Need some garand info before I bid.

[Kid_Pappy]

Hello all. There is an estate auction on my street with the following.

(ROCK RIVER ARMS AR 15 (NEW, NEVER FIRED) – ROCK RIVER ARMS PISTON DRIVEN AR 15 PISTOL – SPRING FIELD ARMORY XDS 45 WITH LASER – M 44 7.62x54 – T53 CHINESE RIFLE – BRITISH ENFIELD MK1 NO.4 303 – LEE ENFIELD 303 MK1 – JAPANESE M-38 6.5MM – M-38 7.62X54R – 1903 SPRINGFIELD – K-98 MOUSER – M1 GARAND 8-42 – (2) M1 GARAND 1943 – (2) M1 GARAND SPRINGFIELD – M1 CARBINE – M1 GARAND KOREAN WAR – M1 GARAND 1918 – M1 GARAND 5-43 – M1 GARAND 7-43 - AK47 – 30-30 1967 – MARLIN 30-30 NO SCOPE - (3) CHINESE SKS – NORINCO SKS – M91/30 MOSIN NAGANT – M91/30 A MOSIN NAGANT – LEE ENFIELD MK1 1944 – LEE ENFIELD – 30-30 SCOPE – SPEEDMASTER 552 – NYLON 66 – 870 WINGMASTER – 1100 AUTO – SCOPED MOSIN NAGANT – MOSSBERG 20 BOLT – BRITISH ENFIELD – GERMAN GEW 88 – YUGO SKS – P-32 KEL TEC – 9MM KEL TEC – P-32 – 1911)

I would like to bid on one of the garands but I know too little about these to make an informed decision. Are the ones manufactured in war-time more valuable? If so what does a scarred up garand go for? As you see this guy collected all types of military arms. Does anyone see anything special in the list?

Merry CHRISTmas and thanks for any advice,

 

[Zarr]

There were only two sources for Garands during WWll, The Armory in Springfield, MA., and Winchester. Find out the makes of the wartime Garands, the Winchesters were fewer in number making them a little more desirable.

You mentioned a 1903 Springfield. If the serial number is over 850,000, the receiver has a better heat treatment and should be fine to shoot (prior to serial number 850,00 the receiver was not heat treated as well as later models, therefore they are more dangerous to shoot).

The Nylon 66 is a .22lr, but the color (brown, black or green) would affect the price (brown being found more often than green). You can find more about this on-line.

I hope this little information helps.

 

[dswancutt]

A little more Garand info. Post war Manufacturers where Springfield, H&R and International Harvester. Collectability starts with IH, H&R and then Springfield.
For pricing, go to the CMP Sales page to see what they are selling for. I personally would not pay over CMP pricing.

 

[Kid_Pappy]

The nylon is black. I probably will bid on it along with the other Remingtons. I have a 552 and a Wingmaster but always looking for a bargain. I do not have expectations of these selling cheap but you never know?

Thanks for the tip. I will check on that Springfield's serial #

 

[DWalt]

"You mentioned a 1903 Springfield. If the serial number is over 850,000, the receiver has a better heat treatment and should be fine to shoot (prior to serial number 850,00 the receiver was not heat treated as well as later models, therefore they are more dangerous to shoot)."

Not necessarily true. Hatcher's Notebook discusses and analyzes the topic at considerable length and concludes that ammo defects and use of incorrect ammo (8mm) caused most of the problems. And the U. S. Army did not pull any of them from service during WWI. Personally, I have an early 1916 '03 (Springfield, SN 666xxx) which I have fired extensively, and I have never felt that I was at risk by doing so.

 

[austintexas]

M1s go from $650 to $5000+. What drives the price is Manufacturer, year, originality and condition. CMP starts at $650 Field grade, all that is really guaranteed is receiver will be original mfg and barrel wear will be specified in a certain range. Around here run of the mill nice mixmasters run $900 to $1200. The more original parts the higher the price. If you don't know much about Garands you should buy a CMP service grade. I've bought many from CMP and have never been disappointed, besides that they deliver to your house, you don't have to pay an FFL to run it across his books, no sales tax and shipping is included in the price
SWCA 892

PS, It is not that hard or complicated to qualify to buy from CMP

 

[Grayfox]

Austintexas is correct. There are entire books dedicated to the Garand and its collectibility. A correct, all matching rifle in excellent condition can bring major bucks.
However, also remember that these were military rifles and the vast majority have had parts changed, swapped or repaired at some point in their lives. Most common M1s are mixmasters.
Generally, WW II vintage rifles are more desirable. However, IHCs are highly sought after.
CMP does sell them for $650. However, on the open market, gun shops, gun shows etc, a decent shooter grade rifle will usually sell in about the $1000-1200 range.

I'd also suggest you take a good look at the M1 Carbine listed. Another great U.S. military collectible. Great rifle and a whole lot of fun to shoot.

 

[Valmet]

Austintexas is right on the money. If interested in a shooter I'd forego a CMP Field Grade all together and spring for the Service Grade. As for collecting, there are far too many variables to little info provided to give you a realistic estimate on price, but original, high-conditioned Garands bring serious money.

 

[merl67]

Zarr and Dwalt hit the high points I had a low numbered Springfield years ago shot the heck out of it had a lyman peep sight very accurate zero problems. The Remington nylon 66 Apache Black anything below $300 is safe if it is in good shape.I haven't bought a Garand in a while but I see them selling at $1000 and up. The mauser could be a sleeper as well but too many variables to get into here. M! carbine if an original Winchester with correct parts is worth quite a bit, but any WW2 M1 Carbine in good shape is worth at least $800 in my area.

 

[Faulkner]

. . . M! carbine if an original Winchester with correct parts is worth quite a bit, but any WW2 M1 Carbine in good shape is worth at least $800 in my area.

I agree that a M1 carbine if an original Winchester with correct parts is worth quite a bit, but also;

M1 carbine if an original Inland with correct parts is worth quite a bit
M1 carbine if an original Underwood with correct parts is worth quite a bit
M1 carbine if an original I.B.M. with correct parts is worth quite a bit
M1 carbine if an original Saginaw with correct parts is worth quite a bit
M1 carbine if an original Rock-Ola with correct parts is worth quite a bit
M1 carbine if an original Quality Hardware with correct parts is worth quite a bit
M1 carbine if an original National Postal Meter with correct parts is worth quite a bit
M1 carbine if an original Standard Products with correct parts is worth quite a bit

You are very unlikely to find any USGI M1 carbine with correct parts. To know what correct parts are you need a reference book.

As Grayfox noted above, there are dozens of thick reference books about USGI M1 Garands and M1 carbines available on Amazon.com and I would recommend that anyone considering spending over $1K on a Garand or carbine invest in a reference book first.

I frequent estate sales from time to time and have made some good purchases on occasion. I also saw two guys run the bid up on a Rock-Ola M1 carbine to over $2,000 that was probably worth about $800 because they had "heard" that Rock-Ola made carbines were the most valuable. Their ignorance cost the winner of that bid over a thousand bucks.

 

[DWalt]

Regarding M1 Carbines, after WWII the Army put most of those remaining in service through an extensive arsenal reconditioning and upgrading program, therefore nearly all of them seen today will not be in WWII-original condition. The most visible indications of a rebuild are the presence of a click-adjustable rear sight and of a bayonet stud on the barrel, but there are several other differences. The great majority will also have been fitted with new replacement stocks. Those carbines encountered in original condition were likely to have been WWII "Duffel Bag Specials" which were stolen by returning GIs. Around 10 years ago, a friend found one at an estate sale, a Saginaw (one of the most desirable makers), in near-perfect WWII-original condition. He paid $300 for it. He had no idea as to how good a deal he got until I told him.

Regarding price, at gun shows I seldom see any M1 carbine tagged at much less than $1000. Ditto for an M1 Garand. Also about 10 years ago, I was fortunate to find a dirty but otherwise good condition import Garand (Springfield 1943) with a fair bore for $200. It cleaned up nicely and shoots OK.

 

[2152hq]

I'd go after the M1 Garand 1918 listed in the auction. Gotta be a rare one!

You need a a lot of experience and knowledge about all these different MilSurp rifles to be able to pick the rarity, or high dollar perfection piece from a run of the mill offering.

Keep your bids in the general range of a 'shooter' grade rifle and you don't get hurt (too often!). Checking all the same things you'd check when looking over any firearm apply,,bore, action stock, ect.

Is the one example you're starring at on the table up for bid right now worth $1000 more than the next one coming up.
Only your experience and knowledge of the complicated subjects will tell you.
Don't have it?, then don't fool yourself. Keep the bids in the range where you could take the same $$ and buy the same rifle at a show or shop.

Altered or sporterized ,,the Milsurp rifles usually tumble in price and value quickly.
Restoring one can be done, but depending on the particular rifle, replacement parts can equal more than you already have in the piece.
Sometimes(usually) 'bringing one back' is more costly than finding an orig. But we do it anyway.

The Low#'03 Springfield Armory prod in all orig Military configuration are very valuable. Same holds for the Low# '03 Rock Island Arsenal.

Dispite the 'they'll blow up' back and forth debate about the strength of the recv'rs on them those early unaltered rifles are very sought after collectibles.
(You take your side on that debate and settle in for a 50 page thread, 100yr/old debate if you care to)

Sporterize a fine orig Low# 03 into a deer rifle, and value drops to nearly nothing as the Low# stigma takes hold.
Even people that before may have had no opinion of the subject suddenly will err on the side of caution and stay away from one.
One that is chopped but can be 'brought back' can still bring some decent $$.
Is that what you want or want to get involved with? or are you just looking for a nice shooter or a display rifle only?

Even the Double HeatTreat and N/S recv'r '03s turned into hunting rifles go begging for owners usually. Usually restocked with a Bishop/Fajen type stock, a scope mounted, bolt handle altered, ect. they can be a great buy for a hunting rifle, but again don't get in too deep.

Finding ANY of the '03's (or Mausers) sporterized by one of the famous gunsmiths or 'smithing firms of the day like G&H, Hoffman, DuBiel, Hart Arms, is a great find. Usually the finest workmanship and materials of the day.

You never know what can show up at an auction or a get-rid-of-it-sale.

Good luck!

 

[DWalt]

Perhaps the rarest and most sought-after M1 Garand is the early "Gas Trap" version. It's easily distinguishable. I have seen only one of those. See:
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBAqqRiJRLQ[/ame]

 

[Kid_Pappy]

They are all Springfields

All of the Garands are Springfields. Some are pretty rough but this one looks to be in great shape. Sorry for blurry image. I looked up the serial # and this one was born May 1942.

 

[Kid_Pappy]

The above gun sold for $850. The Garands sold between $800 and $1,350. I wanted one but I'm pretty sure they all went to 1 or 2 buyers that were willing to spend what was necessary. I would have been a buyer around $500 but knowing so little about these was afraid to go any higher.