Para Ordnance LDA's....they discontinued?

[badguybuster]

I have been doing a little searching around, looking to get one of the full size para LDA single stack nite-tacs in 45 ACP. I can't find a new one anywhere, have they discontinued them?? In fact, I dont see many full size LDA's at all. Mostly the smaller concealed carry ones. Anyone??

 

[Maximumbob54]

Having owned a full size single stack LDA for a while now I have to admit it now sets in the back of the safe. At least it came a little cheap. I thought I was going to like it more. I went right back out and bought another Colt and shoot it now. I'm betting a lot of guys bought the LDA's and felt similar to my view on them. Thus they slimmed models from sales and now they are only doing them on the more compact models. I still think it's funny to call it a "double action" since I don't think of Glocks, XD's, M&P's, or any other autos with no re-strike capability to be a "double action"... If I have to pull the slide again to reset everything then that's just some version of single action. I'm not even sure why mine has an exposed hammer. Anyways, this is mine:

I can see why they dropped this one like a hot rock... I'm still thinking of doing the same at some point. It shoots nice enough, but in retrospect it just seems like a dumb idea. Live and learn. You may love it, you never know. Try finding one to rent or ask someone at the range if you can borrow it. The trigger is nice and smooth, it's just one of those answers in search of a question... (IMHO)

 

[badguybuster]

Yeah I got a response from Para. They have discontinued ALL the full size LDA pistols. They will however, continue with the compacts.

 

[Maximumbob54]

I believe it. I'm not even on with the compacts sticking with the LDA trigger. It's so light (which is nice) that if you tried to rely in it as a true heavy double action like a Sig P220 then you are asking for trouble in a big hurry. You pretty much MUST use the safety on the LDA's. Thus my snooty attitude of the question in search of an answer. But maybe some like the difference in the trigger. I guess I think of it as a novalty piece now. The linkage does intrude on the frame rail space and eats a lot of it up. There is a surprising loss of rail from the frame. Mine was used when I bought it and I have shot a few hundred (I think four or five boxes of WWB) and don't see much wear but I'm curious what the frame life would be on it. The first time I cleaned it and saw this I thought, "what happened to the frame rail????"

 

[blackflag]

Having owned a full size single stack LDA for a while now I have to admit it now sets in the back of the safe. At least it came a little cheap. I thought I was going to like it more. I went right back out and bought another Colt and shoot it now. I'm betting a lot of guys bought the LDA's and felt similar to my view on them. Thus they slimmed models from sales and now they are only doing them on the more compact models. I still think it's funny to call it a "double action" since I don't think of Glocks, XD's, M&P's, or any other autos with no re-strike capability to be a "double action"... If I have to pull the slide again to reset everything then that's just some version of single action. I'm not even sure why mine has an exposed hammer. Anyways, this is mine:

How does it actually function if not double action? I've never used one, but always thought the idea was nice.

 

[Maximumbob54]

Yikes, I have no idea. I have never looked at it from a mechanical functioning point of view. I'm always more of the how the heck am I supposed to clean all these little levers and thingies in side... The hammer has almost no outward use it seems. "Cocked and Locked", the hammer is down and the LDA draws it back. But what gets me is the hammer can be drawn back (it won't stay back) but it has no serious spring pressure. If you dry fire it you can feel the hammer as it is pulled back it puts pressure on something somewhere, but then it goes forward again. So something somewhere inside is retaining spring pressure for I assume the firing pin. I know I'm making an assumption here but that makes me think of the firing pin more as a striker ala Glock. The LDA only seems to finish the action and at the end of its rather lengthy but light pull something trips a sear and releases the firing pin/striker. Again, the hammer is drawn back by the trigger pull but it is more for looks as it seriously has NO real pressure behind it going forward. Outside, these things look like 1911's with the trigger being a major exception. Inside, they are very anti-1911 and I won't be sending puzzle pieces to Para begging them to put them back together... I'm pretty sure if I removed the slide and then tried to detail strip it I would be lost quick. The frame parts alone are crazy different inside enough to scare me from ever trying. So I'm left in the dark how it really works. But it was cheap, different, and at the time I had the money. And for someone having abused it to the point the finish is about history I am impressed it is still fully functional, shoots straight, and feels pretty smooth in operation. So they are decent quality, but the Canadians really changed the insides.

 

[badguybuster]

There are actually two hammers, an internal one and the outer one. The slide is cut away to make room for the rotation of the arm. (I just read this). there is an article on the net somewhere (read a while back) where one of the LDA's was put through a pretty darn brutal durability test and did extremely well. Guess I will stick with my wheel guns for now.

 

[badguybuster]

Here is the link...not that it really matters now.

http://www.para-usa.com/new/downloads/reviews/HG07-01.pdf

 

[Maximumbob54]

Curiousity just got the better of me. The slide and its internals are pretty series 80 generic. I thought for sure there was more in there but no. The frame is where all the serious changes are. Oh, and the barrel has the full length feed ramp unlike the original design but that is fairly common these days also. I'm not sure about the "internal and external hammer" call. I won't be a jerk and say no, it's just hard to see in this thing. Slide removed, if I engage the grip safety, hold my thumb on the hammer and feel the trigger pull it back, the (internal hammer???) releases with the ful trigger pull and the (external???) hammer does indeed move forward with force. So the hammer is actually functional. The exposed area of the hammer that has a cut out area at the bottom of it. I can't see any deeper inside. There are two just smaller than dime sized holes cut into each side of the frame in the bottom half. The top half of each side of the frame is solid. Here is where it gets a little alien to me and I hope I didn't ruin my day:

Since I have enough trouble getting the little series 80 parts into my Colt, I will be calling an all stop on this operation. The springs and levers just went all Para on me and I better be able to get this thing back together now. Unfortunatly I am not much better now at my knowledge level of the inner workings of this gun than when I started...

 

[badguybuster]

Thanks for taking the disassembly risk.

 

[galena]

For all you guys who got stuck with Para LDAs and don't like them, let me know. Put a price on them that matches your opinion and I'll take them off your hands. Keep shootin'

 

[badguybuster]

If someone had a really nice one that is all tricked out. I'd be all over it too. Cylinder and Slide does a whole package for them that is supposed to really make them nice.

 

[Maximumbob54]

That wasn't quite the bear to put back to together but it was a little painful trying to line everything up to reinsert everything.

Galena - I'm not saying the LDA's are junk, they just didn't catch on with a big enough crowd and Para dropped them for lack of sales. The reason I say it doesn't shock me is the need/desire for a "double action" 1911 is so minimal. The only legit idea I have read is for LEO's that can't carry a single action at least they maybe can carry a LDA... I bought this thing with serious finish wear but smooth action for $300 and my only real regret is that it's going over like a lead balloon for my excitement level. Speaking of finish... The slide has what I assume to be an epoxy coating. It has a slick feel to it and has definitely been torture tested by the previous owner or owners. It exhibits minimal holster wear and some scuffs on the flats. The frame however... There is what I'm pretty sure is the remains of a Krylon finish since I can see a little over spray in a few places. Other than that it is bare steel now. I have no idea what it used to be. The frame is cast and has the plunger tube as a part of the cast same as the new Ruger SR1911. Many of the parts are MIM parts as evidence from the mark left from the mold. I note the external hammer, grip safety, thumb safety, extractor, and i'm sure more are MIM. The MSH is plastic. The slide uses common series 80 parts, but the frame uses Para specific series 80 parts. I read a while back that the company pretty much got tired of Canadian gun laws trying to put them out of business so they moved here somewhere. I of course welcome them still even after that scarey disassemble. Nothing on the gun seems low quality despite it having a hard life so far. It shoots my LSWC reloads just fine. I can't remember it having a negative issue at the range. If I was more into the LDA trigger I would likely be stripping it, have it bead blasted, and maybe either Duracoated or Cerarcoated. The article was a good read. I like the wording of the cam in the action. I still can't tell where or what but something is storing most of the energy in the frame and the trigger pull is only topping it off and then releasing it into the hammer. It's a curious design that just didn't pan out in sales.