FEDERAL PREMIUM .38 Spl +P
- Thread starter Rudi
- Start date
Register to hide this ad
Texas Star
US Veteran
I've shot some, but think the velocity quote is wrong. I doubt it's that hot.
When I was an active gun writer, I asked the Federal PR man how fast this load was from both true snub and from three-inch barrels.
He asked an engineer to pull a box of that Hydra-Shok ammo and two S&W M-36's, one in each barrel length.
If I can find his letter, I'll post the results. But I remember the snub gave maybe 825 FPS and the three-inch about 60 FPS more.
Tests I've seen didn't show that bullet opened especially well or drove especially deep, and I rely on Speer Gold Dot 135 grain Short Barrel ammo in short barrels or their 125 grain Plus P from longer barrels, or use the lead HP 158 grain HP, especially in barrels of at least four inches.
Mind you, the 129 grain Hydra-Shok is still probably a pretty good load, and I'd certainly select it over normal lead RN ammo.
Actually, I guess that in longer barrels, some lots may actually reach 950 FPS. If the bullet impacts tough muscle tissue, like the heart, I think the bullet will often open, although if the nose becomes plugged with clothing, expansion is less than certain.
We have good feedback from the street on the Speer Short Barrel load,as it's used by both NYPD and LAPD and the Speer PR man told me that both are satisfied with its performance in real gunfights. That trumps theory and gel tests.
I simply don't have any real shooting reports of the 129 grain Hydra-Shok. But I've carried it in the past and felt reasonably well armed. Still, I was uneasy about having to maybe shoot a large, aggressive dog. Might not penetrate well enough.
Working where I was especially apprehensive about that need and the need to possibly shoot into cars, I carried a .357, loaded with .357 158 grain Hydra-Shok ammo. The Federal PR man at the time told me that it's a good deer load, too, as far as .357 ammo goes in that role from a handgun.
Another very good killer is Winchester's .357 145 grain Silvertip round. I got a detective to check morgue records on how it fared in use by both FBI and with Dallas PD, both of whom issued it to personnel using .357 revolvers. The guy said it was almost too effective. His words. It, by gum, WORKED! Both three and four-inch barrels were involved.
Of course, if you're loading a .38-only gun, that won't affect you...
I hope this is of help.
When I was an active gun writer, I asked the Federal PR man how fast this load was from both true snub and from three-inch barrels.
He asked an engineer to pull a box of that Hydra-Shok ammo and two S&W M-36's, one in each barrel length.
If I can find his letter, I'll post the results. But I remember the snub gave maybe 825 FPS and the three-inch about 60 FPS more.
Tests I've seen didn't show that bullet opened especially well or drove especially deep, and I rely on Speer Gold Dot 135 grain Short Barrel ammo in short barrels or their 125 grain Plus P from longer barrels, or use the lead HP 158 grain HP, especially in barrels of at least four inches.
Mind you, the 129 grain Hydra-Shok is still probably a pretty good load, and I'd certainly select it over normal lead RN ammo.
Actually, I guess that in longer barrels, some lots may actually reach 950 FPS. If the bullet impacts tough muscle tissue, like the heart, I think the bullet will often open, although if the nose becomes plugged with clothing, expansion is less than certain.
We have good feedback from the street on the Speer Short Barrel load,as it's used by both NYPD and LAPD and the Speer PR man told me that both are satisfied with its performance in real gunfights. That trumps theory and gel tests.
I simply don't have any real shooting reports of the 129 grain Hydra-Shok. But I've carried it in the past and felt reasonably well armed. Still, I was uneasy about having to maybe shoot a large, aggressive dog. Might not penetrate well enough.
Working where I was especially apprehensive about that need and the need to possibly shoot into cars, I carried a .357, loaded with .357 158 grain Hydra-Shok ammo. The Federal PR man at the time told me that it's a good deer load, too, as far as .357 ammo goes in that role from a handgun.
Another very good killer is Winchester's .357 145 grain Silvertip round. I got a detective to check morgue records on how it fared in use by both FBI and with Dallas PD, both of whom issued it to personnel using .357 revolvers. The guy said it was almost too effective. His words. It, by gum, WORKED! Both three and four-inch barrels were involved.
Of course, if you're loading a .38-only gun, that won't affect you...
I hope this is of help.
Last edited:
hkcavalier
US Veteran
It was a poor performer from both a snub and a 4" in Luckygunner's tests.
https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/revolver-ballistics-test/
The Federal 130gr HST Micro was MUCH better, arguably the best snub JHP choice. The Winchester 130gr loads were also very good.
I carry the HST Micro in my 442.
https://www.luckygunner.com/labs/revolver-ballistics-test/
The Federal 130gr HST Micro was MUCH better, arguably the best snub JHP choice. The Winchester 130gr loads were also very good.
I carry the HST Micro in my 442.
Flyingfool
Member
Has anyone ever thought about alternating ammo in the cylinder. Such as the micro HST for expansion and then another ammo for penetration?
The HST expands, but I wonder about penetration especially if it hits bone. It may just “splat”. But say a hollow semi wad cutter would not expand but smash through.
The HST expands, but I wonder about penetration especially if it hits bone. It may just “splat”. But say a hollow semi wad cutter would not expand but smash through.
s2harry
Member
Millions of times...they all wont hit bone...6 semi wad cutters leave the same size holes.
I think God Dot and the Micro are the best right now.
I think God Dot and the Micro are the best right now.
Last edited:
FWIW, I've done that in a 380 semi-auto, and a 9mm.
As long as both feed & fire reliably I can't see any disadvantage.
IAhunter
Member
I have shot and carried it, along with the Federal Premium LE 146 grain +P+ .38 Specials. Both loads are very accurate. I've read that the 129 gr. load didn't open so well. Shot mine away and carry the Gold Dot SB load now when I carry a .38. If the gun is a .357 mag, I load the 145 grain Winchester Silvertip load.
I have a couple of boxes of the Federal 146 load that I'm saving for old times sake.
I have a couple of boxes of the Federal 146 load that I'm saving for old times sake.
Last edited:
Texas Star
US Veteran
Has anyone here shot even a coyote or a raccoon with any of the loads discussed in this topic?
That might be very informative.
That might be very informative.
I shot the 129 Hyro Shok back in the 90's out of a M19 6" while
up in the northern Elko area, going through the high sage and rolling hills.
Naturally, I got off the horse to shoot but the few tries at "Yotes" that I had did not connect and I even missed a sitting dog at 80 yards on a crest of a hill.
When I used the Remington 125 SJHP ammo I was lucky enough to score two hits on trotting "Yotes" at around 60 yards.
I just never bought that type of Federal ammo again but I do like
their 158gr LRN for target practice and the HST for SD work.
It was also tested in a very old post called "Dynomite" something.....
that 29gr load did not do well in that snub nose test, either.
Might have be the best thing when it was brought out but it might
be made differently now and its has better ammo in front of it now.
Around here in Reno, it has the nick name.......
"Hydo sucks".
However it might work GREAT in your weapons.
One never knows.
up in the northern Elko area, going through the high sage and rolling hills.
Naturally, I got off the horse to shoot but the few tries at "Yotes" that I had did not connect and I even missed a sitting dog at 80 yards on a crest of a hill.
When I used the Remington 125 SJHP ammo I was lucky enough to score two hits on trotting "Yotes" at around 60 yards.
I just never bought that type of Federal ammo again but I do like
their 158gr LRN for target practice and the HST for SD work.
It was also tested in a very old post called "Dynomite" something.....
that 29gr load did not do well in that snub nose test, either.
Might have be the best thing when it was brought out but it might
be made differently now and its has better ammo in front of it now.
Around here in Reno, it has the nick name.......
"Hydo sucks".
However it might work GREAT in your weapons.
One never knows.
Buckeye63
Member
- Joined
- Jan 25, 2013
- Messages
- 238
- Reaction score
- 267
I agree about the 130gr HST ... It is my carry ammo in both my Charter Alumium frame 38spl revolvers ,,, these revolvers weigh in at 12.5 & 13 oz ... True lightweights ... But I have found the 130gr HST rounds comfortable to shoot ...even though these rounds are listed as +P .. recoil is mild when compared to other 38spl +P offerings ...
The Federal 38spl +P 130gr HST is a great carry option
I have shot a few and have a partial box remaining. Federal's 129-Gr.
JHP+P Hydra-Shok (P38HS1) has shown muzzle velocity of 841, muzzle
energy of 255, and penetration of over 18" clothed (from a 4" barrel).
Federal's ad said: "Federal's center-post design delivers controlled
expansion. A notched jacket provides energy transfer to penetrate
barriers, yet retains sufficient stopping power. Deep penetration of
this bullet satisfies F.B.I.'s stringent testing requirements."
JHP+P Hydra-Shok (P38HS1) has shown muzzle velocity of 841, muzzle
energy of 255, and penetration of over 18" clothed (from a 4" barrel).
Federal's ad said: "Federal's center-post design delivers controlled
expansion. A notched jacket provides energy transfer to penetrate
barriers, yet retains sufficient stopping power. Deep penetration of
this bullet satisfies F.B.I.'s stringent testing requirements."
Last edited:
The Hydra-Shok line is an old bullet design, there are much better bullets available today. Federal HST, Speer Gold Dot, Remington Golden Saber, and Winchester Ranger T-Series are all superior to the old Hydra-Shok.
dannyabear
Member
- Joined
- Oct 2, 2014
- Messages
- 159
- Reaction score
- 131
Speer 200 gr 'flying ashtray' is the way to go, kinda hard to find sometimes
RMFnLA
Member
Just as long as you don't hesitate at the crucial moment trying to decide if you have the "right" round for the situation...
Piwo
Member
Our department issued this load for about 10 years for secondary(personally owned and approved) revolvers. I had chronographed it at the time from a 4 inch bbl. revolver and if memory serves, it attained 870-900 fps. This was actually slightly slower than the load it replaced, W-W +p 158 gr. LSWC that clocked 925-980 fps. From my S&W 638 it would penetrate two 2x4s, sticking out of the second board, unexpanded. The SWC would carry on through. Not a valid test of anything as I was just messing around with the loads one day. The only known departmental shooting we had with this load that I know of involved an off duty officer who was being robbed. He shot the assailant twice with this load out of a S&W 642 at close range. Both bullets expanded well and the BG was DRT. We went to the W-W 130 gr. SXT and I am unaware of it ever being used in a gunfight as of yet.
Just as long as you don't hesitate at the crucial moment trying to decide if you have the "right" round for the situation...
I think there is a technique to make this a moot point.
Think DOUBLETAP!
Mike in Reedley
Member
Buffalo Bore .38 spl 158 SWCLHP non +P out of a 2” is an honest 850 FPS.
The same bullet but +P is making 1040 FPS from a 2” barrel. These 158
Bullets are a very soft lead alloy and are gas checked.
I have a hard time believing pistol bullets have enough velocity to expand reliably. I’d rather have heavier bullets at higher velocities.
The same bullet but +P is making 1040 FPS from a 2” barrel. These 158
Bullets are a very soft lead alloy and are gas checked.
I have a hard time believing pistol bullets have enough velocity to expand reliably. I’d rather have heavier bullets at higher velocities.
Harkrader
Member
Yes. Excellent stuff. One of my personal top choices and one I recommend to students.
