Question why ejector shrouds don't have their other side milled out?

[Bill_in_fl]

My favorite double action revolver is the S&W 1917 with its unshrouded ejector rod. But I also like the model 20 1950 S&W revolver with its shrouded ejector rod too. Basically a 1917 with the ejector shroud and shorter hammer fall. But there is one question I've always wondered about.

I theorize the reason the 1917 doesn't have an ejector shroud is because mud from the WW1 trenches could get into one and stop the cylinder from closing. Well that could happen not in war too. But of course I get why the ejector shroud was later used....to protect the ejector rod from bending by being hit and stopping the cylinder from closing or working properly.

But one thing I haven't been able to figure out is why not mill out the other side of the ejector shroud too? So that any dirt that got into it would be pushed out via the rod when the cylinder closed. A skeletonized shroud would still protect the ejector rod from the bottom and some from the sides (by being wider on the sides than the ejector rod), but allow mud to be pushed out (if it got mud or debris in the shroud) and not jam up the cylinder with debris in the shroud like it could now. Seems to make sense to me. Anyone know why the ejector rod shroud wasn't milled out on its backside by Smith and Wesson?



.

 

[red9]

Someone (I seem to recall High Standard) did make a revolver with a skeletonized shroud a few years back. Perhaps being unsupported makes it subject to collapsing on the rod when used for pistol whipping?

Bob

 

[Texas Star]

red 9 refers to the High Standard Crusader, a short-lived gun, but it looked good.My guess is that the additional machining tme and cost alone precluded that, and the guns look better as-is, and the added metal protects better.

In fact, the Triple Lock, which had an additional cylinder lock and shroud/lug, did give some mud problems in British service,and the Brits requested that the lock and lug be deleted, as they were on the .38 M&P. They also wanted less weight.

Our M-1917 is essentially their .455 MK II with an inch shorter barel and chambered for .45ACP. The stocks are smooth; the .455 had checkered stocks with gold medallions.

The 1917 served with distinction and is still a fine defense revolver.

I prefer the barrel lugs as they are and have never had a mud problem. I like the looks better without a cutout.

My guess is that no one has ever requested that the lug be cut out. A custom gunsmith worthy of the name can probably alter a gun for you, if you have a lot of money and time. If you do that,please post photos. It'd be fun to see.

But I'm happy with the guns as they are. I've never heard of one jamming with dust or mud. If it worries you, just use a gun without the barrel lug. Unfortunately, those in large calibers haven't been made much in recent years. An M-1950 Army is too valuable to carry and use.

 

[murphydog]

Certain newer revolvers (the 2" N frame .357 and 45s) do have the cutout on the right shroud. I'd also guess it was a time and/or machining issue that kept it from being done.

 

[2152hq]

A cut out on the right side lets mud in as well as out. So the thinking (I'm thinkin') was to leave the thing off all together and make it simple.
Maybe Colt had the simpler of the lot when it came to mud and debris choking up the lock up system as there was none at the front end.

 

[deadin]

leave the thing off all together and make it simple

Until you whack something enough to bend the ejector rod, then you had better hope there's a stick handy.....

 

[2152hq]

You go around wackin' things with most any S&W or Colt DA and they won't last too long.
DA revolvers are fragile instruments. Very easy to put out of use..
They wouldn't pass the most basic of dirt,mud & dust tests used today.
..And remember to close the cylinder carefully with two hands so as not to spring the frame or crane .

If there was such a dire need for the shroud to better enable the revolver to double as a club then it would have never disappeared in WW1, the M&P would have had one in WW2 and Colt would have added one to their military contract designs.
But I do like the looks of them..
JMHO

 

[PH-2]

Milling adds to the expense of production.

Mike

 

[Alk8944]

The extractor rod shroud was originally intended to house the mechanism for the third (yoke) latch on the "New Century" or .44 Hand Ejector 1st Model aka "Triple Lock".

It was deleted on the second model .44 H.E. as a design requirement of British contract .455 H.E. revolvers during WWI. It was re-added to the .44 H.E. 3rd Model at the specific request of Wolf & Klar in 1926. It became a standard feature of virtually all N Frame revolvers after that time.

The reason for re-adding the shroud to the revolvers was for weight, to reduce felt recoil with heavy calibers, nothing else! It had nothing to do with protecting the extractor rod from damage, and really does not do much. To cut the slot all the way through would remove weight and largely defeat the purpose for which the shroud is a feature of the guns.

So far as "extra machining", if that were a consideration wouldn't it be left off entirely then?????????????

BTW, this is all explained in SCSW!

 

[Jack Flash]

Using a gun as a club...

This reminds me of a conversation I had with my Dad long ago. Dad was somewhat heatedly criticizing a guy for damaging a screwdriver. (Dad was a mechanic and all-around do-it-himselfer and practically revered tools.)

I said, "But he didn't have a chisel, so he used the screwdriver."

"Now he doesn't have either one," Dad replied.

...

Of course, I'm sure even Dad would have allowed an exception for someone who was engaged in life-or-death combat.

 

[Dave T]

Being that the British have such a long history of hand gunning and are such experts at it (tongue planted firmly in cheek) I too wonder why S&W didn't follow their advice/recommendations instead of listening to a bunch of Texans. What would they know about using a hand gun in a fight? (smile)

Dave

 

[sceva]

Milling adds to the expense of production.

Mike

AND the deburring operation added. - More edges to be carefully de-burred with a small, even edge break.