Model 1905

[ClearDark]

Hello all,

I have been a fan of the early SW and Colt revolvers, and today had the chance to pick one up.

I ended up getting a S&W M&P Model 1905 4th change. Initially, it looked like the Victory model, however it lacked the serial prefix. Upon further investigation, it appears someone wanted to make this a victory clone. The finish is parked, the grips are plain, and there is a metal loop at the base of the grip. I know its not a victory model because the serial # is 974xxx placing it later in the years before they renamed the model to 10.

Anyhow, it appears to have been altered from its original design, but thats not a big deal. Overall its in good shape, with some minor holster wear. Anyone know why they would want to convert it to a victory clone ? Either way its a neat revolver, and a great addition to my collection.

Anyone know of a good disassembly how to? It would be nice to know should I need to disassemble it.

 

[ClearDark]

Hello all,

I have been a fan of the early SW and Colt revolvers, and today had the chance to pick one up.

I ended up getting a S&W M&P Model 1905 4th change. Initially, it looked like the Victory model, however it lacked the serial prefix. Upon further investigation, it appears someone wanted to make this a victory clone. The finish is parked, the grips are plain, and there is a metal loop at the base of the grip. I know its not a victory model because the serial # is 974xxx placing it later in the years before they renamed the model to 10.

Anyhow, it appears to have been altered from its original design, but thats not a big deal. Overall its in good shape, with some minor holster wear. Anyone know why they would want to convert it to a victory clone ? Either way its a neat revolver, and a great addition to my collection.

Anyone know of a good disassembly how to? It would be nice to know should I need to disassemble it.

 

[Duster42]

I have a M&P model of 1905 4th change,.38 special serial# 97462x that was shipped on April 30,1942.
The factory letter states that this handgun was shipped with a 4" barrel,sand blasted blue finish and smooth walnut grips.
This one also has the lanyard loop.
Mine was shipped to a Sheriff's Office in NJ.
This one still has the original finish and all numbers matching including the right grip and looks like it was never used after it was delivered.
You might want to have yours lettered.

 

[ClearDark]

Wow, my serial is 974621, very very close to yours! Whats your complete #?? Any way to find out for sure what the date on mine is?

Mine has a 6" (oops meant 4") barrel, the smooth walnut grips like yours, but the finish I cant tell for sure. It looks like a park job, but it sure as well could be sand blasted blue. Any sure ways to tell? There is some minor holster wear on the front of the muzzle, and a bit on the trigger guard edge, but thats it.

I also checked the serial match. The serial on the frame matches the serial on the cylinder face, and the barrel. I didnt even think to check the grips, so I did and they matched as well. It's all matching. I sure wish I knew if the finish was original or not.

How do I go about getting mine lettered? Call S&W?

Also, the barrel has a stamp that says "38 S.& W. special CTG. I assume it shoots .38 special, but I wanna be sure. Also, what does CTG mean?

Thanks again, this board is a wealth of knowledge and I will await your follow up response.

 

[Muley Gil]

Also, what does CTG mean?

Cartridge.

 

[ClearDark]

Thanks for the form.

Any way to tell what kinda finish I have? I would really like to know what a blasted blue finish looked like, then I could compare.

 

[mikepriwer]

It looks like what you are calling park. The factory never did
parkerizing. Sometimes it was called midnight blue, or midnight black,
but what it was , was sandblast bluing. The guns were not polished, but
rather sand-blasted, then blued.

Later, Mike Priwer

 

[ClearDark]

That makes sense. It 'looks' parked, but it doesnt have the normal properties that parkarizing has, so I would assume that it's the factory finish. All the more wonderful. Thanks for the help guys.

 

[opoefc]

ClearDark, Your gun is what collectors call a "Pre-Victory" and is sought after by Victory collectors. It's not a clone. From your description it appears 100% factory and is unusual in that it has a 6 in. barrel. It was shipped in about April 1942 and will letter a shipped to a civilian US destination, probably a Police dept or a defense plant guard. S&W used several different names for the finish applied to these wartime guns, such as Sand Blast Blue, Black Magic, etc. They made a very few with Parkerized finishes, but quit and used their own process for a dull finish, when they found out that Parkerizing was a patented process that would require them to pay a royalty. Ed.

 

[ClearDark]

Thanks for the responses.

I did make a mistake; it's actually a 4" model, not the 6", my bad. I initially meant 4", but for some reason 6" came to mind. Either way, it does appear to be 100% factory, and the blueing is still in good condition. There is some minor wear on the gun. The condition is very good, and the rifling is sharp and shinny. The walnut grips are in really good shape. I would rate the overall condition at about 90%.

 

[hsguy]

Here is pre-Victory 997546 that shipped to the US Maritine Commission on May 25, 1942. Appears to be refinished. John

 

[ClearDark]

 

[SIG229fan]

Recently picked up a 1905/4th Change at a local show.

It's in excellent shape, with numbered grips, and *nickled*. All the roll-marks are still factory sharp and it shows no sign of buffing.

I'm suspicious that it wasn't shipped from the factory with nickle finish because I've not ever seen one in all my years of collecting and gunshow perusing.

Should I spend the $30 to have Mr. Jinks research it?

Update: Forgot to mention that the serial number is 6373xx.

 

[ClearDark]

I am taking a closer look and notice some additional markings on it.

On the right side of the frame, under the grips are some markings. What do they mean?

I see a big S, what looks like F5 or EF, or ES even, a half moon/crescent, and a Z. On the other side is an 8 and a K. I assume the K is for K frame, but what do the other markings mean?

Thanks

 

[smith17]

Sig:
Regarding yours, is there an N stamped anywhere on the back side of the cylinder or under the left stock on the grip frame?
Ed

 

[SIG229fan]

"Regarding yours, is there an N stamped anywhere on the back side of the cylinder or under the left stock on the grip frame?"

No, sir...no 'N' marked in either location.

 

[smith17]

Sig:
The serial number is late enough that it probably would be marked with an N if it was originally nickel.
Ed

 

[SIG229fan]

Thanks, Ed...that's what I was thinking but will probably letter it anyway. It's certainly nice enough to keep whether or not it was shipped as a nickel piece.