New 1911 ?

[Cal44]

I'm thinking of getting a new 1911 45 acp pistol.

I already have a Colt, but am considering other brands including Smith.

My question is:

Where does S&W 1911's rank with others in similar price ranges like Kimber, Ruger, and Colt.

And what are the plusses and minuses?

And what do you get that is better if I step up to the Wilson / Nighthawk price range.

I have mostly Smiths on the revolver side, with a couple Rugers.

 

[OKFC05]

And what do you get that is better if I step up to the Wilson / Nighthawk price range.

Top quality parts, hand fitted and a joy to behold.

But the sad fact is that I shoot an old 1991A1 stainless colt 5" as well as the custom shop Colt or the S&W Pro. The old gun has a rather loosely fitted trigger that is a little "stagey" but I guess an old revolver shooter likes a little takeup in the trigger that would drive many 1911 shooters nuts.

In other words, I don't do justice to the "better" guns in my scores, and you need to shoot some and see what YOU prefer and can do with them.

 

[Fishinfool]

In my opinion, a 1911 is a 1911 is a 1911.... The details is in parts quality, and fitting. Generally, but not always, you tend to get what you pay for. An inexpensive 1911, like a Rock Island (I have one) will have good quality fit, materials, and finish. Good accuracy and reliability. About $400.00 or so.

The higher end 1911's - Think Colt, Kimber, S&W, STI, maybe even Ruger, should show more precision fitting, better triggers, sight options, maybe a forged frame instead of cast, better accuracy....etc.

When you get to the semi-custom level, like Baer, Wilson, Nighthawk, etc., You should be seeing better finish and fitting of important parts like the trigger, barrel locking lug / link / frame interface, top quality barrels, hand fitting of the barrel bushing, etc. Durability, as well as accuracy should be better than average, (think 1 to 1 1/2 inches at 25 yards) along with a lot of extra hand work, such as hand checkering the frame.

Thing is, the incremental changes and improvements add real fast to the cost of the gun. Fact is my RIA 1911 is actually a pretty nice piece, and does what it is supposed to do everytime I shoot it.

In the mid-level guns, I happen to like Kimbers, as they are feature rich, reliable, and accurate. I own a couple Colt Gold Cups, and while beautifully blued, neither is as accurate or tight as my Kimbers. Can't speak from long term experience with the others in this price range, but have heard good about most of them, especially the STI's.

Larry

 

[smitty_bs]

I really like my S&W1911. 750 rounds through it.....utterly reliable and accurate too. This is a rather basic one - no forward serrations, traditional guide rod, low mount Novak's, wood grips, blued finish.

 

[shawn mccarver]

Colt is to the 1911 as S&W is to the revolver. S&W, Springfield, Ruger and Remington make nice 1911s, but with Colt's re-investment in computer machines and its relatively good fortunes in the last decade or more, they are turning out REALLY high quality guns.

So, if you are against a current production Colt for any reason, including that you just want something different, S&W certainly fills that bill, but so does Springfield and Ruger.

If you do not have money to spend, try a Rock island. Very good pistols and excellent customer service if you have a problem.

 

[M29since14]

My question is:

Where does S&W 1911's rank with others in similar price ranges like Kimber, Ruger, and Colt.

And what are the plusses and minuses?

All three of the companies you name make good 1911s. The folks who worry about resale are always going to favor Colt. The latest Colts I have seen look very good. I would bet they shoot good too.

No experience with Rugers but everyone who tells me about them seems pleased. (Ruger people can be that way. ) Between the Kimbers and the S&Ws, I think the S&Ws are a better value, but there are so many models from each manufacturer it is hard to make exact comparisons. I'd rank the S&Ws (non-PC guns) in the same class with Kimbers and Colts and buy whichever I liked best based on features vs. dollars. I might favor S&W over the others just based on service. I have heard many complaints about Kimber in that way, and know first hand about Colt.

The inexpensive guns are just that - inexpensive. I would expect less accuracy and more problems with parts failing. In the higher end guns, you are going to get accuracy, a properly adjusted trigger, and a better grade of parts throughout the gun. In the mid-price range, I think the S&Ws are hard to beat as long as you do not agonize over the non-Browning extractor. (I don't.)

The S&W model shown above by Smittybs is a reasonably priced model. I have never seen anyone complain much about them. Some have bad triggers, and I have seen one grip safety fail, but accuracy and function seem to be good. For a basic 1911 a couple notches above the economy brands, that one is a pretty darned nice pistol.

All in all, it really comes down to what features you want and what you can afford to spend.

 

[LimaCharlie]

I have three Colts, two Kimbers, a Lew Horton S&W, a Dan Wesson Valor, and a Rock Island Armory TAC II 10mm. The RIA is the most gun for the least money. The Colts are great and hold their resale value. The Kimbers have been great and I carry the Super Carry Custom more than any of the others. The Dan Wesson Valor is the very best 1911 in my opinion without getting into the Baer, Wilson, Nighthawk price range.

 

[eveled]

You need to look at your Colt, and decide what you want to be different on your next gun. Then buy the one that is the closest to what you want, in order to minimize your expenses on aftermarket parts. I have a Remington R1, two Ruger SR1911's, and a S&W 1911pd. They all fill different roles. They are all great guns, and more accurate than I am.

For a stainless steel 1911 the Rugers are hard to beat, but are too heavy to carry, that is were the S&W with the scandium frame shines. The Remington, is closer to a GI gun, with some enhancements. Ed

 

[ericlw]

kimber, most overrated 1911 ever.

 

[jem450r]

kimber, most overrated 1911 ever.

Always someone on the thread... Prolly havent ever owned one or shot one right!?!?
My dad has a smith scandium frame, he steered me towards the kimber case...

never failed me, real accurate light pull trigger, nice and tight tolerance on everything. Came with tritium sights, nice serations ill stop gushing love this gun...
Dads smith is nice and he paid less but this one just felt right...

 

[crofoot629]

Kimber excells at advertising.
Kimber of Oregon made outstanding 1911's.
Since then quality control has haunted Kimber and the Swartz Safety is good for a click when you want a bang.

I've been shooting two Wilson Combats since 1996.
That was after the front sight fell of my Colt Combat Elite.

After going to the WC's in 1996 I haven't bought another 1911 so can only speak to what I've seen others shooting at action games, 4 Thunder Ranch classes and 13 years as a LEO.

I think those that like 1911's, or any fine firearm, would enjoy owning a WC, Baer, or Nighthawk.

Emory

 

[cddanjr]

Sig Sauer 1911



Chuck

 

[M29since14]

kimber, most overrated 1911 ever.

Possibly. I don't take that statement to mean they are bad guns - just "overrated." Kimber does seem to have a cadre of fanboys, in my area anyway, but strangely, resale value does not seem to follow on that. Used Kimbers will usually sit for a while and S&Ws and Colts get snapped up. Sort of an odd combination.

On the other hand, the Kimbers I have been around were pretty nice guns. My TLE II, purchase used, has been shot quite a bit, and - Schwarz safety and all - goes bang every time. I do not like the feel of Kimber's grip safety so it was replaced with one sold by Baer, but other than that, it is a stock gun. I trust it as much as I trust any 1911 with a firing pin safety. (prefer not to have that! )

I am not throwing stones at them but the make I have consistently seen the most trouble with has been Springfield, but that was a few years ago now. These days, all the big companies know how to make good 1911s. It's no mystery. About all that remains is deciding what you want and what you are willing to pay.

 

[crofoot629]

Always someone on the thread... Prolly havent ever owned one or shot one right!?!?
My dad has a smith scandium frame, he steered me towards the kimber case...

never failed me, real accurate light pull trigger, nice and tight tolerance on everything. Came with tritium sights, nice serations ill stop gushing love this gun...
Dads smith is nice and he paid less but this one just felt right...

You must have taken this photo prior to the extensive shooting that allowed you to form your opinion of its reliability. It sure doesn't look well used.

Emory

 

[JJEH]

I like the Colt 1911 and would recommend it to anyone at anytime.

Some of the other brands are just too loose to me. I just don't like the rattling sound they make when you shake them. Even tho - according to lots of people - it doesn't necessarily worsen accuracy. Or the feeling when I handle thee, like grip, trigger pull, cocking the hammer, racking the slide, etc.

The one and only thing S&W does wrong with their 1911 is the external extractor imo. It looks just wrong...

 

[Cal44]

One thing Kimber does right is getting guns out into the stores.

I just stopped by a new LGS and they had 8 Kimbers in stock.

One Colt 1991, plus another colt that was marked for LEO only (I assume that is one that isn't on the Cal roster of approved handguns).

Plus one Remington 1911 and one Springfield.

A couple other LGS's only have Kimbers in stock.

There is one store that has a couple Nighthawks and I may go take a look at those.

I'm not ready to fork out $3K at this point.

But I can look.

Anyway, stores can't sell what they don't have and that may explain the popularity of Kimber.

Dave

 

[JJEH]

You can also buy online and look exactly for what you like.

 

[J. W.]

I have owned three 1911s. I still own my Colt and Springfield. My Kimber was pretty, but just wouldn't run. If I were to buy another 1911 it would either be a Colt Series 70 (beautiful classic 1911) or a full size S&W E-Series with the rail. (oh how I'd love to ditch my Glock for one as a duty gun!)


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[Arik]

Kimber has 50/50 QC. You either get a great one or a lemon. A few LGSs that i frequent all say that out of all the 1911s they sell Kimbers are the ones they send back for warranty work the most.

Springfield offers the most bang for the buck. I always see their STD versions with night sights, ambi safety (important to me), beaver tail, forged slide and frame for under $800. A basic colt without night sights or ambi safety goes for close to $1G.

I like S&W, especially the external extractor. So much easier to change out without having to play with "proper tuning"

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[ericlw]

you kimber guys are a pretty uptight bunch.i didnt even say kimber was bad, just over rated.

is a les bear better then a smith and wesson...yes.

is a smith and wesson better then a kimber ?im not sure but i would say they are close to the same for the performance.

ofcourse their is the glock fan boys and they have their place much as any other gun. its just what you like.

i do like my performance center guns though.