apply for a loan, it is a slight hit on your credit score, but if you end up not buying and go somewhere else within a month I believe, there will not be a further hit.
Don't go in being a hard nose and unpleasant, the salesman won't deal with you and blow you off. Salesman work on commission. Say you want a mustang in black, but they dont have any, tell them nicely you will be able accept the undesireable red color, for 1k off. Even preface it with "I don't want to insult you, but it isn't exactly what I want, if I can get that one for say $500 less, I will take it. If not I will find another dealer with it.
If the dealer is local, has a good rep, sometimes it doesn't pay to hit them over the head. If you will need them for service be willing to meet them half way on negotiation. For example, "good" customers who did not beat you up got better treatment. They might make a non warrantee item warranteable, saving you $$$$.For example, one time a French-Canadian guy had his motorcycle with a trailer (attached to the bike) towed in. He blew his motor, primary and tranny. (his compensator bolt loosened up, probably from hard downshifting, locking the primary up) At least 15k in damage. He was demanding and nasty, in a foreign Country, NJ USA. Right in the Harley owner's manual it states not to attach a trailer. He was under warranty. He irked the service manager and the mgr told warranty he was pulling a trailer. They immediately voided his warranty. He was out 15k and had to have it towed to Canada. The warranty voidance was put into the computer, even in Canada, he will have to pay out of pocket. Unfortunately, if he was a decent guy, we would have removed the trailer, not mentioned it and he would have had it fixed with a $50 deductable. My dealer would have made $$$$$$$$ but they were so pissed at this guy they threw the money away.
Good luck with the hunt.
Engineer's way
This has worked twice for me in the last 5 years. SHOP the dealer lots and the Internet to find out what is in the market versus what you want. Use Edmonds or whoever to get cost figures on the vehicle you want.
Be ready to buy the LAST BUSINESS DAY OF THE MONTH and have a finance plan in your back pocket from your bank or credit union. You will pay Dealer Invoice price + title fee + sales tax - current rebates PERIOD. There is no added Prep Fee or Document Fee or Paint Protector. You want a wheel alignment included because that is part of the Prep Fee the dealer receives from the factory. The wheel alignment is close but not correct. You don't want to buy new tires in 6,000 miles because steel belts are showing on 2 tire shoulders and the other 2 are badly worn. Accept their financing if it is competitive to what you have from your bank.
If the dealer won't sell at this price, thank the saleman, express appreciation for the sales manager's time, and walk out the door politely. You will probably not get back to your car, before somebody says yes.
I did this on a used car. Price went from $13 K + tax down to $10,700 including tax and a wheel alignment with a copy of the computer printout for me. I had my own financing. I started talking before Thanksgiving and bought the car Valentine's Day at my original price. Patience, cars are wants not needs.
This has worked twice for me in the last 5 years. SHOP the dealer lots and the Internet to find out what is in the market versus what you want. Use Edmonds or whoever to get cost figures on the vehicle you want.
Be ready to buy the LAST BUSINESS DAY OF THE MONTH and have a finance plan in your back pocket from your bank or credit union. You will pay Dealer Invoice price + title fee + sales tax - current rebates PERIOD. There is no added Prep Fee or Document Fee or Paint Protector. You want a wheel alignment included because that is part of the Prep Fee the dealer receives from the factory. The wheel alignment is close but not correct. You don't want to buy new tires in 6,000 miles because steel belts are showing on 2 tire shoulders and the other 2 are badly worn. Accept their financing if it is competitive to what you have from your bank.
If the dealer won't sell at this price, thank the saleman, express appreciation for the sales manager's time, and walk out the door politely. You will probably not get back to your car, before somebody says yes.
I did this on a used car. Price went from $13 K + tax down to $10,700 including tax and a wheel alignment with a copy of the computer printout for me. I had my own financing. I started talking before Thanksgiving and bought the car Valentine's Day at my original price. Patience, cars are wants not needs.
This has worked twice for me in the last 5 years. SHOP the dealer lots and the Internet to find out what is in the market versus what you want. Use Edmonds or whoever to get cost figures on the vehicle you want.
Be ready to buy the LAST BUSINESS DAY OF THE MONTH and have a finance plan in your back pocket from your bank or credit union. You will pay Dealer Invoice price + title fee + sales tax - current rebates PERIOD. There is no added Prep Fee or Document Fee or Paint Protector. You want a wheel alignment included because that is part of the Prep Fee the dealer receives from the factory. The wheel alignment is close but not correct. You don't want to buy new tires in 6,000 miles because steel belts are showing on 2 tire shoulders and the other 2 are badly worn. Accept their financing if it is competitive to what you have from your bank.
If the dealer won't sell at this price, thank the saleman, express appreciation for the sales manager's time, and walk out the door politely. You will probably not get back to your car, before somebody says yes.
I did this on a used car. Price went from $13 K + tax down to $10,700 including tax and a wheel alignment with a copy of the computer printout for me. I had my own financing. I started talking before Thanksgiving and bought the car Valentine's Day at my original price. Patience, cars are wants not needs.
Great advice.
longranger
Member
"Dealer Prep" and "destination chages" I did not order the car on your lot,I did not ask you to add things to the vehicle.Additional stuff should be requested by the purchaser not some arbitrary moron on a car lot.It's a deal breaker for me if it is not taken off the price of the car.
DISTRACT THE BUYER with Dealer Prep & Dubious Detailing -
Dealer Prep and Dubious Detailing are visible but negotiable charges. Dubious Detailing is my term for $500 Fabric Protection for using $10 worth of fabric spray / $400 Trim for using $3 of striping tape / etc.
These charges will be deleted if and ONLY IF the potential buyer protests.
IF buyer protests and get the above listed $500 + $400 removed he will think "I saved $900, and be less likely to continue negotiating for more discount from the "sticker price".
Let the buyer WIN a useless victory.
I once asked a sales manager if the documentation charges were set in stone. "YES, they are." I asked to see the stone, as I got up to leave.
Bekeart
Dealer Prep and Dubious Detailing are visible but negotiable charges. Dubious Detailing is my term for $500 Fabric Protection for using $10 worth of fabric spray / $400 Trim for using $3 of striping tape / etc.
These charges will be deleted if and ONLY IF the potential buyer protests.
IF buyer protests and get the above listed $500 + $400 removed he will think "I saved $900, and be less likely to continue negotiating for more discount from the "sticker price".
Let the buyer WIN a useless victory.
I once asked a sales manager if the documentation charges were set in stone. "YES, they are." I asked to see the stone, as I got up to leave.
Bekeart
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captorquewrench
Member
Last time I bought a car I looked for one on the lot without any dealer add ons. They asked me what I was looking for. I said one without a bunch of **** I didn't ask you to put on it. They tried to tell me I needed the window tint for safety ,I showed my sunglasses. Then they started with the cooling factor. I said it's houston, if I don't die initially from the heat another 30 seconds warmer than I like will be fine. Scotch guard--you have kids--everything was something about why I "needed" what they had put on it. I said it's simple. I didn't want it, I didn't ask for it, take it off. "we can't do that" so don't charge me for it.
What ended up happening was I drive their loaded model for a week for nothing while my no extras was being delivered at no extra charge.
I follow a plan very similar to Engineers, with the exception of--and this is ridiculous-a finance plan from my credit union. They just can't beat who I've had my last two auto loans and nonsecured student loans with, so I go with them.
If it's vaguely described or put on at the dealer or includes "dealer" in the itemization wording, it's negotiable.
A salesman tried to tell me it wasn't. I told him to "get off drugs" and was halfway to my car when they came chasing me down. I stayed for another hour and let them buy me lunch, but I didn't buy their car. If you are going to play stupid woman with me, I'm not buying from you and I WILL make YOU pay.
What ended up happening was I drive their loaded model for a week for nothing while my no extras was being delivered at no extra charge.
I follow a plan very similar to Engineers, with the exception of--and this is ridiculous-a finance plan from my credit union. They just can't beat who I've had my last two auto loans and nonsecured student loans with, so I go with them.
If it's vaguely described or put on at the dealer or includes "dealer" in the itemization wording, it's negotiable.
A salesman tried to tell me it wasn't. I told him to "get off drugs" and was halfway to my car when they came chasing me down. I stayed for another hour and let them buy me lunch, but I didn't buy their car. If you are going to play stupid woman with me, I'm not buying from you and I WILL make YOU pay.
geoff40
Member
When I was involved in the car business, the factory paid the dealership only half an hours labor for the time it took a mechanic to prep the car. They'd check the whole thing over, road test it, and often install regional package items. Then the car would go to the conditioning dept. For a thorough wash and vacuuming, etc. By the books they lost money prepping a car. So I guess it's all about recovering some or all of those fees. More than a few hundred would likely be entering the gouging state. As others have said, with good negotiating it should be eliminated.
Armyphotog
Member
That charge is susposedly to prepare the car for "sale", like they aren't going to do that to sell them, anyway. I tell them it's a cost of doing business. If they don't like it, I go elsewhere.
Is this what they mean by south Florida hell?
Sir if I may, if your not dead set on brand new, check out CARMAX. First off let me say, neither I or anyone in my family are affiliated with the company. 2 reasons I'll give, one is economics, let the person who simply must have brand new take the " depreciation loss " instead of you. I'm sure youve heard, drive a new car off the lot and lose 20% just like that. Second, the CARMAX I have dealt with, Clearwater Florida, were so excellent I cant explain. There is NO-HAGGLE prices, the price is the price, you can buy 20 cars, the price is the price. You have several days to bring it back if you dont like it. What really got to me was the repair area. I haven't been to a Doctors office in the past 10 years that was that clean. All full A.S.E. certified mechanics too. You will never meet anyone who despises New car Dealers and thier " tactics ", more than I. So my Hot Rods are always 1962 and older, and my pre-owned daily driver vehicles always come from CARMAX, thank you, 26
truckemup97
Member
Negotiate your best deal, and when they try to tack on Doc fees or dealer prep, get up and walk out. If they ask why, tell them you don't deal with people who don't live up to their end of the bargain. You agreed to a price, then they changed it, so you're taking your business somewhere else. The fees have always disappeared for me, or in one case, the sale price was dropped by the amount of the "state required documentary fee."
LVSteve
Member
Ahh, so this explains why the nearly $40k truck I bought in 2001 had out-of-spec toe in, castor and camber on the front suspension resulting in near zero stability in a straight line. No wonder the big auto companies and their dealers employ so many lawyers.
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