Hornady 147gr FMJ-BT in 357Sig?

[ThaDoubleJ]

I recently discovered these Hornady bullets, they've got a boat tail, load like a rifle bullet, and I've been using them in my M&P9 for suppressed rounds. I finally found the M&P357 I've been after, should be here tomorrow, and I'm putting a reloading plan together. Seems there are a couple tricks to reloading the 357, with proper neck tension being a big problem. Anyone heard of using, or used, the Hornadys in the 357? Seems that since you don't have to expand the case mouth with them, they should eliminate the neck tension issue. Just don't know about COAL and crimping and such.

 

[blujax01]

I recently started reloading the 357 Sig and there are two distinct schools of thought on it.

(1) It is like any other handgun cartridge, you should use a 3 die set, and you should expand the case mouth.
(2) It is a shouldered cartridge and you should use boat tailed bullets, a 2 die set, and not expand the case mouth.

I read a lot before making my choice. There was a lot of back-and-forth concerning the 2 vs 3 die set, the specifics of the Hornady 3 die set, and the fact that everyone who chose the RCBS 2-die loved them. (I find out now that is not a universal truth).

And there are some who think the caliber was invented for no other reason than to create an eternal argument on how to reload them!

I also learned that this caliber is prone to bullet setback, a proper crimp is essential in an auto feeder and to be extra careful.

I chose (2) and bought the RCBS 2 die set. I did not care for their roll crimp so I bought a Dillon taper crimp die. Others swear by (and some at) the Lee Factory Crimp Die.

I pass along the caution that was told me - make up a dummy, load it into a mag, and hand cycle it. Then check for bullet set back.

Have fun and be safe.

 

[fredj338]

Loss of neck tension really has nothing to do with flaring. Just make sure your expander is not over size. ).353-0.354" should work, smaller is better. FWIW, yes, the 147gr shoot fine in the 357sig.

 

[ThaDoubleJ]

This thread may be moot as USPS has lost my M&P for the time being. Hopefully it turns up. I've decided I'll try the Hornady 3 die set this go round, as I've never tried those dies and heard some good things. I'm also a firm believer in the Lee FCD, have it for almost everything I reload, and plan to use it for this round as well. Figured I'd just load them like 223 and see what happens. I had just heard some rumors that RN bullets don't work that well, and you need a trunicated (sp?) cone. I really enjoy not expanding or crimping my 9mm rounds with the Hornady, was hoping to get away with the same thing in 357.

 

[fredj338]

This thread may be moot as USPS has lost my M&P for the time being. Hopefully it turns up. I've decided I'll try the Hornady 3 die set this go round, as I've never tried those dies and heard some good things. I'm also a firm believer in the Lee FCD, have it for almost everything I reload, and plan to use it for this round as well. Figured I'd just load them like 223 and see what happens. I had just heard some rumors that RN bullets don't work that well, and you need a trunicated (sp?) cone. I really enjoy not expanding or crimping my 9mm rounds with the Hornady, was hoping to get away with the same thing in 357.

Not a rumor at all. RN bullets over 100gr, will not have enough bearing surface for proper neck tension. So it's RP or rnfp or tchp for best results in the 357sig. With a true flat base, like the 124gr xtp, you'll often collapse case of you don't flare. With plated or lead, you'll shave bullet bases, not good for accuracy. I flare & crimp, my ammo works fine in 3diff guns.

 

[scooter123]

I pass along the caution that was told me - make up a dummy, load it into a mag, and hand cycle it. Then check for bullet set back.

Have fun and be safe.

I've never seen any factory ammunition that didn't have some amount of a taper crimp and IMO that is a bit telling. If Winchester, Remington, Speer, & Federal believe that semi auto ammuntion should be crimped I am going to crimp any ammunition I make.

As for testing the crimp as suggested above, I make up a dummy round and chamber that dummy 10 times by dropping the slide. Then I measure the overall length and if the change in length is less than 0.010 inch I call that crimp setup good.

BTW, you don't need to test a crimp every time you load a batch of ammo with a particular bullet, just the very first time you load that particular bullet. As a rule of thumb I've found that a crimp that produces a case edge diameter 0.003 inch smaller than the diameter at the bullet swell works just fine and won't cause any harm to a plated bullet. Yeah, if you pull that plated bullet you'll see a slight ring but at 60 feet I haven't had any issues with accuracy.

 

[ThaDoubleJ]

Well, I just seated the Hornady bullet to 1.145" COAL with my 5.7 dies in a dummy round, and there's a pretty substantial gap around the case mouth at the ogive, so that idea is a bust. My M&P is still lost by the PO anyway, so I guess I got time...

Edit: My M&P turned up, in Springfield, MA. I live outside of Denver...

 

[ThaDoubleJ]

The internet says Berry's HPs can be used in the 357, that true? What weight? If it's 125s, wouldn't they exceed the 1250fps limit?

 

[colt_saa]

This thread may be moot as USPS has lost my M&P for the time being. Hopefully it turns up. I've decided I'll try the Hornady 3 die set this go round, as I've never tried those dies and heard some good things. I'm also a firm believer in the Lee FCD, have it for almost everything I reload, and plan to use it for this round as well. Figured I'd just load them like 223 and see what happens. I had just heard some rumors that RN bullets don't work that well, and you need a trunicated (sp?) cone. I really enjoy not expanding or crimping my 9mm rounds with the Hornady, was hoping to get away with the same thing in 357.

The LEE FCD is a great add on for the 357SIG. It is a collet crimp and works fantastic. I even load 88 grain JHPs with no trouble.

ALL of the Hornady 9MM XTP projectiles work well in the 357SIG

 

[Tex1001]

The internet says Berry's HPs can be used in the 357, that true? What weight? If it's 125s, wouldn't they exceed the 1250fps limit?

Berry's makes thick plated 124 gr. bullets that can be pushed above 1250 fps.
Do NOT try to use Remington Golden Sabre bullets! Short case neck and bullet construction will ALWAYS cause bullet setback in the 357Sig.
Try Hodgdon's Longshot or Ramshot Silhouette for velocity with no pressure signs.
Check this thread for 357Sig reloading tips:
http://smith-wessonforum.com/reloading/382787-who-reloads-357-sig-here.html
_______________________
I don't have Alzheimer's- My wife had me tested.

 

[ThaDoubleJ]

Colt, Hornady confirmed this today, thanks.

Tex, I'll keep an eye out for those Berry's.

PSA: Don't ship handguns via USPS. Mine has gone from PA to CO to MA to NJ now and has been sitting in the NJ sort for 2 days. This is a priority package, now 7 days in transit, and will complete four 2/3 trans continental trips, assuming it doesn't go to AK or OR next, before I ever see it. Ugh.

 

[ThaDoubleJ]

Update: I finally got the pistol, it's awesome, although it has the old, blued mags that will rust. Hopefully the slide doesn't rust like my M&P9 did, but so far so good. I ended up with the Hornady dies, the Lee FCD, and got a smokin deal on some 147gr XTPs, which have the boat tail. They're so pretty, it's hard to plink with them, but they're also so easy to load. Overall, just as happy with the 357 as I am with the 9, just had to adjust my style a bit for the snappier recoil.

 

[Magload]

When I was much younger all guns rusted if you didn't take care of them. Nothing like a saltwater duck hunt to rust a gun.

 

[ThaDoubleJ]

Roger that, I just found it odd that something stamped "stainless" would rust in Colorado. It's dry as a bone here. They replaced the slide, no rust since, but the sights and controls still rust if I don't watch em.

 

[colt_saa]

ALL revolvers can be stained by RUST when not properly cared for

Some just Stain Less than others