How many rounds to make cylinder really dirty?

Ruger1911Fan

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I have a 686 that I bought (used) a couple of weeks ago. Even though I had only put about 25 rounds through it I gave the gun a thorough cleaning and the cylinder looked spotless.

Today I shot 30 rounds of Remington UMC 38 Special. When I looked at the cylinder face I couldn't believe how dirty it was. I cut off about 1/3 of a lead remover cloth I had picked up and finally got it clean again. The cloth was covered in black on both sides when I was done. I'm guessing I should throw that away?

Is this normal or was this just a case of some very dirty ammo?
 
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Depends on the ammo....

The same level of load can be very dirty or very clean depending on the powder used and the bullet lubricant. If I make medium loads from 2400 powder it doesn't take too many shots to make a mess.

I'm surprised that a decent brand would make such dirty ammo, but it's definitely the ammo and not your gun. The 686 is one sweet shooter.
 
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Hard to know how dirty your gun actually was. I’m pretty dirt tolerant. Other folks go nuts over quite trivial soot.

The dirt and grime you describe is not detrimental to your gun or it’s function. It is a purely cosmetic matter.


You will get some powder fouling from just one shot.

Some ammo is dirtier than other ammo but without photos it’s hard to determine whether you experienced a quantity of dirt and soot that’s out of the order.
 
I was able to push 250 rounds of dirty unique handloads in a class before my 442 cylinder started gumming up. Same for the LCR. I don't consider it dirty until it starts to gum up.
 
I was at a demo/show in Wisconsin
a long time ago and Jerry Miculek was
giving a demonstration of his skills.

He was using a Model 686. The flutes
were all blackened as was half the raised
parts of the cylinder. He'd been giving
a lot of demonstrations that day.

And he was shooting about as fast as I'd
ever seen.

Later I read an article by him that it's the
innards of a revolver that count, not the
outside.

And I also read another time he used a .38
casing to scrape away the crud in the flutes.

Now that man knows what's it's like to get
a revolver dirty.
 
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Revolvers are going to get dirty. If you want a pristine revolver, leave it in the safe. If you are going to shoot revolvers it is just something you have to live with. I don't bother to "polish" off the front of the cylinder, just clean of fouling. The burn marks will just return every time you shoot it.
 
I've shot many hundreds (well, thousands) of rounds of Remington UMC 38sp FMJ. Yes, they are dirty, but not any more than other range ammo I use, which I generally choose based on price.

My revolvers are all stainless, so all the dirt is immediately visible.

No, I do not reload, and do not live in an environment where that is possible.

The cleanest commercial 38sp I've found is Winchester Ranger 38sp+P Bonded JHP. It is marketed as LEO use, but as most departments have moved away from 38/357, there is a lot of old stock. I've bought it on sale for as little as $14.99/50 (+tax) at a local LE supply.
 
I cut off about 1/3 of a lead remover cloth I had picked up and finally got it clean again. The cloth was covered in black on both sides when I was done. I'm guessing I should throw that away?

Is this normal or was this just a case of some very dirty ammo?

I reuse the lead remover cloth, by re-wrapping it in the plastic sheet it comes in. As long as the cloth is damp, there is some of the chemical cleaner on it and it is still effective.

I get all the loose soot off first with Hoppes before I finish off the stubborn lead with the cloth. It is not necessary for the function of the gun to keep it spotless, but I do.

Some ammo is much more sooty than other ammo.
 
I reuse the lead remover cloth, by re-wrapping it in the plastic sheet it comes in. As long as the cloth is damp, there is some of the chemical cleaner on it and it is still effective.

I get all the loose soot off first with Hoppes before I finish off the stubborn lead with the cloth. It is not necessary for the function of the gun to keep it spotless, but I do.

Some ammo is much more sooty than other ammo.

Saved me typing :)
The same here.
 
In theory you can reuse the dirty “lead away” cloth, but the thought of all that grime and grit going back on the finish...I suck it up and throw away the little 1” squares I use for cleaning. They are not that expensive (and I have been told I may be cheap :)).
 
A bit of a drift here--------not much.

I don't have the first clue about which brand of ammo/powder makes for the worst powder fouling. I do have a clue about lead fouling----especially in this case.

Pretty much immediately after I read the terms "686" and "38 Special", my teeth started to hurt. Now just to make sure the cause of my teeth hurting was what I thought it was, I checked. Sure enough---a "686" is chambered for .357 Magnum cartridges. There is no doubt you can fire .38 Special cartridges in a .357 Magnum revolver. They will go bang---they will make a hole. The hole is unlikely to be exactly where it should be, but it's a hole. If "close enough" is okay with you, you can stop reading. Otherwise---------------------

It is an established fact that the longer the throat, the worse the accuracy. The throat for a .38 Special in a Magnum chamber is 1/10" longer than in a .38 Special chamber. That's not much in distance---try it in percentage increase. More to the point-------there's a "shoulder" in a .357 chamber. It sits about that same 1/10" ahead of a .38 Special bullet. I think "shoulder" is the proper term---I think of it as a scraper. It scrapes lead from the .38 Special bullet when it passes---a little or a lot. Two things just happened: The first is you just sent a defective bullet into the barrel-----and then out of the barrel. The second is you just introduced some superfluous lead into the picture. That lead is going to end up on the cylinder face and/or in the barrel---maybe even out of the barrel---if you're lucky. Of course, luck has nothing to do with any of this; because you put that .38 Special round in that Magnum chamber on purpose. You might want to think about that purpose.

I shoot for accuracy---best accuracy. It got to the point where it almost stopped being fun, and started to be work----that quest for accuracy----but it was most certainly enlightening.

It starts with a rest----a machine rest. Call Brownells and get one. They cost next to nothing---compared to a 686---probably less than half.

Get enlightened. Learn how to make holes where you want holes.

Ralph Tremaine

As an aside, and speaking of getting enlightened, get a hold of a custom .38 Special target revolver from the 50's-60's. The cylinder's going to be essentially the same length as the cartridge case. The (wadcutter) bullet is going to sit flush with the end of the cylinder (and obviously the barrel is set back to suit). The throat length is going to be----let's call it ZERO. Test that combination in your rest. Same church, different pew: Sit and stare at a New Model #3 Target revolver (38-44 S&W caliber-------and its cartridge----the first 38-44-------these from the late 1880's). The cartridge case is the same length as the cylinder (the bullet's seated inside---considerably inside). I'm told this combination was/is the most accurate revolver ever made (factory made). I'm told it set records yet to be broken. I never tried to check that claim out. I also never tried to test that revolver/cartridge combination. I have one of those revolvers----and some ammo------but. But I have only two rounds of the ammo----and they cost me $15----each-----20-30 years ago. They're just to look at.
 
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It depends on the ammo...some is dirtier than others but my experience is 5 shots will dirty a gun....not to extent of causing functioning problems but dirty enough to notice.
Ammo with lead bullets is dirtier than jacketed, bullet lube combined with powder residue is grungy....22 LR's is the dirtiest of all ammo.
Just wipe it off and carry on, there is no spotless burning ammo that I know of...yet.

I mix up a gallon of Ed's Red Bore Cleaner , it's a cheap DIY cleaner , and use the cleaner liberally and often.
Gary
 
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About 500 or so usually does it for me:
dirty.jpg

Still shot perfectly well, however.
 
I shoot revolvers(all S&W) in USPSA or IDPA matches regularly. The night before the match I give the cylinder a brush-out, Clean under the extractor, wipe the crud off the cylinder front and the breech face and I'm good to go.

Another Jerry Miculek story: I was on Jerry's squad at a match at PASA Park some years ago(we both were shooting revos). I noticed his gun was heavily begrimed and kidded him about it. He just grinned at me and said: That's not dirt, it's PATINA.
 
Congrats on the new 686! Shoot it until it's good and dirty. I usually clean mine at about 500 rounds. I only do it then so it's not to hard to clean as I'm lazy. I do however, wipe the outside of my revolvers down after every range visit.
 
I fired 300 357 magnum target rounds loaded with 4.0gr of Titegroup and a 158gr hard cast SWC 2 days ago out of a 2 1/2" 686-4.

Most soot cleans off easily with a Rem Oil Wipe and the gun will continue to fire.

My hands get a bit of black GSR on them that comes off with the baby wipes I carry in my range bag.

Back at the ranch the cylinder comes out and into a Marvel Mystery Oil bath while the rest of the revolver a bore scrub and wipe down with Pro 7.

After a day in the MMO the cylinder holes get scrubbed with a 40cal brush,the burn marks get a rub with brass wool and then put back in the frame and ready for the next day at the range.
 
I never thought about this before but I bet I'd test positive for GSR all the time. I shoot handguns 2 or 3 times each week. Anybody know if the stuff washes off easily?
 
I never thought about this before but I bet I'd test positive for GSR all the time. I shoot handguns 2 or 3 times each week. Anybody know if the stuff washes off easily?

It does not. Experience with the latest TSA gear has convinced me that if I go to the range in the week before having to cross a TSA line, I carry the range receipts in my wallet just to prove there was a legitimate reason ...
 
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