Does a real Model 23 exist?

[h38/44]

Hi all,
A really long time back I acquired a "pre-model" 38/44 Outdoorsman. I know that the 38/44s became the Model 20 (from the Heavy Duty) and Model 23 from the Outdoorsman but I have never seen a true-blue model numbered one listed, advertised or photographed, etc. Anyone? Pictures?
Thank you in advance,
- h38/44

 

[Art Doc]

There are maybe 5 guys on this forum who would be the ones...if any exist.

1Aspinhill is the resident 38/44 guru. I'm sure he can tell you if any were produced.

 

[murphydog]

One of the writers for Guns Magazine, Mike Venturino, owned an example of every model stamped N frame from 20-29, including a 23. I recall he sold almost all of them a few years ago.

 

[DCWilson]

S177912 is a model-marked 23, but I don't have a picture. The gun is mentioned in post no. 6 in this thread:

http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-ha...-model-23-correction-pre-war-outdoorsman.html

I'm not sure, but from context the four-screw Outdoorsman seen in post no. 14 of that thread may also be a model-marked gun.

Revolvers that carry the MOD 23 stamp are among the least-seen S&Ws of the 20th century. There may be no more than about a hundred of them. If you think the straight 23s are hard to locate, imagine scoring a 23-1 or 23-2.

 

[rburg]

I saw one once. It was at the Louisville gun show and a guy was shopping it around. It got to David Carrolls table and submerged. Other than the model marked part, the gun was pretty unremarkable. I asked him why he snapped it up so fast and he said there might only be 20 of them. A big part of gun collecting is learning what really rare and then buying it when you see one.

I've managed that a few times, like buying a 44-40 Triple lock and then buying my 4" 44 3rd model target.

 

[handejector]

In the mid 70s I picked an old S&W up off a table at an Atlanta gun show.
Bright blue, 4 Screw N frame.
In my younger years, I thought the Outdoorsman was one of the stupidest guns they had ever made. Why carry a heavy, bulky gun to shoot 38s?
As I read the caliber on the barrel, I thought Ho-Hum.

I had owned a few 5 Screw ODs, usually buying them to flip for something like a big $20 to $35 profit.
I had shot them, and noticed that with muffs on, you could hardly tell they had gone off if shooting wadcutters!
Still being 10 feet tall and bulletproof, I didn't need such a mild platform for the mere 38.

Anyway, back to this gun-
I saw the trigger guard screw and bright finish, but it showed lots of wear. I flipped it open (gently, of course), and noticed it said "MOD 23". Hmmmmmm......... never saw that before.
The guy wanted something like $300 for it, and I didn't quite have it, so I moved on in quest of a great bargain.

I've never seen one since.
Such is life for the young, dumb, and poor.

 

[1Aspenhill]

I have only seen one Mod 23, so these are even more rare than Mod marked 20s.

 

[vonn]

Thanks fellas,learned something.

 

[ralph7]

Thanks fellas,learned something.

That makes two of us.

 

[Old Corp]

In the mid 70s I picked an old S&W up off a table at an Atlanta gun show.
Bright blue, 4 Screw N frame.
In my younger years, I thought the Outdoorsman was one of the stupidest guns they had ever made. Why carry a heavy, bulky gun to shoot 38s?
As I read the caliber on the barrel, I thought Ho-Hum.

I had owned a few 5 Screw ODs, usually buying them to flip for something like a big $20 to $35 profit.
I had shot them, and noticed that with muffs on, you could hardly tell they had gone off if shooting wadcutters!
Still being 10 feet tall and bulletproof, I didn't need such a mild platform for the mere 38.

Anyway, back to this gun-
I saw the trigger guard screw and bright finish, but it showed lots of wear. I flipped it open (gently, of course), and noticed it said "MOD 23". Hmmmmmm......... never saw that before.
The guy wanted something like $300 for it, and I didn't quite have it, so I moved on in quest of a great bargain.

I've never seen one since.
Such is life for the young, dumb, and poor.

Handejector, our brains must be wired almost identically. I recall thinking, at that time, the exact same way.
And now, I really want a decent 38/44. Have yet to find one that I can afford.

 

[iskra]

Just had to add a "go figure"!
Too many years with the general rule ingrained that the "pre" model number guns were more desirable than their later model numbered equivalents! Pricy to get into both, and then too the economics of 'too many guns too little (savings recuperation) time'.

I usually ignored the latter production where "pre" versions were made; such unless I didn't yet have the earlier version OR in 44 Special! Think I'll just happily stick with that and my own amateurish 'pure dumb luck' acquisition system which has worked amazingly well!

Just my take

 

[moosedog]

I ran into a model marked 23 about 15 years ago in a gun shop. It was really beat up bad, several old reblues with bad over polishing. Would have needed a new barrel, cylinder some internal parts and grips. It was $250. I knew it was scarce but not rare at the time. I should have bought it but wasn't well schooled on them back then.

 

[Göring's S&W]

Funny this topic came up! I've been called a liar for years for telling people I have a model 23. They would say "why don't you show it to me?" "Can I buy it?" "That doesn't sound right..." If I didn't talk to at least 1000 doubting Thomas's, I didn't talk to 5. There ain't nothing I detest more than being called a liar!

Here is a pic of mine - see, told ya so! I keep this right beside my 357 mag triple lock. Its a dandy! She has some wear, but she's more honest than Bill Clinton! There ain't many of these around

 

[A10]

Such is life for the young, dumb, and poor.

Yup......bought that Tshirt my own self........

 

[Breezey1]

My model 23

I too have a model 23. Bought it in ‘96 for 500$. Took it to the range, bought 100 Rd’s and borrowed a rest. Wanted to sight it in. But first I tried six shots off hand. 4 in the 10 ring, 1 in the 9 and a flyer in the 6 at ten yards. Scratched my head wondering what to do with the other 94 rounds! Mine has additions to the trigger to make it wider and the hammer spur is triple wide. Is this factory on the model 23? Also have a hefty derringer in the same caliber. Two separate basketball sized patterns at the same 10 yards. Unrewarding and prompted me to buy the revolver. Later bought a Browning Buckmark Target for the economy of firing a .22. Never hunted with either but really enjoy hitting targets I aim at with both.

 

[James K]

In the mid 70s I picked an old S&W up off a table at an Atlanta gun show.
Bright blue, 4 Screw N frame.
In my younger years, I thought the Outdoorsman was one of the stupidest guns they had ever made. Why carry a heavy, bulky gun to shoot 38s?
As I read the caliber on the barrel, I thought Ho-Hum.

I had owned a few 5 Screw ODs, usually buying them to flip for something like a big $20 to $35 profit.
I had shot them, and noticed that with muffs on, you could hardly tell they had gone off if shooting wadcutters!
Still being 10 feet tall and bulletproof, I didn't need such a mild platform for the mere 38.

Anyway, back to this gun-
I saw the trigger guard screw and bright finish, but it showed lots of wear. I flipped it open (gently, of course), and noticed it said "MOD 23". Hmmmmmm......... never saw that before.
The guy wanted something like $300 for it, and I didn't quite have it, so I moved on in quest of a great bargain.

I've never seen one since.
Such is life for the young, dumb, and poor.

Thought they were designed to handle a higher pressure .38 special for large game- sort of a +P. Became obsolete with the invent of .357 magnum. Seem collectible now, see them listing for $1500 and up.

 

[demkofour]

Hi all,
A really long time back I acquired a "pre-model" 38/44 Outdoorsman. I know that the 38/44s became the Model 20 (from the Heavy Duty) and Model 23 from the Outdoorsman but I have never seen a true-blue model numbered one listed, advertised or photographed, etc. Anyone? Pictures?
Thank you in advance,
- h38/44

Ah yup, the Model 23 certainly does exist! MOD-23

 

[murphydog]

I too have a model 23. Bought it in ‘96 for 500$. Took it to the range, bought 100 Rd’s and borrowed a rest. Wanted to sight it in. But first I tried six shots off hand. 4 in the 10 ring, 1 in the 9 and a flyer in the 6 at ten yards. Scratched my head wondering what to do with the other 94 rounds! Mine has additions to the trigger to make it wider and the hammer spur is triple wide. Is this factory on the model 23? Also have a hefty derringer in the same caliber. Two separate basketball sized patterns at the same 10 yards. Unrewarding and prompted me to buy the revolver. Later bought a Browning Buckmark Target for the economy of firing a .22. Never hunted with either but really enjoy hitting targets I aim at with both.

Welcome! Photos would help here, both the Target (wide) hammer and trigger were available during the era of the model 23 but aftermarket modified parts were also. A letter of authenticity (the first link on this page) would confirm how, when and to where the gun shipped:

swhistoricalfoundation.com/letter-process/

 

[murphydog]

Thought they were designed to handle a higher pressure .38 special for large game- sort of a +P. Became obsolete with the invent of .357 magnum. Seem collectible now, see them listing for $1500 and up.

Thanks, you are correct and I suspect Lee knows as well.

 

[StrawHat]

Thought they were designed to handle a higher pressure .38 special for large game- sort of a +P. Became obsolete with the invent of .357 magnum. Seem collectible now, see them listing for $1500 and up.

The 38 Heavy Duty was indeed designed to provide more “power” to Law Enforcement of the day. The 38/44 cartridge was the S&W answer to the 38 Super from Colts. Phil Sharpe used a 38/44 OutdoorsMan as the platform to develop what he called the 38 Magnum Special. S&W modified it with a longer case and called it the 38 S&W Magnum.

I am working from my memory, someone with access to the books can fill in the details.

Kevin