Hi looking for info on older .38

[riadat]

Picked this up at a pawn store. Traded a beretta .25 for it. Probably a bad trade but i am consolidating calibers and i like it.

Regardless. It is a 4 screw pre model 10 .38 special 4 inch blue with the serial number 316067 It has diamond shaped grips which seem to be pretty old and they have a gold medalion.

Someone carved two notches in the grip at some point. Was thinking some kid who watched too many westerns or potentially, if this old enough, something from one of the wars?

Timing and lock up are good. Lots of holster wear and some surface rust and dings.

 

[Muley Gil]

Welcome to the Forum.

This a WW I era .38 Military & Police. Depending on your view, collectors call this either a Model of 1902 (which has a round butt) or a round butt Model 1905. Someone else will narrow down the approximate shipping date for you.

S&W didn't assign model numbers until 1957. The internals on S&W revolvers changed several times before then.

 

[riadat]

Wow interesting here is a picture of the notches.

 

[JP@AK]

It dates from late summer, 1919 - very likely August or September. The serial number is roughly 600 numbers lower than the unit that received the first heat treated cylinder. That occurred in September, 1919.

The old girl is in pretty decent shape. As far as I'm concerned you made an excellent trade. This is a lot more gun than a practically useless .25 caliber semi-auto.

 

[OLDSTER]

Hi from North Dakota . Nice old M&P.

 

[riadat]

So we got out of ww2 in 1918 so nobody carried this into ww1. Thanks for the info. Not heat treated? I can shoot federal 158 grain lrn standard pressure .38 special in it right? i wont shoot +p

 

[Muley Gil]

WW I ended in 1918, so your revolver wasn't present. The military standard handgun was the Colt 1911 and the secondary standards were the Colt 1917 and the S&W 1917, both of which used the .45 ACP cartridge in half moon clips. There is no telling what non-issue handguns were carried.

Standard velocity 158 grain lead .38 special rounds will be fine and should shoot to point of aim.

 

[Absalom]

So we got out of ww2 in 1918 so nobody carried this into ww1. Thanks for the info. Not heat treated? I can shoot federal 158 grain lrn standard pressure .38 special in it right? i wont shoot +p

Yes. Any standard Special loads are fine. The benefit of heat treating is also often exaggerated; it just makes it more durable over time, but the earlier ones from before aren‘t in any danger of blowing up unless they‘re maltreated. And it’s never a good idea to shoot +P out of a gun this old anyway; you don‘t know what previous owners may have done.

 

[daddio202]

Welcome and that's a very nice oldie you got there with what looks like honest wear. May not have been used in WW 1 but possibly got those 2 marks in the WW2 time frame, no way to know for sure though. You can shoot all regular 38 special ammo in it, just stay away from +p. Enjoy

 

[riadat]

Welcome and that's a very nice oldie you got there with what looks like honest wear. May not have been used in WW 1 but possibly got those 2 marks in the WW2 time frame, no way to know for sure though. You can shoot all regular 38 special ammo in it, just stay away from +p. Enjoy

I suppose it could have gone to ww 2. Thanks for all the help guys. Have lots of smiths. Combat masterpiece 67-1, and the 43c .22 j-frame and the 340 pd is my regular carry. I tend to load all those with standard pressure stuff.

I just love the history of old guns. Have two older guns, a H&R .32 American and an Argentine mauser which is like 125 years old.

But i shoot all my guns! No safe queens here.

 

[Waveski]

Take a good look at the side plate screws - they look untouched. That is an indicator I always look for. The overall bluing is pretty darn good too.
You have a very nice example of an early Military & Police. (1905)
I'd be proud to have that one.

Out of curiosity - what model of 25 cal Beretta did you trade , if I may ask?

 

[riadat]

21a in .25 acp. I threw in my old 25 ammo and pawn store owner threw in some ammo in calibers im keeping.

 

[deyomatic]

Also, it's a 5 screw because you count the one on the front of the trigger guard, too. Very nice.

 

[Peak53]

The two notches equals two rabbits??

 

[Waveski]

Ah. I am partial to Berettas , but the 21a Bobcat is not on my list of favorites. A vintage M&P on the other hand ...

Nice trade.

 

[DWalt]

S&W would have called yours a Military and Police (M&P) Model, round butt. The Model of 19xx terminology was dropped by them prior to WWI. Surprisingly, I show your SN 316067 listed as having been shipped in October 1919, but have no other information about it. At this late date, no one (other than the person who added them) could tell you the meaning of the two notches.

 

[riadat]

I think it is interesting how guns hold their value better than almost anything else. Can you imagine if someone had purchased this weapon 100 years ago and then handed it down to their family. The value of that purchase is amazing. I obviously have other firearms but i would not feel helpless if this was my bedside gun. 100 years later! In a similar way, my 125 year old argentine mauser would be quite effective in taking a deer or for whatever application a modern rifle would be used for in similar caliber.

 

[THREEDFLYER]

You did well sir, congrats!!!