Gun Auction Madness

Exiled Cheesehead

Exiled Cheesehead

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I went to a gun auction this weekend as there looked to be a good variety of items in the listing I saw. I called the auctioneer prior to the sale to get more information as I had to travel some distance for the sale. I was told that there were "many" guns for sale with their original boxes and that the price to be paid would be the hammer amount plus the sales tax plus a small amount for each gun transferred by the local FFL dealer. Seemed straight-forward or so I thought.

When I arrived at the auction, I realized that the word "many" in relation to guns with the correct original boxes amounted to 6 S&Ws, 1 Colt, 2 Uberti's, 2 Bond Arms, 1 Hermitage, 1 Walter, and 4 or 5 Henry rifles out of 80+ firearms. I will add that the number of revolvers and pistols with mis-matched and non-original boxes exceeded those with the correct boxes. The best example of this was a 4" Colt Python that was sold in a S&W wood presentation case with replacement foam inserts. Plus, there was a set of used S&W tools that went with the Python?

Even more disappointing was that the auctioneer announced immediately before the start of the sale that quite a few of the guns had reserves on them and would not sell unless the number was met. This was not mentioned anywhere in the ad nor did he tell me this over the phone. I was not happy, to say the least......

During the sale, I noticed quite a few people get up and leave after one S&W 27-2 and two 29-2s didn't meet their reserves. Plus, I heard quite a few comments being made by my fellow bidders over "the best' items having reserves.

While I was paying for the item I bought, one of the auction people asked me if I had any interest in the guns that didn't meet the reserve, and if so, how much would I be willing to pay? I told him that I did have interest, but the amounts I would be willing to pay would be less than the highest bids they got that didn't meet the reserve. The conversation ended very quickly.

Have any of you ever encountered these types of situations at auctions? I have been to quite a few auctions over the years and this is the first time I had ever run into such antics. The whole thing seemed bush-league to me?

I won't be attending any more auctions held by this company.
 
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We have a large local action house here in east Las Vegas.

A few years ago I went to one of their auction advertising guns.

I examined two of the rifles.

A parts M1 that looked to have been left outside for a few decades and then used as a shovel and a Win M94 in worse condition.

I left disappointed.

Back to gunbroker for me.
 
The thing to watch for in auctions are the hidden fees. Besides the usual sales taxes, NICS or whatever. More often than not, auction houses charge a "buyer's premium" which is an additional fee paid to the auction house for selling the item. Many auctions don't mention this in advance or only briefly hit on it at the very beginning. Normal "buyer's premiums" run 10 to 15 % of the final bid price. However, I have seen some run all the way up to 25%.
And its not just guns, this is the way many other type auctions also work. Especially vehicles. I've seen many a happy buyer think they got a great deal only to become really pissed when all the "fees" are added up and they discover that they are paying way too much. :mad:
 
I have never attended a live auction or certainly not in recent memory. I did bid in an online auction and won 2 .22/.32 HFT's from Amoskeag in NH. As stated in addition to the price, there was a house fee of 17% IIRC. Not a huge deal as it was only slightly more than a transfer fee at a local FFL or sales tax if purchased in my home state.

I too would probably stick with GB as I have done very well there. I wish that there were local auctions or estate sales around here but I'm not familiar with any. :(
 
I once bought a farm and log house at an auction clearly posted "Absolute", only to find out my bid did not meet the reserve.

I expect I could have forced the sale by hiring a lawyer, but upon further reflection, I decided I didn't want the place as badly as I first thought, so I let it go.
 
Gunbroker is no better than the shady auctions mentioned above.

No reserve but starting at $xxx.xx

The $xxx.xx is more often than not the max I'd want to pay for it or over my estimated value.

The 15 minute rule is not designed for the buyer when it allows new bidders in.

I look but never buy on GB.There's nothing I want badly enough to help drive prices up in my beloved hobby.

Local sales doing a FTF is where I look and buy/sell
 
The 3 local auction companies here run clean & clear sales. Once in awhile there will be a reserve on a few items but it is always announced at the beginning of the sale. I don't know if they would tell you on the phone about any reserves or not. Usually the reserves are on cars or boats.
Guns sell sky high. Very seldom any quality handguns come up on auctions. Generally shotguns as this area is big on waterfowl & pheasant hunting.
 
Maybe I'm sort of lucky as we have 3 different auction houses who have 2 to 3 "Sporting Goods" auctions a year. These will be from 300 to over 500 guns at a time. One auctioneer will let a customer put a "reserve" on an item but the others won't and advertise as an absolute auction. Two of the auctions are connected to Proxibid, and they charge a 17% fee for guns bought on line and shipped, but no up charge for local bidders who pick up their guns (after the appropriate waiting period). What is kind of in the benefit of the locals (will often be 200+ local bidders) is the descriptions o line and photo's on line are not the best, on line bidders are somewhat handicapped. I go the day prior and look over in detail anything I am interested in, it's only 35 miles. There is seldom one of these that I can't find something I want, and often able to bid high enough to get it.
 
Even though I hate the GB 15 minute rule, I find myself buying/selling many of my guns there.
I don't mind the 15 minute rule when I'm selling however :)
Main reason I like ebay and can do some sniping there.
 
That doesn't sound like antics, 18 guns qualifies as "many" to me. Maybe it wouldn't if you're one of these collectors who own a hundred or so. And dang, 80+ firearms? That's more than the few auctions I've been to, combined.

I've never bought anything from live auctions, guns or accessories or motor vehicles, as the prices were as high or higher than I could've bought the items for through regular channels. Maybe it was auction fever or something, but I couldn't figure out why people tended to bid so high.
 
There are not a lot of auctioneers that I would release my wallet to shake their hand!

Mom has been in the antique business for 60+ years. She started with common items and worked her way up to art work. Nobody can know everything! But she found the bigger the mouth on an auctioneer, the less they really knew. She has made many very profitable purchases from Know-it-alls!

Ivan
 
I have only purchased 2 guns at auction before in my entire life...
first one was at a 2 ring auction... so much stuff they ran it in 2 buildings at the same time... guns in one and accessories in the other... was just there to watch, and some stuff went so cheap I went and got a number... picked up a Remington smoothbore 22 pump silly cheap... saw that the T/C contenders and H&R's were next and sat thru them... they went for stupid money... I did not know of any H&R that would be worth $500... I gave up and took my 22 home... second one was my uncle's estate auction... managed to get one of his shotguns as a memento... decent price... was the first gun for sale... the rest went stupid again... sold a broken Crosman pellet gun for $60... could have gotten one new at wally world for $30.. and my uncle's Remington 870 "tractor gun" went for over $500... maybe worth $300 on a good day... I have since given up any attempt at buying at an auction...
 
You should have sat through the Darnell collection auctions here in NV. I saw just about every level of lunacy in that period. Highly collectible guns went cheap, junkers fetched silly money and every kind of deal in between.

The "hidden" fees are not usually hidden, you just have to READ the auction conditions and know your state laws. For example, I had not been to an auction of any kind for some years until this weekend and was surprised to find they charge sales tax.

That wasn't the case during the Darnell frenzy, but there was still a buyer's premium and a transfer fee. I had a spreadsheet giving me the real cost for a given bid. The guy behind me who bid $375 on a tatty Model 19 didn't, and was very grumpy when he got back from paying.
 
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I went to a Sheriff's auction way back in the last century (when they did such things). Probably 200 guns and other assorted items. I got a Stevens 12 ga pump for $35 and a Winchester .44mag levergun for $135 (also a 650 cc Kawasaki for $100). People were bidding crazy money for the desirable guns, like new retail+ 50%. I don't understand what gets into "I gotta have it" folks. Joe
 
I have bought and sold ALOT of guns on GB. The one marketing tactic I don't understand is starting some thing at .01 cent and THEN setting a reserve. I have seen as high as 30+ bids on things that never meet reserve? What the heck is that? If you are worried about somebody stealing it [that does not happen anymore], just start it off at your lowest acceptable price and let it go. First bid you are covered, the rest, if any, is gravy. Also, if you are expecting a stupid price and start it off at that, then the serious buyers can quit wasting time and move on. The Woodlawn Boys always run Penny auctions with NO reserve. They sell every item and help all of us in knowing what something is "worth".
 
The person who first figured out that they could charge a "buyer's premium" and people would actually pay it must have giggled all the way to the bank. So, I'm going to buy something from you for a determined price, then I'm going pay you more just for the privilege of buying something from you? What a deal!!!! I'm tellin' you, it's genius!!!!
 
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