arkypete
Member
Of course Realtors lie, they are human first and they are sales persons.
Jim
Jim
Do Realtors lie?
- Thread starter neiljrosen
- Start date
Hermann
Member
Rhetorical question?
They all do!
They all do!
Not necessarily true anymore. When I first started back in the '80's, yes, we were all considered agents of the Seller. A sub-agency relationship was created when a selling agent used listings from the MLS. I often had problems with selling agents forgetting who their fiduciary responsibility was supposed to be directed to.
Then in the '90's, based on various cases coming out of CA (which is where all changes to real estate law seem to originate) we had to start using both a "Residential Property Disclosure Statement" and a form titled "Disclosure Regarding Real Estate Agency Relationships". This is supposed to clarify whose interests the Agent is representing. Even this form has gone through some tweaks through the years. The concept of "Buyer Broker" emerged with actual written contractual relationships being created between Agents and those looking for a property. Not only is the Agent definitely working on the Buyer's behalf, in many instances the Agent gets compensated by the Buyer rather than the Seller.
It is really kind of funny the venom and hatred that seems to exist for those in the real estate profession. Everyone seems to think that not only are agents inherently dishonest to the core, but they make piles of money for doing absolutely nothing. I know, sounds like politicians. Most Buyers and Sellers only see the result of their one transaction. They don't see the amount of time spent working with timewasters and sight-seers. If a house sells too quickly then the Seller thinks the house was priced too low, and if it sits on the market forever then it must be that the Agent isn't doing enough (never mind that it might be ridiculously overpriced for the market).
All of our expenses come out-of-pocket upfront and we only get paid if we get results. My biggest beef has always been that doctors and lawyers get paid regardless of what the end results are (I have siblings in both professions so I feel entitled to rag on them too
Again, I'm not here to defend every fool in the industry. Real estate has its share of shysters and incompetents - just like any other business out there. It's the blanket indictment of anyone involved in selling real estate for a living. I can assure you that there are lots of agents who have been in the business for years, selling real estate as their principal vocation, who have not sold their soul to the dark side strictly for the purpose of monetary gain.
In the meantime, let's have fun with the question. Lawyers usually bear the brunt of my derisive humor, so turnabout is fair play
HOUSTON RICK
Member
Do Realtors lie?
Like a $2 lady of ill repute with cocaine dependency issues and and a bipolar personality.
Like a $2 lady of ill repute with cocaine dependency issues and and a bipolar personality.
Leonard, thanks for posting. I had forgotten about Builders. My primary real estate practice for most of my career was representing Developers (oops, another group we forgot to malign!). Since I spent a lot of time in subdivisions selling vacant lots I had the opportunity to witness first hand the horror stories relating to new construction.
When I was showing houses one phrase that usually sent up a red flag for me was "builder's own home". That typically meant it was built on the cheap, used a lot of left-over/salvage materials, and had material defects that they cleverly knew how to cover over. Does this describe you? No, probably not, but it did happen enough to warrant concern about any property bearing that description.
The building industry is equally populated with lots of guys who think "hey, I can do this!" and where the turnover rate is just as high. With my time in the business I can name just as many fly by night builders as I can real estate agents. I also know people who were burned financially by a builder, some quite substantially. Not to mention that some builders not only took the opportunity to shaft their customers, but their tradespeople as well.
One of my best friends to this day is a builder I met in 1990. I sold him his second building site and many others since then. We still joke about which profession is the shadiest, and I have to remind him of this exchange from the first "Naked Gun" movie:
Jane Spencer: "How could you do something so vicious!?!"
Vincent Ludwig: "It was easy my dear. You forget I spent two years as a building contractor."
When I was showing houses one phrase that usually sent up a red flag for me was "builder's own home". That typically meant it was built on the cheap, used a lot of left-over/salvage materials, and had material defects that they cleverly knew how to cover over. Does this describe you? No, probably not, but it did happen enough to warrant concern about any property bearing that description.
The building industry is equally populated with lots of guys who think "hey, I can do this!" and where the turnover rate is just as high. With my time in the business I can name just as many fly by night builders as I can real estate agents. I also know people who were burned financially by a builder, some quite substantially. Not to mention that some builders not only took the opportunity to shaft their customers, but their tradespeople as well.
One of my best friends to this day is a builder I met in 1990. I sold him his second building site and many others since then. We still joke about which profession is the shadiest, and I have to remind him of this exchange from the first "Naked Gun" movie:
Jane Spencer: "How could you do something so vicious!?!"
Vincent Ludwig: "It was easy my dear. You forget I spent two years as a building contractor."
G
Guest
I've known a few folks who went to the trouble of getting their Licenses around here but weren't willing to do what their "Bosses" wanted them to do - Lie about anything and everything just to make the Sale.
Then there are also the "Inspectors" who you pay to tell you what is wrong with a house before you buy. I have yet to find one of these that wasn't nearly or completely blind or just plain corrupt and at least here there ain't a thing that you can do if their "Inspection" proves to be less that accurate or less than complete. Most all the Banks require an Inspection but I have yet to find one of these that wasn't worth 5% of what they were paid. I'm sure there are some good people out there but then I'm a bit of a "optimist" about people doing what they are paid for and doing a good job of it. I think I'm getting to be more Pessimistic the older I get because I've seen too many people who simply didn't give a Darn about the quality of the work they do.
Then there are also the "Inspectors" who you pay to tell you what is wrong with a house before you buy. I have yet to find one of these that wasn't nearly or completely blind or just plain corrupt and at least here there ain't a thing that you can do if their "Inspection" proves to be less that accurate or less than complete. Most all the Banks require an Inspection but I have yet to find one of these that wasn't worth 5% of what they were paid. I'm sure there are some good people out there but then I'm a bit of a "optimist" about people doing what they are paid for and doing a good job of it. I think I'm getting to be more Pessimistic the older I get because I've seen too many people who simply didn't give a Darn about the quality of the work they do.
Smithfan
Member
Threads such as this actually make me proud to live in California, where in real estate transactions, at least, we get a few things right.
A piece in my morning fishwrapper detailed what happened to a couple who peddled subprime mortgages to Spanish-speking homebuyers who couldn't remotely pay for the properties they were buying. The schemes included forged documentation and lots of other stuff. It was multiple counts of massive fraud, and they were found guilty.
The upshot: the wife in this husband/wife team will spend 22 years in one of the state's gated communities. The husband will be a guest of the taxpayers for the next 19 years.
For example, a house on a hillside is actually on unstable land; 3 months after the sale, the whole ****teree slides off the foundation. Whether you knew of it or not, by law you should have as part of your due diligence, and you, Mr. broker, Realtor or whomever, are gonna lose your license, look at hefty fines, and probably, help pay for repairs, damages, attorney's fees and court costs.
Bill
A piece in my morning fishwrapper detailed what happened to a couple who peddled subprime mortgages to Spanish-speking homebuyers who couldn't remotely pay for the properties they were buying. The schemes included forged documentation and lots of other stuff. It was multiple counts of massive fraud, and they were found guilty.
The upshot: the wife in this husband/wife team will spend 22 years in one of the state's gated communities. The husband will be a guest of the taxpayers for the next 19 years.
In California, those involved in a sale of property are obligated to disclose any problem they know of, or could reasonably be expected to know of. The liability extends from seller to broker to broker's agent to hired inspector to anyone else involved in the sale.
For example, a house on a hillside is actually on unstable land; 3 months after the sale, the whole ****teree slides off the foundation. Whether you knew of it or not, by law you should have as part of your due diligence, and you, Mr. broker, Realtor or whomever, are gonna lose your license, look at hefty fines, and probably, help pay for repairs, damages, attorney's fees and court costs.
Bill
Landpimp
Member
only one inspector I trust, and they are up your way.
http://www.northwestinspectionengineers.com/
these are true stuctural engineers, not some kid that took and internet inspection class and shows up with a laptop. They cost just a bit more than others(400-ish) I use Jack Swardz everytime, honest as the day is long.
been using them for 15+ years, we use them on our own properties
http://www.northwestinspectionengineers.com/
these are true stuctural engineers, not some kid that took and internet inspection class and shows up with a laptop. They cost just a bit more than others(400-ish) I use Jack Swardz everytime, honest as the day is long.
been using them for 15+ years, we use them on our own properties
Broker,
A home is such a major investment for most people that I think both Realtors and builders should be held to a higher standard. Our builders association has a registered builder program which requires perfect credit (checked annually on renewal) and no unresolved problems with customers plus we need to take so many educational courses each year. We use the Builders Association Warranty which they initially mediate. We have been part of this program for 22 years and have never had a consumer complaint or credit issue.
Due to another business I own I can appreciate the time and expense a commissioned sales person goes threw. I understand most sellers are not happy with the commission coming right off the top whether the sale was profitable or not. I personally have no problem paying a commission but I am very frustrated with the confusion many Realtors bring to the deal and in most cases we just take the customer over and see the Realtor again at the closing.
Broker I do recognize the fact there are some bad builders just as there are some good Realtors.
Len
A home is such a major investment for most people that I think both Realtors and builders should be held to a higher standard. Our builders association has a registered builder program which requires perfect credit (checked annually on renewal) and no unresolved problems with customers plus we need to take so many educational courses each year. We use the Builders Association Warranty which they initially mediate. We have been part of this program for 22 years and have never had a consumer complaint or credit issue.
Due to another business I own I can appreciate the time and expense a commissioned sales person goes threw. I understand most sellers are not happy with the commission coming right off the top whether the sale was profitable or not. I personally have no problem paying a commission but I am very frustrated with the confusion many Realtors bring to the deal and in most cases we just take the customer over and see the Realtor again at the closing.
Broker I do recognize the fact there are some bad builders just as there are some good Realtors.
Len
straightshooter1
US Veteran
Want to meet realtors so you can judge for yourself?
Just stick a FSBO (Fisbo) sign in your front yard (For Sale by Owner).
You'll get calls on that sign-from realtors. All of them have a client who they are certain will buy your house if you'll just sign a contract with them.
If you are foolish enough to do so, they'll run their brother in law or some such through the house and, while "...it is a very nice house, it is not quite what they are looking for."
And you are stuck with a (usually 6 months) contract with this liar.
Want to see if they really have a client? Tell them you will sign a contract for that ONE client-if he buys, the realtor gets the commission, if not, no $.
Watch the realtor fade into the distance.
Have you ever noticed how many realtors have failed careers in something else, often "many things" else? How many are former car salesmen?
Car sales to home sales! That should fill the consumer with confidence in the realtor's integrity.
Now I am not saying there are not honest, caring and professional realtors. I'm certainly not saying all in that profession lie.
I am sure, one of these days, I may actually meet an honest one.
WOW! I sound just like those guys that bash the cops. Sure is easy to over-generalize, isn't it?
Bob
Just stick a FSBO (Fisbo) sign in your front yard (For Sale by Owner).
You'll get calls on that sign-from realtors. All of them have a client who they are certain will buy your house if you'll just sign a contract with them.
If you are foolish enough to do so, they'll run their brother in law or some such through the house and, while "...it is a very nice house, it is not quite what they are looking for."
And you are stuck with a (usually 6 months) contract with this liar.
Want to see if they really have a client? Tell them you will sign a contract for that ONE client-if he buys, the realtor gets the commission, if not, no $.
Watch the realtor fade into the distance.
Have you ever noticed how many realtors have failed careers in something else, often "many things" else? How many are former car salesmen?
Car sales to home sales! That should fill the consumer with confidence in the realtor's integrity.
Now I am not saying there are not honest, caring and professional realtors. I'm certainly not saying all in that profession lie.
I am sure, one of these days, I may actually meet an honest one.
WOW! I sound just like those guys that bash the cops. Sure is easy to over-generalize, isn't it?
Bob
Home inspectors are dependant upon realtors for references, e.g. are not going to bite the hand that feeds them, and many are trained off of internet courses, and seem to be growing with the slow down in job availability.
Some time if bored and have cash to throw around
Landpimp
Member
in WA, either the agent or seller can cancell the listing for any reason as long as a deal is not going on.
never called on a FSBO(typicaly they get what they deserve).......but have done 1 party listings(on homes I know folks would sell, but not FSBO's).....and sold them to the buyer I had(so there)
still wonder what all you do that makes you SO much better than a low life REALTOR like me? please do tell as I can see you think I am a super low life as I sold cars at one point.
never bashed a cop....they got a hard job and I respect them.
never called on a FSBO(typicaly they get what they deserve).......but have done 1 party listings(on homes I know folks would sell, but not FSBO's).....and sold them to the buyer I had(so there)
still wonder what all you do that makes you SO much better than a low life REALTOR like me? please do tell as I can see you think I am a super low life as I sold cars at one point.
never bashed a cop....they got a hard job and I respect them.
Originally posted by straightshooter1:
And you are stuck with a (usually 6 months) contract with this liar.
Want to see if they really have a client? Tell them you will sign a contract for that ONE client-if he buys, the realtor gets the commission, if not, no $.
Watch the realtor fade into the distance.
Have you ever noticed how many realtors have failed careers in something else, often "many things" else? How many are former car salesmen?
Car sales to home sales! That should fill the consumer with confidence in the realtor's integrity.
Now I am not saying there are not honest, caring and professional realtors. I'm certainly not saying all in that profession lie.
I am sure, one of these days, I may actually meet an honest one.
WOW! I sound just like those guys that bash the cops. Sure is easy to over-generalize, isn't it?
Bob
straightshooter1
US Veteran
Gee, Landpimp, maybe you're the one I thought I'd never meet.
The calls on the FSBOs do happen, in fact they happened to me several times when I sold a residence.
And, if the realtor really had a client, he would sign what you call a "1 party listing," so you know, then, that they are lying when they refuse (or just melt away). Otherwise they'd agree and make that quick 6% +/- commission.
But, please don't take my experiences and observations personally. I am usually one who defends LEOs and even lawyers when people start over-generalizing i.e. all cops... or all defense attorneys....
There are bad cops, bad lawyers and bad realtors.
But, you weren't REALLY a car salesman, were you? I mean talk about professions where they ALL....
That's almost like car mechanics who ALL rip off the women and old folks and....
Bob
The calls on the FSBOs do happen, in fact they happened to me several times when I sold a residence.
And, if the realtor really had a client, he would sign what you call a "1 party listing," so you know, then, that they are lying when they refuse (or just melt away). Otherwise they'd agree and make that quick 6% +/- commission.
But, please don't take my experiences and observations personally. I am usually one who defends LEOs and even lawyers when people start over-generalizing i.e. all cops... or all defense attorneys....
There are bad cops, bad lawyers and bad realtors.
But, you weren't REALLY a car salesman, were you? I mean talk about professions where they ALL....
That's almost like car mechanics who ALL rip off the women and old folks and....
Bob
LennyLames
Member
Here's an event that occurred a few weeks ago. It was my most recent interaction with someone who professed to be a Realtor.
I was in front of my garage when an SUV stopped in the street in front of the house. The driver rolled down her window and shouted across the large expanse: "Is this so-and-so street? I'm looking for a piece of property, number [unintelligible} so-and-so street."
I shouted back, "I can't hear you."
She then got out of her car and walked all the way to where I was. I realized I was doing her a favor by having her walk.
"I'm from the bank," she said (lied)
when she got closer. "I'm looking for a lot that foreclosed."
"Which bank is it that you work for?" I asked.
"Uh, actually, I'm a Realtor," she stammered. "I, uh, represent multiple banks."
I then gave her whatever information I knew.
After the self-proclaimed Realtor departed, I turned to my spouse, who happened to be listening in, and explained that it was second nature for many of them to lie first, then when caught, try to explain their way out of it. I don't even know what this person's motivation was for lying. Perhaps it was just her second nature.
I was actually a Realtor in the past. One aspect that was stressed was the Realtor's duties to the principal (client), represented by the acronym LCDORA or OLD CAR. The closest to truthfulness was "D" for Disclosure.
Perhaps "D" should be replaced with "T" for truthfulness, but "truthfulness" is more encompassing, and limits one's interactions far more than "disclosure." Also note that these responsibilities are directed at the principal (client), and some interpret that to mean that anyone else is fair game for lying.
Some of the newer ones, especially in this economic environment, are desperate and feel they have to lie to make a living. Eventually, lying becomes second nature and they do it even when they don't have to, and the lies become more blatant.
Some of the more experienced ones, the ones that survived, have honed the skill to such a degree that it takes an astute individual to realize they are "stretching the truth."
There are some that are honest and ethical.
In most situations, with only a bit of probing, the liar gets exposed.
I was in front of my garage when an SUV stopped in the street in front of the house. The driver rolled down her window and shouted across the large expanse: "Is this so-and-so street? I'm looking for a piece of property, number [unintelligible} so-and-so street."
I shouted back, "I can't hear you."
She then got out of her car and walked all the way to where I was. I realized I was doing her a favor by having her walk.
"I'm from the bank," she said (lied)
"Which bank is it that you work for?" I asked.
"Uh, actually, I'm a Realtor," she stammered. "I, uh, represent multiple banks."
I then gave her whatever information I knew.
After the self-proclaimed Realtor departed, I turned to my spouse, who happened to be listening in, and explained that it was second nature for many of them to lie first, then when caught, try to explain their way out of it. I don't even know what this person's motivation was for lying. Perhaps it was just her second nature.
I was actually a Realtor in the past. One aspect that was stressed was the Realtor's duties to the principal (client), represented by the acronym LCDORA or OLD CAR. The closest to truthfulness was "D" for Disclosure.
Perhaps "D" should be replaced with "T" for truthfulness, but "truthfulness" is more encompassing, and limits one's interactions far more than "disclosure." Also note that these responsibilities are directed at the principal (client), and some interpret that to mean that anyone else is fair game for lying.
Some of the newer ones, especially in this economic environment, are desperate and feel they have to lie to make a living. Eventually, lying becomes second nature and they do it even when they don't have to, and the lies become more blatant.
Some of the more experienced ones, the ones that survived, have honed the skill to such a degree that it takes an astute individual to realize they are "stretching the truth."
There are some that are honest and ethical.
In most situations, with only a bit of probing, the liar gets exposed.
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