Julian Hatcher's RM?

[Art Doc]

I am reading a book written by Julian Hatcher in 1934 and published in 1935 in which he discusses the soon to be released 357 Magnum. There is even a photo in the book of his son firing an 8 & 3/4" Magnum equipped with Magnas and the grip adaptor.

I vaguely recall reading in the past that one of the very first RMs was sent to Hatcher. I suppose this is the one? Anyone know where it is now?

I got a kick out of some of the comments made regarding the new gun, like how only men of large and powerful physical stature should try to shoot the gun due to its size and weight. Sounds like marketing to me. After reading that statement who didn't want to rush out and buy one to prove what a man he was? Sort of like loading ammo to standard pressure and then stamping it with +P and issuing dire warnings about how powerful it is...

 

[Art Doc]

I am reading a book written by Julian Hatcher in 1934 and published in 1935 in which he discusses the soon to be released 357 Magnum. There is even a photo in the book of his son firing an 8 & 3/4" Magnum equipped with Magnas and the grip adaptor.

I vaguely recall reading in the past that one of the very first RMs was sent to Hatcher. I suppose this is the one? Anyone know where it is now?

I got a kick out of some of the comments made regarding the new gun, like how only men of large and powerful physical stature should try to shoot the gun due to its size and weight. Sounds like marketing to me. After reading that statement who didn't want to rush out and buy one to prove what a man he was? Sort of like loading ammo to standard pressure and then stamping it with +P and issuing dire warnings about how powerful it is...

 

[29-1]

SP, Hatcher made the same sort of dramatic comments in his review of the newly introduced .44 Magnum in the March, 1956 issue of the American Rifleman. Some of us are still on the hunt for that particular gun too as it's one of the first 2-3 shipped out.
Chuck

 

[sw357nm]

Gen. Hatcher did not get one of the first few registered magnums, but he did get one of the few transition magnums made after WWII from mostly-prewar parts. It has an 8 3/8-inch barrel and has s/n S71972. It was shipped in June 1948.
Hatcher did receive the third 44 magnum produced. It was delivered in January 1956 (s/n S130942)
John

 

[Art Doc]

I'm looking at a photograph in a book of the gun, held by his son, taken on their property in 1934. He writes in the book that he had a pre-production gun sent to him by S&W. Maybe he didn't get to keep the gun, but he had it in 1934 and I am thinking that I vaguely recall reading that Hatcher got one of the first ones. But I could certainly be wrong. Maybe he only got one to evaluate and had to send it back.

 

[sw357nm]

He may have had one to test, but I find no record of him having one to keep.
That, of course doesn't mean that it didn't happen, but if he did it would be nice to know more details.
Anyone else out there know anything about this?
John

 

[Art Doc]

Here's the pic, BTW.

 

[smith17]

SP:
I ran across an old thread from Dec. 05 where Merlindrb gives info on this gun (club gun numbered) and its somewhat whereabouts. For You Owners of KCPD or FBI Magnums is the title of the thread.
Ed

 

[Art Doc]

Reading the text Hatcher claims this was the "first one to leave the factory." Still doesn't mean it was his, may have been a loaner for testing or he may have been mistaken about it being the first one.

 

[Art Doc]

That thread cited does seem to answer some of the questions, except about whether Hatcher kept the gun(s) (he only speaks of one in the book).

Anyone ever asked Roy Jinks about this "first batch of prototype guns" and what became of them?

 

[NKJ nut]

IIRC he did receive one of the first RM's. Wheter he had to pay or not I do not know. Given Hatcher's stature among shooter's I would think S&W would have been glad to GIVE him a RM.

Saxonpig is the book you are reading Hatcher's TEXTBOOK OF PISTOLS AND REVOLVERS?

 

[BruceHMX]

Sax you and I are of large and powerful physical stature. The General's son looks kind of lanky, thin and what the hell

How dare General Hatcher give that boy a big 357 Magnum.

Cool pic.

Anybody here recall Col Askins reference to Gen Hatcher? Something along the line of, "he quotes balistics and bullshit but he's never fired a shot in anger in his whole life".

Guess we can give him credit for the Hatcher Hole on the 03. But then again some sharp CPL or SGT probably thought of it and Hatcher took the credit

Would be a neat gun to find.

 

[walkinghorse]

Anybody here recall Col Askins reference to Gen Hatcher? Something along the line of, "he quotes balistics and bullshit but he's never fired a shot in anger in his whole life".

Slight left turn

Didn't Col. Askins say the something similar about Bill Jordan referring to his book, No Second Place Winner? If I remember correctly he was comparing several contemporaries, gun writers, authors, etc. who had never actually used a pistol while in service and had written on the subject of firearm use. In later criticsm of that statement, Askins was noted to be rather bloodthirsty, especially referring to an encounter with some Germans stealing and running away and were shot in the back?

 

[Art Doc]

Yes, Textbook of Revolvers and Pistols (1935).

I thought that the younger Hatcher was fairly slight of build but maybe it wasn't Hatcher who made the strong physical comment, it may have been advertising hype from S&W.

Read Unrepentent Sinner to understand Askins. Mas Ayoob described him as "a stone cold killer" and that's about right. Askins would just as soon shoot a man as look at him. Racist to the bone he had no use for most people. The story about shooting a German was as hostilities were ending in Europe Askins was in charge of recovering and storing captured vehicles. he said that the German drivers were parking the trucks as told but then would lift the hoods and smash the distributor caps with hammers to disable them. Askins shot one German soldier in the kidney for doing this (I assume the man died Askins didn't say for sure) and the rest of the surrendering Germans left the engines on their trucks alone after that.

 

[NKJ nut]

originally posted by Saxonpig

Read Unrepentent Sinner to understand Askins. Mas Ayoob described him as "a stone cold killer" and that's about right. Askins would just as soon shoot a man as look at him. Racist to the bone he had no use for most people.

You are right on about Askins. He was very not PC. This man shot a bunch of men over about a 40 year time span. He was very opinionated but he knew his stuff. I have read and re read his writings for years and have listened to him simply because the man knew what he was talking about. I am also not surprised to here his comment about Hatcher. I don't think he would have said the same about Jordan because Jordan had "seen the elephant".

BTW the reason I asked if that was the TEXTBOOK is because I have not been able to locate a decent copy of that book, without paying a huge price. So that is one of the old ones that I don't have.

 

[smith17]

nkj:
There are several copies listed at Abebooks.com if you type in Hatcher and the title. Several under about 30-40 bucks.
Ed

 

[walkinghorse]

I don't think he would have said the same about Jordan because Jordan had "seen the elephant".

I am searching for the reference (believe it was an older Shooting Times article with Askins writing about Skeeter Skelton, Bill Jordan, again referencing his book no Second place Winner, Askins father, Major?, and others who write about guns have not used to kill humans), but so far am unable to find it, but Askins did say it about Jordan, again as I remember? It was very surprising statement to me, cause the article had pictures of the 3 of them, Askins, Jordan, Skelton, with shotguns ona bird hunt.

I believed the Askins reference to Jordan was concerning his Border Patrol career (though wasn't there something about an accidental discharge during his BP career which killed another BP officer?), rather than his WW II miltary career about which I have not read much, other than he served in the Pacific as Marine? officer, and was in the thick of things, therefore as you said "he saw the elephant".

Jordan never seemed to revel in telling tales like this though Askins was into it?

 

[M29since14]

Jordan never seemed to revel in telling tales like this though Askins was into it?

With due respect to the departed, there is no need of the question mark there. That is a statement of fact.