fredj338
Member
My coated bullets will easily do 2" @ 50y in my 1911/9. I suspect if the shooter were getting 6" groups it is the shooter or the bullets are too small for his bbl.
Powder Coating Question
- Thread starter AJ
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My coated bullets will easily do 2" @ 50y in my 1911/9. I suspect if the shooter were getting 6" groups it is the shooter or the bullets are too small for his bbl.
fredj338
Member
That is about how mch I use too. With quality powder, a little goes along way.
fredj338
Member
LOL, how did I know someone would feel compelled to demonstrate their superior knowledge by picking that nit?
This reminds me of the clip/magazine, stocks/grips, yoke/crane arguments. While one term may be more accurate than another, as long as the term fits the item in question, and everyone in the conversation understands what is being referred to, what difference does it make?
It is true, in the traditional sense there is no lube involved, however the powder coat is put on the bullets for the same purpose as, and in place of, traditional lube. Not only is the purpose the same, there is sort of a similarity in the actual process as well.
But yes, "shake and bake" is an alternate and arguably more accurate descriptor for the process.
Nevertheless, among powder coaters, "tumble lube" is an oft used description for the process. Perhaps more importantly, it is exactly what reloader7.62 was referring to, and what Warren Sear was asking about.
Not really picking a nit. There is no lube to tumble?? Just a mild correction so everyone knows just what one is talking about.
If you want to use the terms interchangeably that’s fine but over the last 5 years I’ve been powder coating I’ve never once heard anyone use the terms interchangeably.
Like I said before Lee sells specific tumble lube products, has a specific process for tumble lubing bullets and it has nothing to do with powder coating. I’m not trying to start an argument, just prevent confusion....
Like I said before Lee sells specific tumble lube products, has a specific process for tumble lubing bullets and it has nothing to do with powder coating. I’m not trying to start an argument, just prevent confusion....
reloader7.62
Member
This is how I PC my bullets, the way you choose to coat yours or the process you use may vary from mine. As long as you get the results you like that is all that matters.
Tools:
Convection toaster oven for curing your bullets.
I prefer the convection oven because it heats more evenly. You can pick one up at a resale store on the cheap or just buy a new one for around $30 to $40 depending on what you like. ONLY use the oven for curing powder coated bullets or heat treating bullets from that point on NEVER use it to cook food in afterwards. If the oven is not digital and controlled by an internal PID get yourself an oven baking thermometer (WallyWorld for $7) to set your temperature dial as close as possible, most toaster ovens don't heat to what the dial indicates. Set your oven to keep a constant temperature at 400 degrees, if the temp runs +/- 25 degrees it wants hurt anything you just don't want it to get to hot or too cool.
Plastic container for tumbling bullets in.
You will need a one or more #5 plastic containers and lids depending on if you want to do more than one color, screw on types are the best but snap on lid types like I use work fine to. I use these two types of #5 container I recycle from home along with multi color plastic pony beads I get at WallyWorld for $1.50 per pack, they are large enough that they want get stuck in my big 45 ACP HP's. The combination has worked well for me to generate lots of static electricity to attract the powder to the bullets, and it acts like a buffer between the bullets as well. One thing of note is that LOW HUMIDITY is your friend as it will make generating static electricity easier, I like it to be 40% or lower. At times, I've had to coat in the house and take them out to my reloading shed to cure if the humidity is really high in my shop.
#5 container from local restaurants.
Great Value Yogurt container.
Pony Beads.
In the small container I place enough beads to fill the bottom about 1" deep, in the larger container I add enough to fill it between 1" an 2" but no more than that. I add about 1 TSP of powder to the container with the beads and shake it up for about 30 sec. notice how it already starts to stick to the beads and sides of the container. I always start out with 1 TSP if you need to add more powder to get the desired coat only add another 1/2 TSP to the mix as too much powders will clump on the bullets and you will have to tap it off before placing them on the baking tray. It's easy to add a little more powder to get a fine coating than having too much to start with.
Next I add the bullets. Make sure they are clean of any dirt, oil or lube or any contaminates that might be on your hands as the powder will not stick. I like to wash mine in 100% Acetone if they get handles much an wear nitrile groves when handling bullets I plan on coating. I generally add around 50 to 75 bullets to the container depending on caliber and weight close the lid and shake in all directions for around 30 seconds to a minute. I used black air soft BB's that I had with the clear powder coat, and they work great with clear, not so much with some other colors I've used but the pony beads will work with all colors.
After about 30 seconds to a minute of shaking I tap the lid to knock any powder off the inside and look at my bullets to see how they are coated. If they pass my inspection they should look like this or the ones in the white clear coat above.
Next I take my baking sheet and line it with a piece of Reynolds Non-Stick aluminum foil, non-stick side up, there are cheaper brands of that type foil but I think the Reynolds works best and I get around 7 to 10 uses out of a sheet before I toss it, other like silicone baking mats but powder residue tends to build up over time on those, so I just use the foil, parchment paper for baking is also an option. I take a pair of long tweezers and place all my bullets base first onto the foil, it takes some time to do it this way but I can easily have the next tray of bullets ready to cure by the time the first batch is finished curing. Many just dump the bullets into a screen tray, shake off the excess powder and dump them on the foil and bake, but I like the results I get standing them up individually and the powder flow and migrates evenly with no lumps or flat spots.
Then I pop them in a 400 degree preheated oven watch for the powder to gloss over, and then bake for 20 min. You can see the results in my original post, then I size and gas check as needed. Recently I started applying gas check to some bullets before powder coating as the powder will stick to the checks as well and makes it easier if getting the checks to fit onto some coated bullets gets frustrating.
Powders I like to use.
Smokes Super Durable Clear or Carolina or Signal Blue and Translucent Copper are all excellent powders to coat with. Smoke will sell you a pound of powder divided into 3 1/3rd lb. bags of his colors if you like but these are the colors I like and that have worked for me the best with no fuss.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?241259-Hi-quality-Powder-for-DT-or-Spraying-bullets
Eastwood powders I like.
https://www.eastwood.com/hotcoat-powder-lime-green.html
https://www.eastwood.com/hotcoat-powder-ford-light-blue.html
https://www.eastwood.com/hotcoat-powder-machine-gray.html
https://www.eastwood.com/hotcoat-powder-silver-vein.html
A few notes on cast bullet air cooled or quenched from the mold and how the curing process will anneal the cast lead bullets using an alloy that responds to water quenching or heat treating. Your results may vary depending on the original alloy used and the as cast BHN and at the time the bullets BHN is tested.
1. If you air cool your bullets when cast then PC them and allow them to air cool again the second time there is no change in the as cast BHN of the bullet.
2. If you air cool your bullets when cast then PC them and quench them right out of the toaster oven they will gain a hardness of about 75% over the as cast BHN.
3. If you quench your bullets out of the mold to begin with then PC them and allow them to air cool they will soften around 50% from the original first quenching BHN.
4. If you quench your bullets out of the mold to begin with then PC them and quench them right out of the toaster oven a second time you only loose around 15% hardness from the first quenching.
Some good videos
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqD8CcnzBOA[/ame]
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ehvOtKHQ204[/ame]
I also use smoke's pc. Bought 1# of pink for the misses and #1 of John Deere green for me and 1# of red for hot loads.
I've used all the pink, 1/2 of the red and re-ordered 2# of jd greene last year. You get +/- 10,000 coated bullets out of 1# of powder.
Don't know if there's a difference, never used the hi-tec coating. Always did the shake & bake method with the bb's & #5 container using dry powder/powder coating powder/pc.
HI-tec ='s polyurethane coating
PC ='s polyester coating
On a side note:
I like the John Deere green pc powder/look of the bullets.
They have a gloss to them. I started seeing black streaks in a 308w bbl when I started pushing the pc'd bullets over 2600fps. So I started tumble lubing the pc'd bullets and the black streaks stopped.
The pc'd bullets that are then tumble lubed look dull in color compared to the plain pc'd bullets.
Was testing those 32lc wc's/hbwc's in a 308w with 2800fps+ loads.
I've used all the pink, 1/2 of the red and re-ordered 2# of jd greene last year. You get +/- 10,000 coated bullets out of 1# of powder.
Don't know if there's a difference, never used the hi-tec coating. Always did the shake & bake method with the bb's & #5 container using dry powder/powder coating powder/pc.
HI-tec ='s polyurethane coating
PC ='s polyester coating
On a side note:
I like the John Deere green pc powder/look of the bullets.
They have a gloss to them. I started seeing black streaks in a 308w bbl when I started pushing the pc'd bullets over 2600fps. So I started tumble lubing the pc'd bullets and the black streaks stopped.
The pc'd bullets that are then tumble lubed look dull in color compared to the plain pc'd bullets.
Was testing those 32lc wc's/hbwc's in a 308w with 2800fps+ loads.
So it sounds like those of us here in Florida that want to try Powder Coating are going to be out of luck
40% Humidity . . . . Never heard of it.
It is 73% outside right now and my Hygrometer is showing 68% inside
CAJUNLAWYER
Member
STUPID QUESTION
Why do this???
Why do this???
Certain powders are much more effected by the humidity. Harbors freight powders generally require very low humidity. I’ve have good luck even at 70% humidity using a number of quality powders.
As to why do it... It’s’ an alternative to the traditional way of lubricating cast bullets. The initial investment is cheaper than buying a lubsizer. Traditionally lubed bullets are messy to handle and load. Traditional lube is Smokey and dirty when shooting. Traditional lube exposes you to lead when handling the bullets and loaded rounds.
PC is cheaper. It encapsulates the lead surface making handling the bullets safer and does a much better job in preventing leading in the barrel. Your gun comes out cleaner after shooting.
Powder coating does about take twice as much time to do versus just running the bullets through a lubesizer. I’ve been powder coating for about 5 years and just bought a Lyman 450 lubesizer a couple of months ago to use for certain applications.
As to why do it... It’s’ an alternative to the traditional way of lubricating cast bullets. The initial investment is cheaper than buying a lubsizer. Traditionally lubed bullets are messy to handle and load. Traditional lube is Smokey and dirty when shooting. Traditional lube exposes you to lead when handling the bullets and loaded rounds.
PC is cheaper. It encapsulates the lead surface making handling the bullets safer and does a much better job in preventing leading in the barrel. Your gun comes out cleaner after shooting.
Powder coating does about take twice as much time to do versus just running the bullets through a lubesizer. I’ve been powder coating for about 5 years and just bought a Lyman 450 lubesizer a couple of months ago to use for certain applications.
reloader7.62
Member
So it sounds like those of us here in Florida that want to try Powder Coating are going to be out of luck
40% Humidity . . . . Never heard of it.
It is 73% outside right now and my Hygrometer is showing 68% inside
Give it a shot it might work, I have a hard time getting good coverage myself here in NC in the summer when the humidity is high out in my shop, it gets pretty similar to yours. Keep your powder and bullets an container dry an you should be fine.
40% is not a set number that it will work at many get excellent results with it even higher. It's just where I like it to be out in my shop in the Winter as I can generate lots of static otherwise I just coat in the house and bake out on the back porch.
