RANGE-REPORT!! .455 HE UNALTERED, WITH INSPECTION-PICS - THE LETTER IS HERE!!

[Swissman]

I like to introduce you my newest gun. It's a S&W .455 HE which was made for the Commonwealth. I go no idea how this gun found it's way to Switzerland, but i like it, even if i payed acutal US$ 812.--.

To look at the nearly 100 years old lockwork of the .455 HE was pretty cool. No rust at all. The lockwork is harder to operate in double-action than on any other gun i own, but not uncomfortable. I reduced now the operation-power with lesser pressure on the mainspring. The hammer will hit the primer fast enough for a secure ignition. The surface is in good shape with some dings, dents and bluewear. The barrel got no rust, the chambers are shiny and the lockup is outstanding.

Next step is finding some brass, or reducing the length and the rimthickness of some 45 Colt cases. Or maybe i can use .45 Autorims. Anyway, the rimthicknes has to be reduce to 10 - 11 thenth of a millimeter.

I am very thankfull for load-datas.

I hope you like the pictures.


Some kind of CSI-examination

The wood is not worn out to bad

I think i got luck. Not to much british proofmarks were stamped in from the Government

The barrel is in pretty good shape

The star pretends a positive lockup and it keeps its promises.

All parts got matching numbers

The gun

Swissman

 

[Swissman]

I like to introduce you my newest gun. It's a S&W .455 HE which was made for the Commonwealth. I go no idea how this gun found it's way to Switzerland, but i like it, even if i payed acutal US$ 812.--.

To look at the nearly 100 years old lockwork of the .455 HE was pretty cool. No rust at all. The lockwork is harder to operate in double-action than on any other gun i own, but not uncomfortable. I reduced now the operation-power with lesser pressure on the mainspring. The hammer will hit the primer fast enough for a secure ignition. The surface is in good shape with some dings, dents and bluewear. The barrel got no rust, the chambers are shiny and the lockup is outstanding.

Next step is finding some brass, or reducing the length and the rimthickness of some 45 Colt cases. Or maybe i can use .45 Autorims. Anyway, the rimthicknes has to be reduce to 10 - 11 thenth of a millimeter.

I am very thankfull for load-datas.

I hope you like the pictures.


Some kind of CSI-examination

The wood is not worn out to bad

I think i got luck. Not to much british proofmarks were stamped in from the Government

The barrel is in pretty good shape

The star pretends a positive lockup and it keeps its promises.

All parts got matching numbers

The gun

Swissman

 

[mesabi]

That's a nice one, Swissman. Fiocchi of Italy sells .455 ammo in the U.S.; I would think that you could find some in Europe. Certainly easier than altering .45 Colt brass.

 

[smith17]

Great score. The hammer has loads of case color left. Stocks are not bad either. Thanks for the nice pictures. Good luck with the ammo quest.
Ed

 

[HKSmith]

Congratulations on your new S&W. I bought one of these 3 years ago - it has the British officer's name engraved on it and I was able to get a lot of information about his war record and other history, which greatly added to the guns appeal.

I shoot mine regularly with .455 Webley Mark II reloads. The Webley cartridge has a very thin rim, so you can't use .45 Auto Rim or cut down .45 Colt brass. However, Hornady makes .455 Webley Mark II brass that's sold exclusively by Graf's. Hornady and Fiocchi also make loaded ammo, but it's about $40/box of 50. I'm told the Fiocchi brass is very thin and not much good for reloading.

I use Remington 250 grain lead flat point bullets, .455 diameter. This is the standard .45 Colt bullet, but works fine in the .455 Webley. I've used 4.3 grains of W231 or 4.5 grains of Unique with excellent results. Bullets are seated to the top lube groove and a light roll crimp is applied. I'll make the usual disclaimer that these loads work well in my gun, but these guns are over 90 years old, so I can't recommend them for anyone elses gun.

I use Lee dies and at current component prices in the US can reload them for about $7.50/box of 50. I stocked up on bullets and brass when I bought the gun - at those 2005 prices a box of 50 reloads is only about $4.00!

 

[Bruce51]

Wow Swissman! I can't take my eyes off of those grips. That lockwork looks great too. I hope you find some ammo soon so you can give us a range report. You have way to much fun with our/U.S. guns. Enjoy. Bruce

 

[imjin138]

That is a great find congratulations, I love those big guns

 

[Jellybean]

From the "Handloaders Manual of Cartridge Conversions" to make .455 Webly Mk II ammo start with .45 auto rim brass. Thim rim to .045" thick. Trim case to length.
They list a load using a 250 gr. lead bullet with 3.5 gr. of Bullseye.

 

[Old 44 Guy]

The main reason the double action is so stiff on your Model 1917 is the main spring is real heavy. They were made that way because of the hard military primers they used in those days. Needed the extra hard hammer blow to set the cartridge off. You have 2 very nice S&W's, enjoy 'em.

 

[j38]

Nice catch, Swissman! You did a good job cleaning up the insides of that one....and those grips are in great shape. It makes me wonder if they were added to that gun later?

Regards, Jerry

 

[Swissman]

Dear members,

Many thanks to all the good words and hints. Like always i've found good informations and friendly comments to the questions i got and/or the gun i posted here.

Swissman

 

[Kamerer]

Nice gun - mine has a heavy trigger pull, too. Now that I understand why, I may swap the mainspring out for a factory standard one, I guess it would be lighter than the military one. I did not know that - Thank you, Dick.

Swissman - those grips are great. I have been trying to track down a pair. Here in the US, in that condition, the grips alone are minimum $200 and I have seen them trade as high as $300.

 

[handejector]

A pretty old gun. The 455-2nd Models were the most plentiful N frames made with Gold medallion grips, since the medallion was dropped shortly after WW I.

I would leave the original mainspring in it, and keep the strain screw tight. Part of the fun of shooting the old ones is shooting them like the original owners had to.

 

[Sgt Neutron]

Swissman,
I reload .455 Mk II for my Webley Mk VI. As previously stated Fiocchi loads .455, so you should be able to find some in Europe. Here in the states, the .455 cartridge has become somewhat common in the last 15 years. There is a source for brass, bullets & dies: Buffalo Arms. They specialize in older cartridge brass & bullets. Here is what I use:

http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,413.html

http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,3862.html

The brass is new Hornady, and is Boxer primed.
On a side note thay also have quality black powder

:
http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/2,392.html

 

[Jack Flash]

Buffalo Arms also offers the longer Webley Revolver Mk I cases

http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,414.html

Ken Waters has an interesting article (including load data) in his book Pet Loads

 

[Kobold_27]

Fantastic detail photography! Great gun too!

Best,

Michael

 

[Memphis]

Did any of ya'll notice that the hammer has the chafing bushings on it? This really interests me since I have been wondering what models these hammers were used on. For a long while I thought it was only on Triplelocks. But then I noticed in the Neal & Jinks book, back in the radiograph x-ray section, there appears a 2nd model .44 that has the hammer. So, anybody know any other models it was used on? Very nice gun by the way.

Roger

 

[Swissman]

Memphis,

I don't know very much about the WWI guns and the variations. This little "thingys" in the hammer and trigger were new to me, but I have no possibility to comparing with other .455 HE's.

Thanks for your hint.

Swissman

 

[delta-419]

I attended a gunshow in Montgomery AL yesterday and saw a .455HE for sale with holster that had Canadan markings. It was very much in the same condition as your gun. Asking price was US $1000.00, what caught my attention was the .44Spl Triple Lock with the price tag of $500.00. I almost broke my arm reaching for my wallet only to find out that one of the young workers had put the pricetag of a .44HE 2nd model on the gun. That gun had been sold on Saturday. What luck. The triple lock was not for sale.

 

[MikeyL]

Swissman: Nice revolver! I have one similar that is just slightly newer, with the same markings. My Jinks letter notes that these pistols were made for both Canadian and British troops during WW I, and that the markings on yours were generally (I know, imprecise term) for Canadian use. The Brits almost always had additional marks, as they proofed the cylinders and stamped "Not English Made" on most of the British issued guns. Again, this is just "generally". I suspect the revolver got to Europe via a Canadian trooper who then traded it for a good Swiss watch (or maybe good Swiss chocolate!)

MikeyL

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