Debit Card Cloning & Fraud

[kwselke]

I now feel up to writing about this hacking of one of my bank accounts prior to Hurricane Harvey striking Texas. This occurred to my credit union checking account. I have other accounts at the credit union as well as accounts at a large commercial bank.

A Visa Debit Card is connected to the savings and check accounts at the credit union. The card is equipped with the EMV encryption chip. I use it as an ATM card to get cash, and use cash or a credit card for transactions.

Prepping for the imminent landfall of Hurricane Harvey, about 2:30 PM on 8/23/17 I went to a neighborhood pharmacy to use their fee free ATM to get some extra cash. I logged into the ATM and tried to make a cash withdrawal. This was the first time since 8/1/17 that I had used the debit card. The machine replied that it was unable to dispense cash at that time. I thought nothing of it. The following morning (8/24/17) I routed my normal morning walk to include a branch of my credit union and got cash there at their 24 hour ATM. I was away from home until lunchtime and then I found a message on my answering machine from my credit union asking to call about the possible fraudulent use of my debit card.

I called the number left and got an automated system which asked me to confirm that I had made a $203.95 declined ATM withdrawal at 7:30 AM from a Valero Corner Store that morning. I pressed the number 2, for NOT ME! The machine replied with, your debit card ending in #### has been restricted, please contact Customer Service at 800-###-####.

I think, uh oh! If they rejected a $200 withdrawal maybe there are others. I logged into my account online and sure enough there was my withdrawal at 5:30 that morning followed by a withdrawal of $403.95, then a withdrawal of $303.95, and the third fraudulent attempt was rejected.

I called the 800 number and talked to them. The nice lady said that I could file a claim online and pick up a new card at a branch tomorrow or next week. I said, you must be in a call center somewhere outside of southeast Texas? She said, that's right I'm in Michigan. I said there is a hurricane coming and it may be a week or two before I can get out or the branches around here open again.

So, off I go to my local credit union branch. The manager there was wonderful. I told her my story, showed my ID, gave her a printout of my checking account and said... this one this morning was me, these other two today off Wilcrest Dr. are not me. I handed over the one and only legitimate debit card ending in ####, straight out of my wallet. She said... wow, this was not lost or stolen, it was cloned. I said, and they got my PIN which is not written down anywhere.

I swore an affidavit to the two fraudulent withdrawals. A new Visa debit card was immediately issued to me. Harvey hit on Friday 8/25/17. The stolen funds were restored to my account on Monday 8/28/17.

I talked to a cousin who knows a great deal about these issues and who works for a major bank dealing with them. The EMV encryption chip on a credit/debit card cannot be cloned. The magnetic stripe on the EMV card can be cloned. Coded on the stripe is a message that this is a chip card, which should force the card reader to require the insertion of the chip to complete the transaction if the machine is EMV capable. I find it hard to believe that anyone is still using magnetic strip technology. As my cousin pointed out, the owner of an ATM that did not have EMV chip capability generally has to pay the bill for fraudulent transactions that could have been prevented by the chip if a chip card was used, so non-EMV chip machines should vanish at a faster and faster rate.

This is a true story that happened to me, not a rant. Yes, it does happen. Cover your hand when you enter your PIN, even if there is a cover on the machine.

 

[Tom Beavert]

clone

Thanks for posting, sounds like you handled it right.
TB

 

[Sevens]

For all of this to happen with a hurricane looming AND they worked to clear it up so quickly, that sure sounds like you made the best of a bad situation!

 

[muddocktor]

Thank you for posting up your experience on it man! There should be a special place in hell for jerks like this to suffer in for eternity for all the hell they put honest folks through during their life on this planet.

And this is just another reason why I don't use debit cards or ATM cards and just reinforces this position in my mind not to do so in the future.

 

[Bekeart]

And this is just another reason why I don't use debit cards or ATM cards and just reinforces this position in my mind not to do so in the future.

AMEN Brother.

Bekeart

 

[kwselke]

Thank you for posting up your experience on it man! There should be a special place in hell for jerks like this to suffer in for eternity for all the hell they put honest folks through during their life on this planet.

And this is just another reason why I don't use debit cards or ATM cards and just reinforces this position in my mind not to do so in the future.

Frauds happen with old time banking methods too. Do not feel protected because you do not use modern methods. The modern method had me notified of the problem within hours. If you were depending on paper notification of problem checks/withdrawals, how much damage would have occurred and how long would it have taken to get it resolved? Of course you may not use banks, but I doubt that.

 

[Beemerguy53]

I've had two different cards cloned in the past two years.

In the first case, I was in Germany on vacation. I landed in Munich, used the card to guarantee my rental car, then drove to Nuremberg and checked into my hotel, where I used the card to guarantee my room. By the next morning, someone had used my card number to buy an airplane ticket to London. My credit card company tried to contact me regarding the possible fraud...by calling my HOME phone number, where they left a message. I discovered the fraud when I went online to check my account a few days later. I called the card issuer, who froze the card, and issued a new one when I got home.

The second case occurred about a month ago. I made a credit card purchase over the phone to a local store. Within hours the card had been cloned and used to buy a meal at a restaurant 35 miles away that I've never been to. Got that straightened out as well, but it was still a pain in the neck.

You know, for 30 years I went into folks' homes under emergency conditions, and I saw all sorts of stuff --- cash, jewelry, drugs --- lying around...yet it never occurred to me to take anything that wasn't mine. I'll never understand how somebody can steal from others and rationalize it to himself...

 

[LVSteve]

Was that America First Credit Union? A coworker got nailed here in Vegas with a cloned card for about $2k.

 

[hittman77]

Sorry to hear about your loss but thank you for sharing the story.

Why oh why people use debit cards is totally lost on me. Your credit card does the same thing but offers so much more protection and your money isn't stolen from your account. Your money isn't missing, don't have to fight to get it back.

 

[Steve912]

Cover your hand when you enter your PIN, even if there is a cover on the machine.

Good advice, but ditch debit cards if at all possible. You have a lot more protections with credit cards. Check "Clark Howard" for lots of plain-language info on the how & why, and other consumer protection info.

 

[muddocktor]

Frauds happen with old time banking methods too. Do not feel protected because you do not use modern methods. The modern method had me notified of the problem within hours. If you were depending on paper notification of problem checks/withdrawals, how much damage would have occurred and how long would it have taken to get it resolved? Of course you may not use banks, but I doubt that.

I use credit cards instead of debit cards. Lots more protection with them versus a debit card, like already has been posted in your thread. And I don't carry an ATM card mainly because the bank screwed up my last one and the replacement never worked right. My wife does have a working ATM card if I need emergency cash, but we had the bank set a $100/day limit on withdrawals on it to limit liability of a cloned or stolen card.

 

[hardcase60]

Guess I'm fortunate that the major bank I deal with has fraud protection even on my debt card. And yes I have been a victim. About a year ago while taking a nap, I supposedly got a hotel room in NY City, shopped in Germany and dined in France. One heck of a trip from my recliner. The bank fraud agent was laughing so hard she told me to stop. They never did tell me how the card got compromised but all the money was back in the account within about 48hrs and on some transactions it was less. Regardless of debit or credit if the financial institution offers alerts sign up for all of them, I get texts, emails and phone calls on suspicious activity. The big thing up here is card skimmers at gas stations and occasionally on ATM's. hardcase60

 

[johngalt]

Never link a debit card to a savings account, only the checking account. Never link the checking and savings account. The bank sometimes calls it overdraft protection. If it is turned on, money is automatically transferred from savings to checking to prevent an overdraft, enabling a thief to drain both accounts.

 

[kwselke]

Was that America First Credit Union? A coworker got nailed here in Vegas with a cloned card for about $2k.

No. It was TDECU (Texas Dow Employee Credit Union) and they handled it well. I'm pretty sure the card was cloned at the ATM I attempted to get cash from on 8/23. That was at a Walgreen's store. I had used the ATM there on 8/1 and there had been a plastic hand shield on the ATM to obscure the keypad from view. It was not there on the 23rd. I should have covered my hand when I entered my PIN.

 

[peterGun]

Debit Card Cloning & Fraud

Sorry to hear about your loss but thank you for sharing the story.



Why oh why people use debit cards is totally lost on me. Your credit card does the same thing but offers so much more protection and your money isn't stolen from your account. Your money isn't missing, don't have to fight to get it back.

Because with a debit card you are accessing YOUR money not creating debt, not to mention the unholy alliance with a CC company whose sole reason for existence is to bleed as much money from you as they can get.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[johngalt]

Because with a debit card you are accessing YOUR money not creating debt, not to mention the unholy alliance with a CC company whose sole reason for existence is to bleed as much money from you as they can get.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Paying your bill in full every month does not create debt. My debit card, which only gets used in an ATM, has a VISA logo. There is no avoiding that 'unholy alliance'.

Credit puts the risk on them. Debit puts it on you. If you follow the cardinal rule of never buy anything that you couldn't pay for in cash, the only difference is the extra step of paying the bill.

 

[Alpo]

Doesn't your credit union have a limit on ATM withdrawals?

If I'm working with one of my credit union's machines, I can get 400 a day. If it's not one of theirs, I can get 300 a day. And they're all connected. I can't get 3 from one and then go down the road and get 3 more.

But you took money yourself (you don't say how much, but I figger 3 or 4 hundred if you wanted some "cash on hand" for the hurricane), then (same day) you were hit for 400, then for 300, and they tried 200 and were declined.

Adds up to about a grand outa the ATM in one day.

 

[kwselke]

Sorry to hear about your loss but thank you for sharing the story.

Why oh why people use debit cards is totally lost on me. Your credit card does the same thing but offers so much more protection and your money isn't stolen from your account. Your money isn't missing, don't have to fight to get it back.

I use a debit card to get cash from ATMs. My credit card can be set up for ATM use, but that is considered a cash advance which carries a fee plus interest. For transactions I use my credit card and pay off the balance in full each month.

Part of hurricane preparedness is having cash on hand. This is because after the storm electricity may be out and debit and credit cards will not be accepted for purchases. I do not like to keep much cash on my person or in my home because of the risk of plain old fashioned low tech theft, but having $200 or $300 in cash when you are watching a hurricane coming at you seems reasonable.

Barring the use of ATM cards I would have to personally go into my credit union branch during their business hours to get cash. That is doable, but not convenient.

 

[StakeOut]

Someone above asked 'why debit card'?

If someone with no credit history,like a college student,opens a checking account they will only get a debit card Few banks offer student credit cards these days.A cosigner is needed to get the student a credit card.

 

[Kanewpadle]

Same thing happened to me a month ago. Drained my account.

With my bank they have up to ten business days to refund your money. And the investigation may take up to 45 days. I got my money back in ten days and a letter in the mail a few days after clearing me of any wrong doing.

SO.......No more debit card use for me.

If you swipe your debit card you are at risk. Every bit of information about your account is transmitted and it is not encrypted. When you use the chip, it is encrypted.