Need help identifying part on DA .38 S & W breaktop

[brazosdave]

Gentlemen, this popped out whilst i was removing thetrigger guard. Now, the trigger stays to the rear when it goes through the firing cycle. Any help identifying it and showing removal/replacement would be appreciated. I am thinking there may have been a spring component, and am wondering if anyo0ne sources these. Thanks in advance!

 

[kryten67]

Hello, I can't really tell which part it is without you taking it all apart. I will attach a picture from david chicoine book. If I was a betting man I think its part 181-rear sear.

 

[kryten67]

photo was kinda blurry. I don't know why the photo's are so blurry but if you want I can email you some photos of disassembly.

Everett

 

[nutsforsmiths]

I looked in my older Numrich Gun Parts catalog and found that part as #35 on the Hammerless model and is called a Stirrup. The same part is #32 on the version you have.

As to where it is supposed to go, I wonder if it sits in the back part of the trigger guard, with the rear trigger guard pin going though the hole in the stirrup. I looked in my Gun Digest Firearm Assembly/Disassembly book at this model, but it does not show this piece being removed in any way.

I personally have never had my 38 top breaks completely apart, so I am not sure. I know H&R top breaks have a part that sits behind the rear trigger guard held in place by that rear trigger guard pin. That part on the H&R is the sear. Of course, the internal design of the Smith is much more intricate than an H&R and the parts are not the same, but that is the best I can tell you.

Hopefully someone else here can give you a more detailed answer.

 

[GtownGeorge]

Just a guess but part 182 goes through the top of the trigger and has a pin that part 183 slides onto. Part 183 fell off the pin

 

[mmaher94087]

It appears that you have an "extra" part floating around inside your revolver. The part you show that is not attached to the gun appears to be a "stirrup". That part exists in your revolver and attaches to the lower rear of the hammer (the pin) and is held by the "hook" of the mainspring.

 

[brazosdave]

looking at it, I believe it attaches to a pin at the front of the hammer assembly. I have the Chicoine book, and there is mention of a "fly". It is not pictured though. I am wondering if this might be the elusive fly, and if it just fell off a pin or broke. I fear i will have to do a complete action dissassembly, don't have cupped punches, but i think a piece of wood or copper might do ok

 

[kryten67]

Yes that will do in a pinch. Let us know how it goes and what part is broken.

 

[Thuer]

Do not use the revolver without this part. Your lock will be worn out. This part is for helping the double action movement. It is located in the hammer. I am not a very technical person. But this part was broken to in .38 model double action of a friend. The repair was 150 euro by a good gunsmith.

 

[glowe]

I am with Mike on this one. I do not recall ever seeing a 38 DA part that looks anything like what fell out of your revolver. I checked the schematic in Chicoine's Antique Firearms book and nothing there either?? Have you tried to work the action just as the revolver sits? It should function fine, but just keep you thumb on the hammer so it does not work off the stud. Cycle it a couple of times and let the hammer down gently each time. If it is working normally, put the extra part in the drawer for now.

I will tell you that I have found various materials used as shims to keep the trigger spring in place, so if it dropped out when you took off the trigger guard, maybe that was its purpose.

 

[brazosdave]

Thanks all. I have not dissassembled the action yet (no cupped punches), but the action works with the exception that the trigger will not return to the forward position, it stays to the rear. I was afraid it was like our European friend says, the fly that was a part of the hammer in later production models , but not sure as have never seen that part listed. Not sure if it was a shim either though, lol! Sometimes, it's best not to take old guns apart, i reckon. I'm gonna try to backyard mechanic it, hate to spend more at a gunsmith than what i paid for the gun. Appreciate the time and help from all!

 

[Skeetr57]

I have the Chicoine book but can't lay my hands on it at the moment, so I am working from memory. The trigger return spring is normally held in place by the trigger guard, so without the trigger guard being installed, the trigger won't return. Sometimes re assembly of the trigger guard and spring can be aggravating.
A fly is normally used in a hammer to prevent the sear from catching in the half cock or safety notch when firing in single action. The fly is mounted in a slot in the front of the hammer and pivoted so that inertia makes it fly out when the hammer falls quickly. I believe that I see a pin hole in your hammer that a fly might be pivoted on.
I don't have a .38 DA of the correct model to check, but on the .44DA, the single action sear is a separate part mounted behind the trigger, and pivoted on its own pin through the frame. I see such a pin on your picture, directly below the hammer pivot stud. You should be able to observe the single action sear and its engagement with the hammer through the side plate opening.

 

[glowe]

. . . I believe that I see a pin hole in your hammer that a fly might be pivoted on . . .

Good eye, I missed the empty pin hole. You are absolutely right and that is just where the fly goes on very late production 38 DAs as I remember. Check for the fly by looking at the bottom of the hammer. It should be tucked into a slot. Still difficult to understand why it would have fallen out, unless the previous owner forgot to put the pin back in during reassembly.