M&P 15 vs M&P 15 Sport II-Why The Price Difference

[Stingingfork]

I'm brand new to this forum and AR's but I recently decided to try and find one made by S&W. I spotted a New-Old Stock M&P 15OR (811003) at one of my favorite online gun suppliers and they had a pair of them listed for some time at $889 each and with Googling I discovered that this model was out of production but it originally listed for $1069 (based on a post in this forum) and then I started looking at the M&P 15 Sport II since my local FFL dealer had one in stock for $799. My local dealer said the Sport contained the same quality parts and his was selling for $90 less and when I checked with the S&W Customer Service she basically confirmed what my FFL dealer had stated about the two guns so my question is what's the need of S&W producing both models and why is the price of the M&P 15 higher than their Sport II if they are indeed the same quality builds (although the 15OR doesn't have any Magpul MBUS Sights). Since I'm intending to install a Red Dot to my rifle I didn't see the need for the manual sights and I did note in my research that the 15OR had a chrome lined bore and the Sport II had a bore coated with Armornite so my local dealer was incorrect when he stated his Sport II was chromed lined also. I went ahead and ordered the 15OR with my assumption being that a higher priced rifle should of had better quality parts and if not why do they continue to produce both rifles at two different price ranges?

 

[mscampbell2734]

First, welcome to the forum. Hope you find it informative and helpful.

Second please remember this is a webpage with posts, NOT a jumbo sized text message and the use of good grammar, punctuation and sentence structure is STRONGLY encouraged.

As to your question, the OR model is designed specifically for use with some type of optic, and has both a railed upper receiver and low profile railed gas block. The standard Sport II has a standard triangle front sight. The details of barrel steel/lining will also differ.

Bottom line you DO get what you pay for, so normally a higher priced model will have extra features/better materials.

 

[ameridaddy]

My M&P 15 had a chrome lined barrel with an M4 profile, current models have a 1:7 twist for heavier bullets. I don't know if the M4 profile is a big deal for the civilian market, but some LE organizations might want to mount a grenade launcher for tear gas?
The Sport has some brand X profile with 1:9 twist, and a semi useless S&W melonite lining.

The M&P has a forward assist and dust cover; Sport 1 does not, I think Sport II does..

The M&P 15’s lower receiver has a standard, pinned plastic trigger guard which allows you to change it to a large winter glove profile. The Sport 2 has an integral trigger guard in the lower. This doesn’t really matter unless you absolutely need to change the trigger guard. S&W advertises this as a “feature” of the Sport 2, but I think it’s a cost saving measure, as they can skip the process of pinning the trigger guard during assembly. The Sport 2 hammer looks like a MIM part to me.

My M&P 15 came with a Troy steel folding rear BUS, while the Sport comes with a polymer Magpul sight. My M&P 15 also came with a heat-shielded handguard while the Sport 2 handguard is just plastic.

IMHO, the Sport will do just fine unless you plan to go into battle and fire thousands of rounds in a hostile weather environment. Take the money you save over the full-blown M&P and buy a sling, magazines and ammo. Whatever you buy, shoot the heck out of it with the iron sights until you are very familiar with it before even thinking about optics or other mods.

 

[Eric300]

[Since I'm intending to install a Red Dot to my rifle I didn't see the need for the manual sights]

Looks like you got the answer(s) you were looking for. I will just add that you SHOULD have BUS (back-up [iron] sights) on ANY firearm equipped with optics. Especially on an AR platform.

 

[Stingingfork]

[Since I'm intending to install a Red Dot to my rifle I didn't see the need for the manual sights]

Looks like you got the answer(s) you were looking for. I will just add that you SHOULD have BUS (back-up [iron] sights) on ANY firearm equipped with optics. Especially on an AR platform.

What type of rail setup for the Red Dot would I need to provide a co-witness between the two sights or is that possible?

And as to my original question from the replies I can assume the approx. $300 difference in MRSP basically between the 15OR and the Sport II is the chrome lining, trigger guard and the handguard. I just figured the 15OR might have a better grade of receivers for the money but based on the response from the CS at S&W I guess that's not the case.

 

[WR Moore]

OK, at least originally, the Sport had a lower receiver made from an alloy billet, the others use/used a lower made from an alloy forging. Depending upon use, the difference might not matter, but the forging has the edge on strength.

The rail for optic mounting is on the upper receiver. There are gas blocks that have rails on them for BUIS mounting. You do have to be careful to get the front sight height to match your rear sight depending upon how/where the front sight is mounted. Depending upon your intended use, the standard front sight tower might be a better option. There are scads of railed handguards, the ones with rails on top, sides and bottom can be hard on the hands as well as overpriced.

Contrary to internet myth, the chrome lined barrel does have a longevity edge if rapid fire is part of your intended use. The 1-9 twist barrel has a slight accuracy edge when using common bullet weights, the 1-7 has been known to cause expanding bullets to come apart enroute to targets. Not an issue with ball ammo.

 

[Oldsalt66]

For current production S&W AR 15 type rifles, there is really no significant difference except the regular models have a 1in8 twist vs 1&9 for the sport ll.

Both models have Armorite, AKA, Melonite, rather than chrome lined, barrels.

Well manufactured Melonited barrels are very durable as well as accurate, and in fact, some folks prefer them to chrome lined.

 

[cyphertext]

OK, at least originally, the Sport had a lower receiver made from an alloy billet, the others use/used a lower made from an alloy forging. Depending upon use, the difference might not matter, but the forging has the edge on strength.

I believe you are mistaken here, not that it matters for the OP's question. I have a Sport I, both upper and lower are forged, not billet, and were Anchor Harvey forgings if memory serves. I remember that a S&W marketing guy was on a video saying that they were forged in house, yet we all had forge markings that were not S&W on ours!

 

[WR Moore]

Don't recall where the billet receiver information came from, may have been the S&W website whenever it was I looked (2010-2012?). Thanks for the correction/information, but it wouldn't be the first time that stock on hand took precedence over a spec sheet when production needs dictated otherwise. Supply can also dictate official changes in specification. If the limited number of forges can't keep up with demand, billet receivers work.

As I just noted, when production needs dictate, parts sources can vary from spec. We had Colts arrive with receivers* bearing forge hall marks that showed outsourcing. I can't recall what sources, but do recall they weren't part of the forges that allegedly only forged for Colt or FN. Somewhere I've got a list of umpteen sources of forgings for the AR platform and if they only forged as subcontractors.

*Don't recall if only uppers or included lowers. Do recall being surprised. Did give us something to twit the Colt fanboys about.

 

[Stingingfork]

Since my M&P 15 came optic ready (without sights) I originally planned on placing just a red dot sight on my rifle but based on friends and a comment on this post I was advised that I did need the back-up sights for when a battery dies or the red dot just fails to work. I've been looking for some reasonable back-up sights and found a ton of different manufacturers available. I was leaning toward the Magpul MBUS polymer based on their price and reviews but they state not to mount their front sight on a railed gas block which my rifle has so I am looking for a quality metal set but would like to stay in a price range of $75 to a $150 for the set. I will add the optic once I mount my back-up sights so I can try to get a co-witness setup. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[WR Moore]

Try Troy Industries. Brownells has several pages of their stuff.

 

[M1903A3]

M&P 15 vs M&P 15 Sport II-Why The Price Difference

It should be pointed out that nowadays S&W forges their own lower receivers. My Sept 2020 produced M&P-15 Sport II has an Anchor Harvey forged upper receiver, and a 1:9 twist barrel made by Thompson/Center, which Smith and Wesson owns.

There are fewer companies that forge AR uppers and lowers than finish and machine them. For example my Ruger SR-762 has Cerro Forge upper and lower receivers which were finish machined by Matrix Aerospace for Ruger! Sub-contractors are common in OEM parts. That Ruger has a Schmid Tool and Engineering MIM fire control group in it too. Both the SR-762 and my S&W M&P-15 Sport II have identical butt stocks, which were likely made by JE Machine Tech for both companies, differing only in having the other company emblems where JE puts theirs. Usually sub contractors have non disclosure agreements meaning they won’t say who makes what for who, but generally when makers have to warranty guns they don’t accept junk! That doesn’t mean there are never problems!! The M&P-15 had problems at first, possibly due to sub contracted parts. Ruger ended up changing fcg’s in the SR-762 after complaints, but I like the Schmid fcg in mine.

Basically, a brand name on anything does not guarantee that all of it, or ANY of it, was actually MANUFACTURED by that name brand! Recall Sears or JCPenney. We had a JCPenney fridge and a TV when I was younger, both of which were really completely General Electrics!


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[cyphertext]

based on friends and a comment on this post I was advised that I did need the back-up sights for when a battery dies or the red dot just fails to work.

I do recommend getting the back up sights just in case, even on a range toy / fun gun. I was invited to go on a hunting / shooting weekend with some friends. We are out in the middle of nowhere, a couple of hours from a town of any real size. Pull my AR out of the case and the battery was dead in my red dot. Since I had sights, I was still able to hog hunt and do some target shooting.

 

[rockquarry]

No argument regarding an aperture rear sight and a front sight. As for optics, consider a good quality low to moderate magnification scope with a plain crosswire reticle, for example, a duplex. Simple and no batteries needed. Use one enough to become familiar with it and you'll likely not see a need for other gimmick-oriented scopes or reticles.

 

[vmtcmt]

UTG Leapers makes a couple of inexpensive risers that will allow you to absolute co-witness a red dot sight (RDS), if you decide to go that route. I've used both with great success.

Leapers, Inc. - Hunting/Shooting, Sporting Goods and Security Gear

Leapers, Inc. - Hunting/Shooting, Sporting Goods and Security Gear

 

[Stingingfork]

Thanks for all of the informative comments and I'm looking forward with some assistance from the members of this forum to complete my build with the necessary add-ons to make it fully functional and a great addition to my gun collection...