turnejm
Member
Question: When a pistol (Model 36 w/ 3 inch barrel) shoots 6-8 inches low at 10 yds, What's the general consensus for a repair?
Fixed Sight Point of Impact vs Point of Aim
- Thread starter turnejm
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deadin
US Veteran
Aim 6 to 8 inches higher?? 
(or file down the front sight)
(or stop anticipating recoil)
(or stop using +P)
(or file down the front sight)
(or stop anticipating recoil)
(or stop using +P)
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All these or heavier bullet...Aim 6 to 8 inches higher??
(or file down the front sight)
(or stop anticipating recoil)
(or stop using +P)
No, I'm not an "Expert" by any stretch of the term, but I would have to venture a guess that if you shoot 6 to 8 inches low with any handgun from 10 yards, you really don't have a good understanding of what your sight picture should be to start with, or you are somehow jerking the weapon with poor trigger control.
6 to 8" low/high/left/right/ from 10 feet is extreme for any handgun IMHO........
Practice, practice, practice, practice, after learning where your proper sight picture should be with your particular weapon and sights.
6 to 8" low/high/left/right/ from 10 feet is extreme for any handgun IMHO........
Practice, practice, practice, practice, after learning where your proper sight picture should be with your particular weapon and sights.
Dben002 is most likely correct, but it bears testing. Get a known good pistol shooter or two to test the gun WITH APPROPRIATE CARRY AMMO.
You should be aware of some additional facts:
1. Different-weight bullets usually shoot to different places. Even the same bullet with different loadings may shoot to different places.
2. Sometimes revolvers DO come from the factory with the sights wrong.
3. Particularly with a fairly light gun like the 36, point of impact (POI) can vary with hold. Change of grips can definitely affect POI. Final test should be with a realistic hold for sighted fire under the conditions dictated by the purpose of the gun.
Good luck! If it really is the gun, filing down the front sight IS the correct answer (GO SLOWLY!).
You should be aware of some additional facts:
1. Different-weight bullets usually shoot to different places. Even the same bullet with different loadings may shoot to different places.
2. Sometimes revolvers DO come from the factory with the sights wrong.
3. Particularly with a fairly light gun like the 36, point of impact (POI) can vary with hold. Change of grips can definitely affect POI. Final test should be with a realistic hold for sighted fire under the conditions dictated by the purpose of the gun.
Good luck! If it really is the gun, filing down the front sight IS the correct answer (GO SLOWLY!).
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Nothing too earthshaking to add.
- Most fixed sight .38 Special revolvers have their sights regulated for use with standard pressure 158 gr ammunition.
- Lighter bullets are faster and will exit the barrel sooner, before the muzzle has risen as much and as such they will shoot significantly lower. It's not unusual to see a 3"-4" low point of impact with 125 gr loads compared to 158 gr loads. If you were shooting 110 gr loads, 6" low would not be all that out of line for a properly regulated revolver.
- Tightening your grip before the shot breaks, and/or jerking the trigger, and/or anticipating the recoil and rolling your wrist forward will all cause the shots to impact low. Grips that fit you well and don't hurt or slip when you fire the revolver can help correct some of those shooter errors
- I would not do anything to the revolver until you've shot it with standard pressure 158 gr loads, and then if it's still shooting low, have an experienced revolver shooter who can shoot well test it for you.
- If the problem is the load, I suggest using a different load. If you really want a light load then adjust the point of aim. With 125 gr bullets in a .38, placing the front sight blade on the spot you want to bleed (rather than placing the top of the blade on the target) usually works to correct a low point of impact - and it generalizes well to defensive shooting.
- Most fixed sight .38 Special revolvers have their sights regulated for use with standard pressure 158 gr ammunition.
- Lighter bullets are faster and will exit the barrel sooner, before the muzzle has risen as much and as such they will shoot significantly lower. It's not unusual to see a 3"-4" low point of impact with 125 gr loads compared to 158 gr loads. If you were shooting 110 gr loads, 6" low would not be all that out of line for a properly regulated revolver.
- Tightening your grip before the shot breaks, and/or jerking the trigger, and/or anticipating the recoil and rolling your wrist forward will all cause the shots to impact low. Grips that fit you well and don't hurt or slip when you fire the revolver can help correct some of those shooter errors
- I would not do anything to the revolver until you've shot it with standard pressure 158 gr loads, and then if it's still shooting low, have an experienced revolver shooter who can shoot well test it for you.
- If the problem is the load, I suggest using a different load. If you really want a light load then adjust the point of aim. With 125 gr bullets in a .38, placing the front sight blade on the spot you want to bleed (rather than placing the top of the blade on the target) usually works to correct a low point of impact - and it generalizes well to defensive shooting.
Also, fixed sight guns are usually regulated for an on the target sight picture, versus a six o'clock picture used with target guns. If it is in fact the gun and not the shooter, then you need a heavier/slower bullet.
AZretired
Member
What weight bullets are you shooting? Are they +P or Standard?
Pisgah
Member
Not meaning to sound too overbearing but my answer would be -- learn how to shoot the gun.
Odds are extremely, infinitesimally small that there's anything to "repair" with the gun. Another style of grip more appropriate to your hand might be part of the answer, but the most likely cause is that your technique is wrong -- gripping and trigger control, sight picture -- or that you have an unconscious but consistent flinch. And those problems are solved by careful diagnosis and systematic training.
Fixed Sight POA
All, Thanks for all the advise that this thread has generated!
Using a free standing two hand hold, this pistol was putting 5 rounds in the space of a silver dollar at 10 yds, using square butt target grips. This pistol is a 36-1 square butt pistol. I'm using Winchester 130gr FMJs White Box range ammo, standard pressure. The sight picture I was using was centering the front blade in the rear notch and leveling the top of the front blade with the top of the rear notch. With that sight picture, point of impact was 6-8 inches below point of aim. This pistol has such a fine nickel plating, it would be shame to ruin the finish by altering the front sight!
All, Thanks for all the advise that this thread has generated!
Using a free standing two hand hold, this pistol was putting 5 rounds in the space of a silver dollar at 10 yds, using square butt target grips. This pistol is a 36-1 square butt pistol. I'm using Winchester 130gr FMJs White Box range ammo, standard pressure. The sight picture I was using was centering the front blade in the rear notch and leveling the top of the front blade with the top of the rear notch. With that sight picture, point of impact was 6-8 inches below point of aim. This pistol has such a fine nickel plating, it would be shame to ruin the finish by altering the front sight!
scooter123
Member
I would suggest that you try some 158 grain ammo. I have a 2 1/2 inch model 19 and being rather frugal my 38 special range reloads feature a 125 grain plated bullet. In order to regulate the sights on my model 19 I had to jack up the rear sight by about 1/8 inch and it does look a bit odd. However I find it easier to use a 6 o'clock hold for 158 grain magnum lights than to have to hold the front sight about the rear sight to hit well with my 125 grain reloads.
However none of will ever have identical preferences so you may find it easier to set the top of the front sight blade above the rear notch to gain the "windage" needed to place your shots where you want them.
However none of will ever have identical preferences so you may find it easier to set the top of the front sight blade above the rear notch to gain the "windage" needed to place your shots where you want them.
Abbynormal
Member
If with your grip and trigger shoots X inches (high, low, left, right), compansate
to it until you learn better and why. So adapt your style to Kentucky windage,
and pull the same distance H-L-L-R until your group is centered!
Adapt and adjust as changes in: wind, bullet weight, grip, load, stocks, etc, change.
to it until you learn better and why. So adapt your style to Kentucky windage,
and pull the same distance H-L-L-R until your group is centered!
Adapt and adjust as changes in: wind, bullet weight, grip, load, stocks, etc, change.
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