losing your second amendment rights

[Buffalohunter60]

Just something to think about guys. If you are ever "accused" of domestic violence.....the police will come and remove your firearms with a court order. You can (and many are) be totally innocent and not even convicted of any crime yet....and they will still take your guns. If you are found innocent ...they now have your guns....and the only way you can get them back.....is a court order from a judge. Just something to think about. Any time a man is accused of anything involving a woman...you are at a hugh disadvantage ........all she has to do is bang her head against the wall or put any mark on her....say you did it....and you freedom to own a firearm is gone. Its not right and this is something that needs to be changed....and I fully understand both sides of that story....justice will never be completely just.....but many innocent people have lost their right to a firearm. Its not too hard to get someones firearms if you have a devious plan...keep your guard up...there are many ways to lose the second amendment rights.

 

[Hapworth]

Any available examples of gun confiscation based on accusation of domestic abuse without conviction?

 

[1991a1colt]

In Georgia you have to be found guilty before you loose your rights to firearms. We do not disarm people who were arrested and we don't do court ordered removal of guns from homes, they must get rid of them. But the south is more pro-gun then other states. Also a lot of judges will reduce the charges unless it is really bad abuse and history of violance. This sounds like some crazy northern state junk.

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[Buffalohunter60]

It personally happened to me...exc ept when they came fro my guns....I had removed them already. The ex GF that accused me had been notified by e-mail not to come on my property without Police present. She criminally tresspassed on my property...came into my house....smashed my steamer on the kitchen floor and I called 911 and walked her out the door. She put some rub marks on her neck and told police I tried to choke her and push her down the stairs (all lies) I do not fight with women and never have. I was arrestedand had a restraining order against me by the state on NH. The State police came for my guns with a court order...I had been convicted of nothing at this point. because of the restraining order and the fact it said I could not have firearms in my posession...I removed them from my property to a safe place. I would not disclose where they were. $5000.00 later...my case was nol-prossed because she had criminally tresspassed and would have been proscuted for it. They did get a small ammount of my ammo...about 5000 rounds I had missed...and the cops were very good about all that happened. I never believed this could happen....but it happens all the time...one of the troopers told me this is not uncommon. Word to the wise.....I do not keep all my guns at one location or ammo and think about install9ing a video camera...it may save your bacon one day. Believe me, this can and does happen all the time.

 

[Buffalohunter60]

In Georgia you have to be found guilty before you loose your rights to firearms. We do not disarm people who were arrested and we don't do court ordered removal of guns from homes, they must get rid of them. But the south is more pro-gun then other states. Also a lot of judges will reduce the charges unless it is really bad abuse and history of violance. This sounds like some crazy northern state junk.

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In NH they can remove your guns after the restraining order if they have an order from the Judge and all this before trial...I always thought you were innocent until proven guilty....but not necessarily so. I do understand that abuse happens and some of it is sever....and the State is leaning toward the woman and I do understand that....there are some very abusive men out there. I do not have a good answer to the problem...but if it happens to you...it will be expensive no matter how it turns out and if I did not have a good attorney...I could have also done jail time....justice is as good as the ammount of money you have to obtain it.

 

[1991a1colt]

Yup you got to be careful. But be advised we take a lot of women to jail also. More then you think. The best thing to do is find a halfway normal woman. (I know its hard because they all have snakes in their head if you cross them). In this day and age it's not worth the trouble to hook up with trouble. best thing to do if u start getting into an argument is just leave. If its bad and think the police are going to be called, get onto 911 leave and tell them were your at and what happended. That way its all recorded on the 911 tape. Its hard to beat someone while your on a phone. The system sometimes sucks but there are a lot of dead women/men out there. I agree that things are screwed up with the law but how else would you deal with a domestic. Its just not an easy thing to deal with.
Like I said before, just stay away from drama.

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[Buffalohunter60]

Hi 1Colt, I hear you. I am 65 and did find a decent lady (in Zew Zealand) and we are into outdoor sports and camping...I am way too old for Drama. I feel for the cops that get involved because no one knows when they arrive...who is lying and who is telling the truth and it can potentially be a very dangerous situtation as I am sure you are well aware of. I agree whole heartedly with your advise.

 

[1991a1colt]

I envy you for living in such a gorgeous country. New Zealand would be my first on my bail out countrys next to Switzerland.

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[cfplinker]

Here's the bill presently being considered in Colorado.

http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/cl...4FB057F87257B08007A98F7?Open&file=197_ren.pdf

 

[Buffalohunter60]

Yes, that is pretty much the case in NH except....a Judge has to issue a warrent to remove the firearms. As far as I know...if convicted...you can never again have a firearm in your posession or its off to jail. There are some serious flaws in our justice system where innocent people get convicted and lose their rights forever. We also need to fight for innocent until proven guilty......and I am a firm believer in protecting women that are battered...my own daughter went through that and had a husband that was chocking her when the police arrived......today she has the ability to protect herself against that kind of violence and knows how to use it. Its a tough job to protect a victim of crime and also protect an innocent person that is being framed by a vindictive person. A truely violent person does not need a gun to kill the victim.....victims should have the ability and training to not be victims because a knife is as deadly as a gun not to mention a large range of other weapons. There was a case in NH where a man named Ward Bird confronted a woman that tresspassed on his posted property and refused to leave when told.....he got arrested...the details are he said she said and no witness....he went to jail for 7 years. The towns people were so upset that they banded together and started a free Ward Bird project and did get him released from prison but it took a considerable effort by people that saw a tragidy of justice...even the police felt he was not treated fairly. Got to love the towns people that took the effort to see justice corrected. I followed the case and though but by the grace of God...it could have been me or any one of us.

 

[tlay]

As to the reply that we are more gun friendly in the south, that doesn't help if the ATF gets involved. An ex-Marine lives in my home town in Georgia. Before he shipped out to Nam when he was 17 he got into a fight. At the time he was charged with a misdemeanor. Now after 30 years he has owned and bought many guns, he goes to buy another gun and is flagged by the ATF. He was told that the state where he got the misdemeanor charge years ago has now changed the status of this charge to a felony. Now he had to get rid of all of his guns and cannot own another one. He has to hire an attorney and spend thousands of dollars to get back his RIGHT. If you think it can't happen to you think twice.

 

[Buffalohunter60]

It can happen to any of us and at any time....and you can be "set up" if they really want to get your firearms. Justice is not always just and we have to look beyond just the second ammendment to defend our rights.
If once convicted of a felony...you firearms rights are gone forever. Its not like you serve your time and are back to square one. I know one man that had consentual sex with a 17 year old....he was convicted as a sex offender...served ten years...and can never have a gun. Its a good thing speeding tickets are not a felony...but picture changing that law and see how many of us would have our guns....we need to be very viglient and work on more than just the second amendment to keep our freedom.

 

[SMSgt]

As to the reply that we are more gun friendly in the south, that doesn't help if the ATF gets involved. An ex-Marine lives in my home town in Georgia. Before he shipped out to Nam when he was 17 he got into a fight. At the time he was charged with a misdemeanor. Now after 30 years he has owned and bought many guns, he goes to buy another gun and is flagged by the ATF. He was told that the state where he got the misdemeanor charge years ago has now changed the status of this charge to a felony. Now he had to get rid of all of his guns and cannot own another one. He has to hire an attorney and spend thousands of dollars to get back his RIGHT. If you think it can't happen to you think twice.

The he needs to contact a lawyer as they can't change what happened prior to any change in the law.

 

[tlay]

He has an attorney but that is not the problem. The problem is that he doe's not have the money to pay very much to get back his UNALIENABLE RIGHT.

 

[Mr Pokeyman]

In Pa if the woman says she is just afraid of a man that she is residing with, she can get an emergency PFA (protection from abuse) order and the man has to leave the house until they go to a hearing. I think the hearing has to be within 15 days. If she claims her fear of him involved weapons, they will be confiscated per the PFA. At the formal hearing if she claims there were threats and the man has guns, oh well say goodbye to your guns.
The craziest PFA scam I ever saw was a guy who fell in love with a dancer at a Gentlemans club and took her to his home. She stayed there for a couple of days but eventually she told him that she was going back to dancing and they argued about it. He asked her to leave and not come back. Being a lot smarter than him, she called 911. He didn't want to get into any trouble so he waited in his garage with his Rottweiler dog. When I arrived, he asked me to get her out of his house.
She claimed he had scared her because he has a big dog and she wanted him removed?? I was required to take her to a magistrate who gave her a PFA and the guy had to get out of his own house. At a hearing 2 wks later, she was granted a year long PFA and was given 30 days to vacate HIS house. He could not go on the property until she left. He was asked by the judge if he had guns in the house but he didn't. If he would have had any, they would have been taken. I just don't believe this insanity. This world is like Alice in Wonderland. Leaving the courthouse, she laughed at him. I wonder if he still picks up dancers.

 

[Buffalohunter60]

Dennis...the woman that I had the problem with...did the same thing to another man and he had to leave his home...took him 6 months and a lot of money spent on attorney fees to get back in his own home...wish I had known her history. Its a lesson i will never forget.

 

[Damn Yankee]

Have any of you every read "The Last Trench"?

 

[Buffalohunter60]

He has an attorney but that is not the problem. The problem is that he doe's not have the money to pay very much to get back his UNALIENABLE RIGHT.

sad but true...I fully understand .....and its just one more way we can lose our second amendment rights....it is pretty scary and it can happen to anyone of us.

 

[adwjc]

These stories may sound crazy to those who haven't dealt with DV, but I saw many sad stories in NJ when I worked there.

One was young cop I worked with, moved the GF into his house, after a while she had him removed and moved another guy in - the original had to pay her support & maintain the house, took him about 5 years and thousands of dollars to get her out. The only reason he won was because she didn't pursue a Final Order, if she did, he would have lost his job (thanks Senator Lautenberg) and she didn't want the gravy train to end.

Another was a young cop that came to us from another agency - where he left a bitter girlfriend behind. She waited until two years later; he was out of the country on vacation w/ a new GF, the old one made a complaint that he threatened her w/ a firearm. Judge issued a Temporary Restraining Order on her testimony. He was suspended when he returned from vacation, and foolishly went to court w/o an attorney, thinking that his airline tickets and passport would prove he wasn't even there. Judge wouldn't even listen to him, issued a Final Order. We were served and fired him, last I heard the appeal was a minimum of $10k. He was sorry he wasn't a Fireman.

 

[1991a1colt]

Wow y'alls laws are really harsh. They would not give anyone a TPO without proof of violance (a DV report with injures pressent). Also here if you move someone in they have to establish residence by ID showing that address. That requires a bill in your name or some kind of proof to the state. The stripper would have been tossed out on her ear in our jurisdiction. Wow other states laws are way way over the top.

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