FBI gun question

P

philmontscout

Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2009
Messages
411
Reaction score
10
Location
upstate NY
I few weeks ago, I saw Silence of the Lambs. Can you tell me what model revolver that clarice carried. 3", no rear sights, Round butt, looks liek a large frame.

any help appreciated.

also, what holster
 
Register to hide this ad
It was a Model 13 Smith and Wesson, three inch barrel, round butt.

I think she used the issued Desantis holster.

model13-5.jpg
 
Last edited:
philmontscout said:
I few weeks ago, I saw Silence of the Lambs. Can you tell me what model revolver that clarice carried. 3", no rear sights, Round butt, looks liek a large frame.

any help appreciated.

also, what holster
Click to expand...

If the producers did it correctly, it should have been a Smith & Wesson Model 13, 3 inch barrel, blue, round butt, carried in J.M. Bucheimer holster, both of which were standard issue for the FBI at that time.

Movies being what they are, it could have been the 3 inch Model 10 with round butt and blue finish. It would be extremely difficult to tell them apart on film.
 
Movies being what they are, it could have been the 3 inch Model 10 with round butt and blue finish. It would be extremely difficult to tell them apart on film.

Just last week at a gun show, I spotted what I thought was one of my grail guns - the 3.0 inch barreled Model 13. When I asked the seller, he had to check - twice - before he told me that it was a Model 10 with the 3.0 inch barrel. The price was too high given the wear ($599.00), and less than a week later, I put money down on a police trade in Model 64 with a 3.0 inch barrel ($355.00 + tax). I guess the Model 13/65 will go further down the grail list as their is a replacement waiting in the wings now.

Best of luck,

Dave
 
Either of the above answers are correct, although the M-13 was the "issue" item. Movies sometimes make substitutions that are, for practical purposes, undectable.

Unless you have the gun in hand and read the lettering or compare cylinder length or the portion of the barrel throat behind the frame, you cannot tell a M-10 like that from a M-13.

The villain had a Colt Python, if memory serves, and had that gun in the book. He used wadcutter .38 ammo to kill the girls, so as to have minimal disturbance to their bodies. (He wanted to skin them for his "girl suit.")

Look closely as Clarice receives her credentials at the end of the movie. The agent who presents them is John Douglas, then a profiler with the Bureau, and an author of books on profiling and unusual criminal behavior. I guess that he had a "cameo" role.


T-Star
 
Another Model 13 three inch with leather carry wear......
 

Attachments

  • gun pictures 028.jpg
    gun pictures 028.jpg
    71.7 KB · Views: 496
I went through the academy in 1991, not long after Jody Foster was there. The academy stuff was filmed at Quantico, and the instructors who appear in the film were real FBI instructors. I had the guy who taught Starling the lesson about checking behind doors for a class.

The instructors I talked to were uniformly impressed with Jody Foster as a student. They said she was very respectful and tried hard to get the firearms stuff right. She pulls off a pretty fair reload after unloading on Buffalo Bill in the dark. Its at about 6:30 in this clip. She does cock the Model 13 - an understandable rookie mistake.

YouTube - Agent Clarice Starling vs. Buffalo Bill

I'm sure she used a Model 13, given the care taken by the film makers to be authentic. The 14" Remington 870 Scott Glen uses looks exactly like the Bureau issue shotgun of the time.

500px-SilenceL008.jpg
 
Can anyone advise as to what the FBI issued load was for this pistol? Were agents allowed any discretion in ammo choices? As an example, carrying +P .38 Special ammo rather than a .357 magnum round? Also, are these pistols still in the inventory, and would an agent have the ability to request carrying a Model 13, rather than the currently issued semiauto?

Regards,

Dave
 
Dave - the issue round in 1991 was the Federal +P+ .38 Special 147 grain Hydra-Shok. Just prior to that the issue load was the famous "FBI round" - the 158 grain lead semi-wadcutter hollowpoint +P, in both the Remington and Winchester varieties.

Agents had to carry the issue .38 ammo. According to the regulations of the time, an Agent could carry Magnum ammo with the specific permission of the ASAC (Assistant Special Agent in Charge). The usual Magnum ammo was Winchester Silvertip (145 grain), though I have come across 158 JHP in gunvaults on occassion.

No revolvers are authorized for carry in today's Bureau. I don't know for sure what happened to all the Model 13s, but I suspect they were destroyed. Once I saw some desk sets that the Quantico gun vault was making up for visiting dignitary give-aways - they had the vertical foregrip from a Thompson submachinegun mounted on a base, with a Model 13 cylinder next to it for a pencil holder. Another time I requested a bunch of Simunitions guns for an exercise, and I got a case of Model 10s with Simuntions cylinders fitted to them. They had all been painted bright orange.
 
Last edited:
Sipp220.45,

Thank you very much for your very quick, and informative response. When I was a teenager I worked as a bellboy at a Holiday Inn. One of our frequent guests was an FBI agent that was a very nice man. He was always smiling and friendly, and a bit overweight and he looked about as dangerous as day old bread. I found out later that he was highly trained in several different forms of martial arts as well as being a crack shot. In short, he could kill you with a hard look, if he was so inclined. I had a lot of respect for him because he didn't look like the FBI agents on the TV show, and he was always very nice and polite to everyone.

Anyway, thanks again for your response. I do appreciate your information as well as your service.

Regards,

Dave
 
My 3 inch 13-3. I lucked out.
 

Attachments

  • 13-3.jpg
    13-3.jpg
    117 KB · Views: 122
I must say, given the stress a real Agent[or anyone else] would have been under in a real circumstance such as that, the reload looked as real as it gets. Very well done.

However, that clip is a very good example why it is a good idea to carry two SureFire flashlights with you WHERE EVER you go.
 
1943 said:
Was any nickel guns issued or was they all blued?

________
Terry
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure that all issued guns were blued, with nickel not allowed. But private purchased arms could be stainless.

T-Star
 
sigp220.45 said:
Dave - the issue round in 1991 was the Federal +P+ .38 Special 147 grain Hydra-Shok. Just prior to that the issue load was the famous "FBI round" - the 158 grain lead semi-wadcutter hollowpoint +P, in both the Remington and Winchester varieties.

Agents had to carry the issue .38 ammo. According to the regulations of the time, an Agent could carry Magnum ammo with the specific permission of the ASAC (Assistant Special Agent in Charge). The usual Magnum ammo was Winchester Silvertip (145 grain), though I have come across 158 JHP in gunvaults on occassion.

No revolvers are authorized for carry in today's Bureau. I don't know for sure what happened to all the Model 13s, but I suspect they were destroyed. Once I saw some desk sets that the Quantico gun vault was making up for visiting dignitary give-aways - they had the vertical foregrip from a Thompson submachinegun mounted on a base, with a Model 13 cylinder next to it for a pencil holder. Another time I requested a bunch of Simunitions guns for an exercise, and I got a case of Model 10s with Simuntions cylinders fitted to them. They had all been painted bright orange.
Click to expand...


What revolvers were authorized for agents in the '91-'95 timeframe?
 
Any Smith and Wesson steel framed revolver, .38 or .357, with a four inch or less barrel was authorized for use. It had to be privately purchased then inspected by the Division's Principal Firearms Instructor (PFI). No nickel finishes were authorized, though as noted previously, stainless was ok. The most common POWs (Personally Owned Weapons) I saw were 2 1/2 inch Model 19s and 66s, but anything from a 2 inch Model 36 to a 4 inch Model 28 could be carried.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Austerity
Help with ammo selection for recoil sensitive wife
2 3
Replies
50
Views
7K
blujax01
blujax01
D
.38 FBI load
2
Replies
31
Views
14K
safearm
safearm
Gunsmithattheguncloset
.38 Spl +P+ What do you think?
Replies
16
Views
3K
cdr
C
f8 crusader
Model 29 for concealed carry?
Replies
15
Views
14K
jimmyj
jimmyj
M
  • Locked
WITHDRAWN: s&w model 60-10
Replies
13
Views
3K
MAXIMUS1968
M

Latest posts

Back
Top