I think I understand the 'scout rifle' concept, but.......

Writers get paid by the word. They have to write to get paid whether or not it makes sense in reality.

I hope you don't really believe they are paid by the word. Something that doesn't "make sense in reality" would never past a good editor. Such work would be on a YouTube level.
 
Cooper's scout rifle concept was an answer in search of a question. With a properly mounted scope one can shoot any rifle with both eyes open. Small pistol scope mounted halfway down the gun is useless at dawn or dusk......I'm surprised the concept hasn't died and gone away.

This exactly. Also if the sun is over your shoulder it’s very difficult to see thru scope. Reflection is horrible.
 
Excellent thread!
I would like to add a couple of thoughts.
South Africa.
To understand Cooper's thinking, one should understand the South Africans and their shooting ability which he so admired. Having read everything he ever wrote (maybe, who knows?) and also, reading everything that he said a young man should read. I cannot separate the man from his time and from his influences. Back in the 1900's, he was the authority, or so I thought. Today, men we look to as the authority, were his disciples. There are so many things he said that are now obsolete, but the underlying principles will NEVER go obsolete! He spent time in the RSA and the men he admired had themselves, or their fathers had, served as light calvary/mounted infantry, and they won battles against the most powerful army on earth with aimed riflery.

Skill
I can shoot very fast with a bolt action, but it took forever to learn how to do it. There is a trick to it. I can also shoot a scope with both eyes open, and that took a long time to learn. There is a trick to that too. I never bothered to get a rifle with stripper clips, but I still think about it. That too is a skill which requires a lot of practice to do quickly. A top fed, bolt action rifle is all about shooting a high-power cartridge from the prone position, or from a trench. A scout rifle is supposed to do that AND everything else you can do with a rifle.

A box fed magazine cannot be inserted into a rifle when lying prone on the ground, unless you roll on your side, which takes practice to do quickly. Remember you must keep the mud out of the action, which with practice you can learn to do. From prone your lever action will be as fast or faster than me, again if you are lying on your side, which you can do with practice. Your scope should still be on target after you have dropped your rifle on the rocks, or after you have fallen down on the rocks holding it. Those Boers could lay down a volume of accurate fire and then mount up with the rifle slung on their backs, gallop for ten miles, dismount and do it all again.

Cooper never thought that the scope was the important thing. He thought that knowing how the round drops and drifts was what mattered, and especially the target animal's anatomy.
You have the physical fitness to do the job.
You know your enemy/animal and your target on it.
You know the terrain and movements, yours and your enemies'.
You have weapons skill as stated above.
You have a weapon that works within that skills set, even when things go terribly wrong.
What part of this ever goes obsolete?

Cooper said, "If you can't hold it for 60 seconds, (at arms length,) your rifle is too heavy." Or you are too weak! Cooper was very opinionated true, but he never ever once said that some fat, slow, weakling with no skill, needed a forward mounted scope on his rifle!

Please correct me, anyone, with my thanks. I say things in hope of correction and education.

Best regards!
BrianD
 
I did a write-up of The Art of the Rifle for a popular blog about 10 years ago. It's also mentioned in passing in my first fiction novel as influential to a couple of the characters.

Even in 2025, there are some great takeaways as long as you don't marry yourself to the equipment of the time. Just like reading accounts of snipers in WWII, there are elements to their craft that we can learn from and adopt without needing a bolt action rifle with a full wood stock and a 4x scope. Cooper is now best known for being a proponent of two designs that are heading into obsolescence: the bolt action Scout rifle and the Government Model 1911. I don't let that affect being a fan of his work.
 
I did a write-up of The Art of the Rifle for a popular blog about 10 years ago. It's also mentioned in passing in my first fiction novel as influential to a couple of the characters.

Even in 2025, there are some great takeaways as long as you don't marry yourself to the equipment of the time. Just like reading accounts of snipers in WWII, there are elements to their craft that we can learn from and adopt without needing a bolt action rifle with a full wood stock and a 4x scope. Cooper is now best known for being a proponent of two designs that are heading into obsolescence: the bolt action Scout rifle and the Government Model 1911. I don't let that affect being a fan of his work.

1911 going into obsolescence.......There are more manufactured 1911's made and sold now than any other time in recorded history......Way back gun writers said the lever gun was obsolete and would fade away........Again more lever guns made now than any other time in history. And I can still get a Sharps rifle if I want.
 
elegant-1911.jpg


Grandpappy.jpg
 
...I'm surprised the concept hasn't died and gone away.

Hey Mike, in case you haven’t noticed, and whether we like it or not, it pretty much has.

It’s a shame Steyr didn’t more rigidly adhere to the initial Scout design specifications. Under their “leadership” it went pretty far afield, and as a result the Scout project never really got past the expensive custom-build stage. More recent US-brand factory-built Scouts that I have seen and handled have suffered likewise.

Unfortunately, true Scouts are, and always have been, the exclusive and expensive province of the custom builder. Scout concept optics also seem to have consistently missed the mark.
 
I think I remember seeing him carrying one with his hand around the action like you can with an unscoped lever gun. Handy to run through the woods with while fighting a government insurrection for those with the tin foil hats :)

...all while being too fat and out of shape to lift their *** out of the recliner!!! LOL!!!
 
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1911 going into obsolescence.......There are more manufactured 1911's made and sold now than any other time in recorded history......Way back gun writers said the lever gun was obsolete and would fade away........Again more lever guns made now than any other time in history. And I can still get a Sharps rifle if I want.

You can also buy brand new carbureted Chevy small blocks, vinyl records, and analog wristwatches.

"Available" and "obsolescent" aren't antonyms. And "obsolescent" and "obsolete" aren't synonyms. Obsolescent just means they're on their way. I love my bolt actions and 1911s, but let's not pretend they're cutting edge technology. Those that can buy whatever they want (military and law enforcement) have moved on except for a couple minor niches.
 
...why is the long eye relief scope part of the package? The only thing I can think of is quick target acquisition. It seems that 'ghost ring' sights would be a better choice for close up encounters.

You do understand the optics portion of the concept correctly. At the time Cooper was writing and testing extensively on the early Scout Prototypes, the 2x IER scopes were about the best you could come by at the time.

Today, with the advent of reliable red dots with very long battery life and unlimited eye relief, they are a better choice for the snap shots.

The intermediate eye relief scope will for the foreseeable future suffer from issues with glare at dusk and dawn. That's whey those of us who have used them in the field enough to go back to LPVO scope that have good, but not excessively long eye relief.

Regarding the weight, size, and power specification of the Scout. Many rifles today meet those standards at price points under $2000.

My personal collections of Scout rifles past and present includes two Styers, a Ruger GSR, and a Blaser R93 Tracker. I still keep the Blaser and a recently added Styer to the staple, all in 308 Winchester. They are light, handy, and have sufficient power to handle anything on North America at reasonable ranges.
 
You can also buy brand new carbureted Chevy small blocks, vinyl records, and analog wristwatches.

"Available" and "obsolescent" aren't antonyms. And "obsolescent" and "obsolete" aren't synonyms. Obsolescent just means they're on their way. I love my bolt actions and 1911s, but let's not pretend they're cutting edge technology. Those that can buy whatever they want (military and law enforcement) have moved on except for a couple minor niches.

I don't care about "trends"---"military use"-----"what the gun flavor of day is".......My likes and buying habits are to please no one except me......When I die(or rise into the clouds) My friends will say...."Ol" Mike had a purty good taste in firearms. With little to no plastic.

re: Small block Chevy.........Yesterday I sold my 1996 Z71 with the 350 CI Vortec Engine........Bought it new in 1996 with 4 miles on the OD. Still driving it when I sold it with just over 200,000 miles on it.......So......I drove it 28 years and 2 months..........Bet not many here have driven a truck that long......Replaced it with another V8 4x4 Bowtie.

.........Long Live The Bowtie.......

Geesh.....Guess I thread drifted on this.....
 
You do understand the optics portion of the concept correctly. At the time Cooper was writing and testing extensively on the early Scout Prototypes, the 2x IER scopes were about the best you could come by at the time.

Today, with the advent of reliable red dots with very long battery life and unlimited eye relief, they are a better choice for the snap shots.

The intermediate eye relief scope will for the foreseeable future suffer from issues with glare at dusk and dawn. That's whey those of us who have used them in the field enough to go back to LPVO scope that have good, but not excessively long eye relief.

Regarding the weight, size, and power specification of the Scout. Many rifles today meet those standards at price points under $2000.

My personal collections of Scout rifles past and present includes two Styers, a Ruger GSR, and a Blaser R93 Tracker. I still keep the Blaser and a recently added Styer to the staple, all in 308 Winchester. They are light, handy, and have sufficient power to handle anything on North America at reasonable ranges.

re: "better choice for snap shots".....I strongly disagree....A standard (quality)scope(40mm or larger) setup with a duplex recticle that is focused to your eye is much faster and clearer too....I have proved this many times shooting running deer. As I stated with proper scope setup you shoot with BOTH EYES OPEN and swing like a shotgun.......Not searching for pin prick of red or green light while your quarry escapes over the hill or swamp.
 

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