License Question

[Ky Bob]

I have a fellow wanting to buy my SW M&P 15X but he doesn't have a valid Ky Driver license but he did ask if his Military ID would work. I've never ran across this before and wondering how you would handle it?? Looking for answers!! Sorry if I posted this in the wrong forum. He's only responded by emails but sounds like he may be taking it across state lines. If that the case can he do that with a Military ID??

 

[TAROMAN]

Military ID does not prove residence.
Best to let a dealer do the transfer if, in fact, it can be done at all.

 

[Bkreutz]

A member of the military is considered a resident of the state where his permanent duty station is (not TDY). Not sure of how this affects firearms purchases but I would ask an FFL before I would transfer one privately.

 

[AZretired]

Military Personnel can purchase firearms in the state of their permanent duty station regardless of their DL. However they do need to possess a valid DL.

Ky Bob- Is this guy on active duty and stationed in Kentucky? If not don't sell it to him.

 

[islamoradamark]

i would take AZretired advise tell him to go get A DRIVER licence it aint hard

 

[Alpo]

A member of the military is considered a resident of the state where his permanent duty station is (not TDY). Not sure of how this affects firearms purchases but I would ask an FFL before I would transfer one privately.

That's exactly how it effects firearms purchase. If he has PCS orders, he is, legally, of a resident of that state, while still being, legally, a resident of his home of record.

A guy with a Florida license, stationed at Ft. Rucker, for gun purchases, is a resident of Alabama.

 

[Alpo]

Military Personnel can purchase firearms in the state of their permanent duty station regardless of their DL. However they do need to possess a valid DL.

Ky Bob- Is this guy on active duty and stationed in Kentucky? If not don't sell it to him.

Why? Only reason to need a drivers license it to drive.

I'm pretty sure that POW-card meets the definition of "government-issued ID".

 

[deadin]

I'm pretty sure that POW-card meets the definition of "government-issued ID".

I'm sorry... What is a POW-card and how would it affect residency?

Military on active duty need to prove residency to qualify for firearm purchase. This can be done by a State issued DL OR a copy of their PCS orders. (I know because I spent 20 years moving around the country in the Navy.)
One thing about copies of orders, If you aren't familiar with the way they are written, you might not know just what you are looking at. I wouldn't guarantee that all dealers would be either.

 

[Ky Bob]

Military Personnel can purchase firearms in the state of their permanent duty station regardless of their DL. However they do need to possess a valid DL.

Ky Bob- Is this guy on active duty and stationed in Kentucky? If not don't sell it to him.

I'm pretty sure he's in Ky but I'm quite leery of a person that says they don't have a valid drivers license. I sent him a email back that I would sell only through a FFL and offered to pay the transfer so I'll see how legit this fellow really is.

 

[Alpo]

I'm sorry... What is a POW-card and how would it affect residency?

Military on active duty need to prove residency to qualify for firearm purchase. This can be done by a State issued DL OR a copy of their PCS orders. (I know because I spent 20 years moving around the country in the Navy.)
One thing about copies of orders, If you aren't familiar with the way they are written, you might not know just what you are looking at. I wouldn't guarantee that all dealers would be either.

POW card, as I've been told, is the now-official term for what we called an "ID Card", back in the 60s when I was a military dependent. Has nothing to do with residency. It is "government-issued photo-ID", that shows that the guy telling you he is John James Smith is, in fact, John James Smith.

To prove "residency" he would need a copy of his PCS orders.

But I still do not see why anyone would think he needs a drivers license. The ID card takes care of "WHO HE IS", and the orders takes care of "WHERE HE LIVES".

And as for the "dealer not know what he's looking at", I had a young man from San Juan come in one day to make a purchase. I told him I needed to see his PCS orders. He said he'd be back.

When he returned he had a several-page document. I told him, "Show me where it says you are permanently stationed at Tyndall AFB." He did, I xeroxed that page, highlighted that section, and stapled it to the 4473.

If you can't find your way around the orders, ask the soldier/sailor/airman/Marine/coastie to show you what you need to see.

 

[MOONDAWG]

A member of the military is considered a resident of the state where his permanent duty station is (not TDY). Not sure of how this affects firearms purchases but I would ask an FFL before I would transfer one privately.

***********

 

[deadin]

POW card, as I've been told, is the now-official term for what we called an "ID Card"

Well that's a new one on me.... (Of course I retired in 1978 so I'm out of the loop.) I wonder just what the POW acronym meaning is. (Surely not Prisoner of War if it truly is the new official term.)

 

[REM 3200]

Well that's a new one on me.... (Of course I retired in 1978 so I'm out of the loop.) I wonder just what the POW acronym meaning is. (Surely not Prisoner of War if it truly is the new official term.)

I retired in 1990 and never heard the term.

 

[Doug M.]

A military ID may not mean all it should - years ago my old office charged some poor soldier stationed at Fort Lewis who cousin had stolen his identity, and among other things had his military ID (and looked close enough to get by). It was a miserable experience for the prosecutor, and a lot worse for the soldier. It was months of work to undo our part, and probably years of misery for him.

If he actually does not have a valid driver's license from anywhere, I would run, and run far and run fast. Very few (if any) functional adults with the discretionary money to buy a firearm will not have a DL. Anyone with LE experience will tell that not having a DL is usually a sign of some form of dysfunction in their life and probably not a person with whom one should associate, let alone do a gun sale.

That's part of the answer. The rest of the answer: if you are uncomfortable enough to ask this question here, you are picking up a hint that something is not right. If you have that feeling, there is likely a good reason, if not several, that you should not do this transaction. You have the absolute right to refuse to sell to anyone under those conditions, and I would say maybe an obligation. Run. Run far. Run fast.

 

[Alpo]

I was told it by a co-worker who had just left the Air Force, in 2002. He said it did indeed mean Prisoner of War. It was sure different from what I knew in the 60s. Had a bar-code on it. (He showed me his - he was still in the reserve.)

Maybe they aren't POW cards. But I saw no reason for him to lie about it, when he corrected my use of the term "ID card".

 

[CBus660R]

I'm pretty sure he's in Ky but I'm quite leery of a person that says they don't have a valid drivers license. I sent him a email back that I would sell only through a FFL and offered to pay the transfer so I'll see how legit this fellow really is.

What if he's from New York City where a drivers license isn't the "right of passage" at 16 like it is most other places? He could be an honest young man from NYC doing his part to serve his country. Having said that, in today's day and age, you are much better served by being safe rather than sorry.

 

[deadin]

who had just left the Air Force, in 2002.

Well, there's the answer right there!

 

[safearm]

A military member does NOT have to have a valid driver's license. Many states allow a military member to have an expired driver's license as long as they also have valid military ID card (I do recall it being called the Geneva Convention ID card, but never a POW card!). Generally the state of issue gives the military member 30 days to renew their license, without penalty, after they return to their home state.
So it is possible that a military member could hand you an expired driver's license from a state other than where they are stationed and be completely legal. As long as they have a valid military ID, and a local mailing address, they should be good to go. I know that Texas requires 30 days residency for purchase of long guns and 90 days for purchase of hand guns from the report date of the PCS orders.

 

[4011]

Good chance he lost his license because of a driving problems also! Tickets are worse.

 

[wyccad915]

A military ID may not mean all it should - years ago my old office charged some poor soldier stationed at Fort Lewis who cousin had stolen his identity, and among other things had his military ID (and looked close enough to get by). It was a miserable experience for the prosecutor, and a lot worse for the soldier. It was months of work to undo our part, and probably years of misery for him.

If he actually does not have a valid driver's license from anywhere, I would run, and run far and run fast. Very few (if any) functional adults with the discretionary money to buy a firearm will not have a DL. Anyone with LE experience will tell that not having a DL is usually a sign of some form of dysfunction in their life and probably not a person with whom one should associate, let alone do a gun sale.

That's part of the answer. The rest of the answer: if you are uncomfortable enough to ask this question here, you are picking up a hint that something is not right. If you have that feeling, there is likely a good reason, if not several, that you should not do this transaction. You have the absolute right to refuse to sell to anyone under those conditions, and I would say maybe an obligation. Run. Run far. Run fast.

I think saying if a person does not have a drivers license they are dysfunctional is a little harsh. I'm 24, and believe it or not, I did not get my license until April of this year. Yes, for the first time. I just never had a car, so why did I need one? And yes, guns came before the car. I did, of course, have a state I.D though, so it is a little bit different.