Dont trust a used firearm hang tag!!!!

[Chef]

I saw this at the gunshop the other day on the work bench and asked them to set it aside when it was ready for sale. I had never seen a K Frame 32 long like this. I had almost forgotten about it when I went back today and they said it was ready and did I still want it? The action was locked up and it took some fiddling to get the cylinder swung out but found that the ejector rod was a little loose, other than that it was very tight. I paid for it and since I was going to the range I decided to take it along. It is super tight and shoots like new. The bore is shiny and outside of a very few pits on the cylinder it looks very nice. Serial number is 950XX. What interested me in the first place is that it is a K frame .32L with a 6 inch barrel.It is a 5 screw with a pinned barrel. It appears to have an original Parkerized frame and barrel, I thought at first it had been refinished but on closer inspection it doesn't appear to have been, the stampings are all very sharp, the cylinder finish has thinned and has one very worn spot and is very lightly pitted but not significantly, it appears it was stored on that side of the cylinder for a long time. The frame, cylinder and barrel are all numbered together, the grips are un-numbered. There are no import or military markings anywhere on the gun. I can't find any information in the Standard catalog for this piece other than what is listed for the 32 M&P and it doesn't fit that description, it has 32 WCF CTG on the right side of the barrel, patent dates ending in Dec 1914 on top of the barrel and Smith & Wesson on the left side. Does anyone have any info on this model? Thanks for your input! ~Chef

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[Chef]

I saw this at the gunshop the other day on the work bench and asked them to set it aside when it was ready for sale. I had never seen a K Frame 32 long like this. I had almost forgotten about it when I went back today and they said it was ready and did I still want it? The action was locked up and it took some fiddling to get the cylinder swung out but found that the ejector rod was a little loose, other than that it was very tight. I paid for it and since I was going to the range I decided to take it along. It is super tight and shoots like new. The bore is shiny and outside of a very few pits on the cylinder it looks very nice. Serial number is 950XX. What interested me in the first place is that it is a K frame .32L with a 6 inch barrel.It is a 5 screw with a pinned barrel. It appears to have an original Parkerized frame and barrel, I thought at first it had been refinished but on closer inspection it doesn't appear to have been, the stampings are all very sharp, the cylinder finish has thinned and has one very worn spot and is very lightly pitted but not significantly, it appears it was stored on that side of the cylinder for a long time. The frame, cylinder and barrel are all numbered together, the grips are un-numbered. There are no import or military markings anywhere on the gun. I can't find any information in the Standard catalog for this piece other than what is listed for the 32 M&P and it doesn't fit that description, it has 32 WCF CTG on the right side of the barrel, patent dates ending in Dec 1914 on top of the barrel and Smith & Wesson on the left side. Does anyone have any info on this model? Thanks for your input! ~Chef

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[deadin]

32 WCF is a 32/20 (32 Winchester Center Fire).
If this is truely in 32 Long, I would guess someone converted/sleeved the cylinder. I may be wrong but the only 32 Longs built on the K frame were the K-32 Target/Masterpiece and post-war .32 M&P (circ 1948-1950), but it should be marked "Smith & Wesson 32 Long CTG" and have either a "S" or "C" prefix on the serial number.
Also, AFAIK S&W didn' parkerize anything except the Victory Models.
Check out the 32-20 Hand Ejector Model of 1905-4th Change. Page 131 in SCSW3.

 

[Art Doc]

The Catalog makes no mention that I can find about Pre-War 32 Long K frames. Looks refinished to me but I could be wrong.

I believe what you actually have is a 32-20 (32 WCF). That's what I think it says on the barrel.

In a gun this old make sure you don't use any ammo marked "Rifle Only" in it. They used to load some 32-20s to higher pressures for use in the 1892 Winchester carbines.

 

[Chef]

I see that now. It is a 32-20 and I should have known that as I have a 32-20 in nickel. Thanks for the input! ~Chef

 

[Chef]

Here's a lesson! Never trust a hang tag on a used firearm! It is marked 32 S&W Long on the tag and I never gave that a second thought. ~Chef

 

[mikepriwer]

As others have noted, what you have is a poorly-refinished early 1920's
32-20 that have been converted to 32 Long, if that is what you shot
through it. Those grips are correct for the period, and may be the
original ones - not that it matters.

Either the cylinder has been sleeved, or replaced. One of your
pictures of the right side shows the clear outline of the sideplate,
which happens when the gun is poorly refinished. Normally the
outline of the sideplate is very faint. Also, there was no parkerizing,
or anything like that, in the early 1920's, so it can't possibly
be original. Original 32-20's were either blue or nickel.

As it is, the gun is a 32-long shooter - only , and has no collector
value. Unless you want to shoot a lot of 32-long, I would suggest
returning the gun.

Later, Mike Priwer

 

[Muley Gil]

It is possible to fire .32 S&W Longs in a .32-20 chambered revolver. I have worked several crime scenes where this has occured.

Is the cylinder number to the frame and does it have .32 Long chambers or the bottlenecked .32-20 chambers?

 

[Jack Flash]

Hang tags can be really wrong. I recently saw a nice M586 with a 4" barrel marked

S&W 585, 6" barrel

At least they got the maker right...

 

[dwf6666]

You certainly should be cautious of hang tags. I recently walked into a shop that had a "Mod 19" on the bottom shelf. Since I had never seen a Mod 19 with an 8 3/8" barrel, I thought that I better have a closer look. The first thing I noticed was the checkered top strap and my buddy noticed the fifth screw. Well, I just brought this one home with me. It's a Pre 27 with matching grips from 1955.

 

[moosedog]

I was just getting ready to post the same question Muley. I believe it is possible to fire a 32 Long in the 32/20, although not recommended. If it is in it's original chambering i'm sure it will be a decent shooter.

 

[deadin]

32 Long in a 32/20 chamber? I would imagine you might get some blow by and at least ruin the 32 Long brass. Head size is .018 smaller and the rim is .010 thinner on the 32 Long. Mighty sloppy fit.

 

[rburg]

If its a 32-20, then that's what it is.

But S&W did make a number of fixed sight 32 longs. They're just 32 S&W M&Ps. A few years ago Dave Foss had one at a gunshow. He was showing it to a few of us, and I never did learn how the letter came back, but it sure looked right to me.

These guns don't have the ready market that prewar K32s have. While they seem to be much more scarce, they just don't have the widespread appeal.

 

[mikepriwer]

Dick

I believe the guns you are referring to are all early post-WW2. The
factory did make, in about 1948 to about 1949, a fixed-sighted K-frame
chambered in 32 long. It is not a 32 M&P, however; its proper name is
.38 M&P chambered in 32 long, or .38 M&P Model 10 chambered in 32 long.

Of course, they also made the K-32, but those fixed-sighted guns are
not considered K-32's .

Earlier than the subject gun of this discussion
there were a few ( like less than 25 ) target revolvers
made up that were serial numbered in the 32/20 series, but were chambered,
and marked, as 32 long. In some sense , they are the predecessors of
the K-32, but about 20 years earlier. They were serial-numbered in the 61xxx range,
which is about 1916. Thre is also one known to be serial numbered in the 43xxx,
making it about 1910. These are not to be confused with
the 32/20 in this discussion.

Later, Mike Priwer

 

[rburg]

Mike, the gun I saw was clearly a prewar 32 S&W with fixed sights. I'll probably see Dave at either the next OGCA or the National Gun Day show in 3 weeks. I'll ask him what the gun was, but it was very interesting. And he wasn't selling it, because I attempted to steal it from him!

 

[BruceHMX]

Sebago Son also has a pre war 32 S&W Long M&P revolver. Special order. It's a four inch with matching gold medallion grips. I saw it a few months back. Mike Stern took some photos of it a few years ago. They might still be on the forum.

Drew is hunting in WVA this week. He might get on and comment if he checks his mail.

32 S&W Long will fire in a 32/20. At least LRN will wadcutters will bind it up. I noticed no change in the brass but it's not something I do on a regular basis. Especially since I found a 32 S&W Long post war M&P

 

[bmcgilvray]

I've tested the theory of firing .32 Longs in a .32-20 and they swell and split. Just what I'd expected.

 

[Chef]

If you noticed in my original post I said I took it to the range the day I got it. I put 6 32 long rounds through it and it shot fine with good accuracy and no case splits at all. I haven't put the micrometer on the cases yet to see how much swelling occurred but the cases aren't noticeably swelled. There was a bit of lead spitting on one of the rounds I shot but it sure felt normal at the time. I'm just glad I was shooting an anemic 32 Long round at the time! All in all it worked out pretty well as when I went back to the shop to discuss the hang tag error I found this.....I'm happy!

 

[deadin]

Sounds like it's time for a letter.

 

[mikepriwer]

Chef

What did you do with the 32/20 ? Did you trade it on this 2" ?

Later, Mike Priwer