HELP - 4506-1 SLIDE WALL BROKEN?

[UNCLE PAULY]

Bought a 4506-1 on April 22nd on GB and after 107 days wait for Maryland's 7 day background check got to pick up from FFL on August 7th (yesterday).

Stripped gun to clean and found what looks to be a piece broken off the slide wall (recoil spring housing). It measures roughly 1/16 - 1/8" wide and 1/4" deep. It looks as if someone in the past tried to pry the barrel out and broke thin wall between the recoil spring housing and the barrel housing of the slide.

View attachment 122552

Curious thing is I found a picture of a 4506 (no dash) slide with similar problem:

View attachment 122553

One other thing, the recoil spring that came in the gun was excessively long and strong. When compared to a 14lbs. factory standard WOLFF replacement it measured 3/4" longer and was a larger gauge wire:

View attachment 122555

Will this broken piece affect the performance of the gun? Will the barrel move around more because of this gap in the wall? I would guess this could affect the accuracy of the gun.

Looking at it I don't think it's a safety issue, but I could be wrong. I will show it to a gunsmith and get his opinion, but thought I'd ask for your help also. Anyone else experience this on a 4506-1?

No chance of refund or reimbursement as it's been over 4 months and seller had stated no refund or return policy in GB ad. 2nd used gun bought on GB and problems with both.

Thanks for any help you can give, Paul

 

[BLUEBELLYYANKEE]

I have seen that on a few 3rd gens over the years. It is normal.

 

[SMSgt]

Shouldn't affect function or accuracy, but you do need to round out the corners and edges to prevent further cracking. The barrel is fixed by the bushing. That part only surrounds the recoil spring. What most likely happened is somewhere along the line, the recoil spring hung up on the lip of the opening during reassembly and caused it to break.

Most new springs are longer than used springs which have been under compression for who knows how long. I've never had a problem of any sort with Wolff springs.

 

[UNCLE PAULY]

Most new springs are longer than used springs which have been under compression for who knows how long. I've never had a problem of any sort with Wolff springs.

The longer/heavier spring was in the gun when I bought it. The shorter spring in the picture is brand new, out of the bag Wolff 14lbs. (factory standard) I had. I always change out the springs on a used gun.

 

[18DAI]

I've got one 4506-1 that has similar shoddy workmanship in the same spot Uncle Paulie. It runs like a champ.

No worries there. Regards 18DAI

 

[UNCLE PAULY]

I've got one 4506-1 that has similar shoddy workmanship in the same spot Uncle Paulie. It runs like a champ.

No worries there. Regards 18DAI

Thanks, I was hoping to hear from you.

 

[UNCLE PAULY]

Thanks guys!

"SMSgt" I'll take your advice and lightly round the sharp corners with a dremel.

 

[Aguila9]

I've seen this numerous times on older NYCPD duty weapons. That piece came of during manufacture. Since it will not affect weapon function S&W let many of their weapons leave the factory like that.

Some minor miscalculation during machining. You don't see it on any later production models.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

 

[cpeblue]

Uncle Pauly, put your mind at ease , there is nothing wrong with the gun . It's just a very thine spot from machining (on yours it's so thine it's not there ) They should have machined that spot out but that would have taken time. here are some pictures of 3 slides , the one on the right is from a 4003 the middle a 4566 the left a Sig p220 , you can see Sig spent a little more time than Smith . The pictures should explain themselves.

 

[Fastbolt]

Not uncommon and normal. I remember being surprised by seeing this in some early 3rd gen guns, so I asked about it.

One guy who used to teach the armorer class many years ago told me it's called a 4 degree free cut to let you lift up the barrel out of the slide for disassembly. Newer guns have shorter spring boxes and nicely beveled cuts at that spot. (The bevel - located on the "top" of the spring box cut, underneath the barrel - is still needed to allow the barrels to be lifted out of the slides, and then reinstalled/lowered back in the slides.)

New machining methods have changed a number of ways the slides are being made.

Off the top of my head, I can think of some other things that looked like "problems" the first time I paid enough attention to observe them, but I was assured they were normal by different folks at the factory (repair techs, engineers, armorer training, etc) ...

The bottom of the extractor recess cut in the 9/.40 guns - viewed from the bottom of the slide, to the right of the pick-up rail - could develop a curving "crack" at the rear of the machined cut visible to the right of the pick-up rail. It stopped when it reached the outside edge of the pick-up rail channel. The small bit of thin extractor recess "floor" wasn't removed behind the end of the narrow cut, and recoil forces could eventually cause this thin bit of steel to fracture and crack. It would usually either break off and fall away, or remain in place, neither of which caused problems. Later manufacturing methods allowed them to remove this bit of thin material from the bottom of the extractor recess when it was cut.

A small bit of triangular shaped thin metal on one side of the disconnector cut, created when a juncture of some machine cuts was done, could break out from recoil forces and fall free. When it happened, one side of the disconnector cut looked "open", but the other side was thicker and remained "solid". Again, newer machining methods let it be removed on the side that was thin.

Another bit of thin steel created when the ejector depressor plunger channel and the firing pin channel are cut could allow for a crack to form (recoil forces) between them, toward the rear in the manual safety assembly cut. It could be seen when the manual safety assembly was removed from the slide. I first saw it just a few years ago in a new production 4513TSW. Thinking I'd found a problem, I called back (as an armorer) and spoke with someone about it. The gentleman explained the engineers had decided it was easier to deliberately machine the "crack", eliminating a stress spot, removing any excess steel during production, than to wait for it to happen during normal shooting as the result of normal recoil forces. It had been incorporated in the .45 models of the current production TSW's but was planned to be incorporated into the rest of the TSW's in the near future.

You just never know what you're going to find as they make changes to both equipment and manufacturing methods over time and you start to look very closely at different guns.

Just some of the things I've heard over the years ...

 

[UNCLE PAULY]

THANKS AGAIN to all that answered.

As a designer/draftsman in aerospace engineering for 31+ years I've seen machining practices change a lot. But where I work this would be a fail all day long and the slide would be tossed into the recycle bin.

Paul

 

[Fastbolt]

I can understand your perspective based upon your career experience in a field that places a very high demand on consistent precision.

S&W has invested many tens of millions of dollars on newer equipment since the introduction of the 3rd gen pistols (not just for the 3rd gen guns, of course).

The manufacturing tolerances and precision continually improved throughout 3rd gen production, with the current ones benefiting from greatly improved tolerances and precision in manufacturing.

The newest ones make the early 90's gun look rather crude, by comparison.

Some of the older ones could have some cuts and machining that were rougher than a cobb. (But they still ran well, though.)

 

[cpeblue]

Just another comparison here . This is the slide of a 2005 Sig 220 stainless , granted a production pistol not a hand made like a Wilson or Baer. It has some of the best machining I've seen on a production pistol and it has the same 'problem' as your 4506. On the German made slide they opened that section up but not so on the American made slide. By the way , that pistol is still as tight as a drum and moves like it has roller bearings.