HSM Bear Loads

[BabaBlueJay]

Was curious if anyone has experience with this ammo from the Montana Territory. Saw a box at LGS and testing this weekend, 180 green hard cast 357 magnum rounds sound like they mean business so I am excited to see what they do. Never heard of them so was curious what to expect from some of you who may have.

 

[Alk8944]

First, it is HSM, NOT HMS! Fortunately "Google" is smart enough to find the correct web site.

Depends on what you intend to do with this ammunition. A 189 Grain cast bullet at 1200 FPS (published) is really nothing special, There are 10mm Auto loads that get the same velocity (some manuf, published) with a 200 grain bullet. Non-dangerous game it should work OK, but I would not even think of using either for dangerous game. Shot placement is everything, and unless you shoot well enough to be confident of always placing your shots precisely where they need to be then use a rifle, not any handgun. Just because they call it a "bear load" doesn't make it so.


Unless you reload and have a chronograph so you can be sure of the performance level of your loads for serious hunting unless the caliber is at least .41 magnum or larger. I would be hesitant to use any factory loads based only on the manufacturers published data, it is almost always quite optimistic!

 

[jimmyj]

Jimmy's Rule:
"When Bear Hunting--use a weapon that is belt fed"

 

[Nevada Ed]

I know that a old 160 gr. Speer jacked lead SP point works on Mule deer

but I have yet to have to use this load on bears, that break into my cabin, now and then.

I would rather have a 180 gr 30-06 to do the task, if I had a choice.

 

[sandog]

Jeez, just because the guy asked about HSM bear loads doesn't mean he's planning to go after bears.
I'll spare him any lectures about caliber choice or question his sanity.
Maybe he doesn't have a 10mm and wants ammo for the gun he does have.

I bought a box at Sportsman's Warehouse before I got the components together to load rounds like that.
Now I load a 180 grain WFN "Pugnose" from MBC that is similar to the HSM round but is coated.

I shot the load out of a 6 inch 686 and a 4 5/8 Blackhawk.
The HSM Bear load out of the 686 clocked 1300 fps. The Ruger was 1260 I think.
The spread was low too, only 15-20 fps. variation.
They were more accurate than the 3 or 4 factory loads I had on hand at the time, and the price in 2018 was $35 for 50.
I'll bet they sell for more than that now !

 

[mikeruns]

These should drive deep as hard cast 180's stepping 1200 fps. A .357 is better than something lighter. Carry spray too, and your .357...you probably will never need either, but armed with anything is good out there...I carry a .357 in my native Montana and sometimes a Glock 35, sometimes a Mtn gun in .44...just depends on the outing. Deep hikes, the 44, have a Glock 10 mm and some HSM 220's which I haven't tried yet...cheers!

 

[BabaBlueJay]

Jeez, just because the guy asked about HSM bear loads doesn't mean he's planning to go after bears.
I'll spare him any lectures about caliber choice or question his sanity.
Maybe he doesn't have a 10mm and wants ammo for the gun he does have.

I bought a box at Sportsman's Warehouse before I got the components together to load rounds like that.
Now I load a 180 grain WFN "Pugnose" from MBC that is similar to the HSM round but is coated.

I shot the load out of a 6 inch 686 and a 4 5/8 Blackhawk.
The HSM Bear load out of the 686 clocked 1300 fps. The Ruger was 1260 I think.
The spread was low too, only 15-20 fps. variation.
They were more accurate than the 3 or 4 factory loads I had on hand at the time, and the price in 2018 was $35 for 50.
I'll bet they sell for more than that now !

Yeah I have no intention of hunting bears. I'd bring a better tool for that job if I was crazy enough for it. Just saw the ammo and wanted to try making some fruit blow up. It was 40$ for 50 rounds which for hardcast seemed reasonable to me given ammo prices.

 

[PHS327]

I'm not a hunter so I won't say anything about that. But I have shot the HSM load you are talking about. Powerful stuff. I'd guess about 35% more recoil than most other 357 ammo I have shot. When my buddy shot it, I'll always remember, the whole range (only two lanes at Bass Pro) shook and the front part of his head hair flew up. Very comical to observe.

 

[BabaBlueJay]

I'm not a hunter so I won't say anything about that. But I have shot the HSM load you are talking about. Powerful stuff. I'd guess about 35% more recoil than most other 357 ammo I have shot. When my buddy shot it, I'll always remember, the whole range (only two lanes at Bass Pro) shook and the front part of his head hair flew up. Very comical to observe.

Now you got me even more excited for range day!!!

 

[sandog]

I worked up a load for my Rossi .357 carbine with the 180 grain Pugnose and a full charge of Lil' Gun.
First time I shot that load out of the M66, I had a 25 yard group that I could cover with a nickel. The 66 shoots the load better than the 16" carbine that the load was worked up for.
Blast and recoil isn't too bad, but I'm used to my Model 69.

This was the same session where I chronographed the HSM Bear loads.
The 1597 fps. on the readout was from Hornady American Gunner 125 grain XTP.
Those will make your hair stand up !

 

[Bald1]

Yeah guys, he never said he was going bear hunting. That being said they do work on bears (250 lb black bears that is). My son shot this one in Colorado with a 6” 686. I started carrying this load when Winchester quit making their partition gold line of hunting ammo. I found it to be accurate and a little faster than advertised. I’ve taken a few deer with it, out to about 60 yds. There bear my son shot broke shoulder and passed thru just behind off shoulder. Shot was about 50yds. They seem to be just another take on the Buffalo Bore Outdoorsman load. Which I carry in my model 10&64.

 

[BabaBlueJay]

Yeah guys, he never said he was going bear hunting. That being said they do work on bears (250 lb black bears that is). My son shot this one in Colorado with a 6” 686. I started carrying this load when Winchester quit making their partition gold line of hunting ammo. I found it to be accurate and a little faster than advertised. I’ve taken a few deer with it, out to about 60 yds. There bear my son shot broke shoulder and passed thru just behind off shoulder. Shot was about 50yds. They seem to be just another take on the Buffalo Bore Outdoorsman load. Which I carry in my model 10&64.

I am a huge Buffalo Bore/Tim Sundles fan and tried the Outdoorsman ammo from them, my gun did not like it and had extraction issues which made me sad because their ammo is usually phenomenal in my 686, especially their low recoil low flash stuff.

I am definitely not hunting bears, but here in Ashtabula County (Northeast Corner of Ohio) we have more black bear sightings than the rest of the state combined. Something like 900+ per year, and we had one minutes from my house in the harbor last year. I am glad we do not have Grizzlies, as those actually target people. Black Bears will usually only attack if cornered, with Cubs, or starving. Even so, nice to have a bianchi strip with some hard casts on the off chance I ever see one (Have never seen one in person yet).

 

[waffles]

I've fired a couple hundred rounds of them. They're stout but nothing too crazy, and seem to shoot reasonably close to the point of aim I got with 158gr .357 loads. I went to the Glock 20 in 10mm for outdoors stuff a little while back, but if I wanted to stick with a .357 wheel gun I'd feel fine using the HSM 180gr.

 

[Wyo]

This fella makes a pretty good case for the 180 gr .357 load for defensive use against dangerous game. Phil Shoemaker, the Alaskan guide, used it successfully and his daughter carries one now. I’ve carried one myself in griz country. Although I’ve not had to use it I always felt comfortable carrying it with proper loads.

The Case For The 357 Magnum – Alaska Gunsite

 

[Bald1]

WYO, I’ve read that before. It’s a great article. But some people will never except the idea of a 357 against giant bears. They’re the same guys deer hunting with 300 mags in northeast timber lol

 

[Skeet 028]

A 357 even for BIG bears beats throwing rocks

 

[sandog]

The key is the bullet being able to penetrate to the brain or spine.
And when you factor in how small those targets are, and the target moving, shooter stressed out, you realize that ANY common handgun caliber is
pushing things.

A hard cast 180 or FMJ at 1200-1300 fps. penetrates very well.
I'd prefer a .30 Luger FMJ over a slow flat-nosed bullet like a .44 Special Cowboy load.