Remington Model 30 Express date of manufacture

[explorer13421]

I am trying to figure out when my grandfather's Remington Model 30 Express was manufactured, serial number 78XX. It has a Lyman receiver sight, horizontally grooved buttplate without the word "Remington." Cocks on raising the bolt. Any suggestion on where Remington serial numbers might be looked up?

 

[TIMETRIPPER]

Have you tried a Google search? The model 30 was an extension of the P14/1017 Enfield actions made by Remington during WWI. I have a sporterized Winchester model 1917 that is deadly accurate. It cocks on closing. There are aftermarket kits to convert to cock on open. In 1932 the Model 30 Express was converted to cock on opening so I would think that yours is an early 1930s gun. Hopefully someone else can elaborate.

John

 

[Alk8944]

Remington rifles have an alphabetic date code stamped on the left side of the barrel just in front of the receiver. Go to this site to find out how to read the codes: remington date codes - Google Search

 

[bigmoose]

As I recall there were 3 variations of the model 30S…
30SX. No receiver sight, just front and rear sight.
30SL. Fitted with Lyman receiver sight.
30SM. Fitted with Marbles receiver sight. Or maybe it was 30SR with a Redfield receiver sight, my memory is not what it used to be.

I had a 30SX that I eventually sold, as I couldn’t warm up to the two stage military type trigger.

They are very well built and good looking rifles, to be sure.

 

[LVSteve]

Have you tried a Google search? The model 30 was an extension of the P14/1017 Enfield actions made by Remington during WWI. I have a sporterized Winchester model 1917 that is deadly accurate. It cocks on closing. There are aftermarket kits to convert to cock on open. In 1932 the Model 30 Express was converted to cock on opening so I would think that yours is an early 1930s gun. Hopefully someone else can elaborate.

John

Every time I get my Winchester made P14 out of the safe, I curse the idiot that put a cock on opening kit on it. There are some things that should be left alone.

 

[DWalt]

As the Brits proved, nothing matches a bolt action rifle that cocks on closing for rapid fire. A well-trained soldier can nearly equal the aimed firing rate of a semiauto.

 

[dobk63]

Is the Receiver marked 30-S? Is the Butt plate crescent shaped or flat? Is there any provision for a barrel sight? What caliber is it?

 

[2152hq]

Just look up the Bbl Date Code as Alk8944 says.

My 30S Express has that Date Code on the right side of the bbl instead of the usual left side . Right along with the REP proof mark and inspectors marks.
Mine is 'WE' (Aug/1936). For some reason it is marked twice (?)
Second stamping is not a Repair Code date as there is no '3' with it.

I like this Remington Collectors Society website for the codes and dates.
Manufacture Dates – Remington Society of America

A couple of the others on the web have small errors in the Yr/ date codes.

Nice rifles, though heavy by todays 'sporter' standards. Most everything from that era likely is.
Makes for very comfortable shooting!



Added:
I 'Think" this is a page for the Model 30 from the Rem factory serial number record books.
It's not the full listing of course from the start of production around 1920 and forward. But it seems to indicate Month to Month ser# production.
Some Months are broken down into Weekly production.

The page begins in the first week of Jan/1927 ending (Starting?) with ser# 7719
The next entry is for Feb/1927. Ending (Starting?) Ser# 8025

So I would think your ser# would fall into that first entry somewhere.
Beginning of Jan to end of Feb/ 1927.

This is all an interpretation by me, so take that for what it's worth. I'm not the collector/researcher type.

These are Remington Factory seial # production book copies though and are in the hands of the Remington Collectors Society.

The Bbl Date Code stamped on the bbl is when the finished rifle/shotgun was sent thru the Range at the factory for Proofing and final inspection.
That Bbl Date Code can be different than the Ser# production record book. The ser# being rolled on and then recorded during the mfg process and usually done in the metal finishing & polishing 'room'.
Long before the finished product ever gets to the range especially if the bare unfinished parts are shelved for lack of demand, they could sit for some time.

 

[BB57]

Every time I get my Winchester made P14 out of the safe, I curse the idiot that put a cock on opening kit on it. There are some things that should be left alone.

The SMLE was arguably superior to the 98K and 1903A1 as the cock on closing feature minimized the effort needed to extract the fired cartridge case, and then took advantage of the momentum of the bolt and direction of travel when closing the bolt.

The end result was a much higher rate of fire than either the 98K or 1903. The added magazine capacity was just icing on the cake.

There was a reason the Brits kept that feature on the P13 intended to replace the SMLE and in turn on the alternate issue P14.

I get why Remington wanted pander to tradition, but the cock on closing design was a feature, not a bug.

 

[BB57]

As the Brits proved, nothing matches a bolt action rifle that cocks on closing for rapid fire. A well-trained soldier can nearly equal the aimed firing rate of a semiauto.

The “Mad Minute” required a soldier to start with 1 round in the chamber and 4 in the magazine and then score 15 hits on a 36” target at 300 yards in one minute. That was the minimum qualification score. The record was 36 hits in 1 minute. That’s an aimed round every 1.67 seconds.

Meanwhile in the US we grudgingly allowed an internal box magazine but insisted on a magazine cut off switch so that the 1903 could be employed as a single shot for all but dire emergency situations.

 

[30-30remchester]

I bought a 30 Express in caliber 30 Springfield 1906 when I was 14 years old. I took it with me when I ran away from home at 16 and ended up living a nomad existence in Alaska. Many a comforting night was spent with it loaded with 220 grain ammo sleeping beside my sleeping bag. Gave it a dear friend years later. Mine had cock on opening I believe Remington changed over to this feature soon after production started on this model. Don't just assume it is an aftermarket add on. Mine had the Lyman 48 receiver sight. I would like to find one of the first year's models with the smaller top mounted receiver sight. I have only seen one of those. What caliber is yours in?

 

[Gene L]

Nothing wrong with cock on closing. I remember when conversion kits were advertised in Shotgun News. My LE No. 4 (sporterized, unfortunately) cocks on closing and it is smooth and positive.

 

[2152hq]

My Remington 30S Express cocks on opening. It's factory made that way and is the same as the Mauser 98...in that it cocks on the opening bolt lift about 80% of the distance.
The rest is actually done on closing but you don't feel that as much so most consider the action as 100% cock on opening.

Some aftermarket trigger assemblies will place the trigger sear forward a small amt and the opening bolt handle motion will allow the bolt striker sear to drop behind the trigger sear for a true 100% cock on opening.


I've never noticed any appreciable difference betw 'on opening' vs on closing'. They all work just fine on a well made and set up rifle.
I own and have owned plenty of pre-98's, Model 98s , 03 sporters, Mannlichers and others.

I haven't found a need for trying the Mad Minute with my 1905 MkI* SMLE nor speed loading a Mannlicher Schoenauer. They take charger clips as well. The M/S cocks on opening.

It's all kind of a mute point IMO.
One of my projects coming up is a 1895 Chilean Mauser in 7x57. Absolutely pristine action and & orig 7x57 bbl cut to 24" w/ Williams ramp that was set into a Bishop Cal English pre-inlet stock at some point. A Lyman 66 rear sight added.
$225 as it set.
It'll make a beautiful trim sporter after I run it through a weight reduction plan.
I don't think the cock on closing feature will hinder the rifle one bit.

 

[Frank46]

I've shot so many of my mil surp rifles over the years that I prefer the cock on closing. I can stage the trigger and when conditions are right, take up the last remaing slack and the rifle fires. In facy I have a U.S. Model of 1917 rifle in 30-06 that someone 30 some odd years ago cut the barrel to 22" but never gone further in the sporter process. Few years back I sent it out to get it drilled and tapped for Weaver Grand slam bases,complete finishing off contouring the rear of the rear receiver ring, then bead blast all of the metal and blue. The blueing came out a dark almost black. Right now the barreled action is sitting in a chopped Enfield stock. Wouldn't have spent the money, but the bore was in such a nice shape with pristine lands and grooves. Frank

 

[explorer13421]

Many thanks to all who responded. Have had a lot of family stuff going on, second grandchild is overdue and I have been helping with the first.

My grandfather's rifle appears to have a date code "upside" down on the right side of barrel: DT, which would be Sep 1926. It also has a crescent shape buttplate.

Sep of 1926 is 4 years early for the change to cock on opening and the Lyman sight. Quite possible the barrel lingered on the shelf before being assembled with the newer cocking design and Lyman sight.

I am going to have the headspace checked, adjusted if needed, and then plan to shoot it. The bore looks quite good. The only change I would make is to put a slip on recoil pad as a metal buttplate and a post-surgery shoulder might not be a good match, plus the length of pull seems a little short for me.

Again, many thanks to all of you.

 

[2152hq]

The Remington 'Bbl Date Code' is considered the Mfg Date of the Firearm,,not that of the bbl itself.
It was applied to the finished firearm at the time it went through the Range for Proof firing, function test firing and targeting.

The REP proof mark and final inspection marks were applied at the same time.

The rifle may have been returned to the Remington Factory for Repair to upgrade to the cock on opening feature. The sight could also have been added.
Firearms normally returned for factory service repair will have an additional Repair Date Code on the bbl. Sometimes more than one if returned more than one time.

The Repair Date Code follows the same sequence as the Bbl Date Code with exception of the Repair Date Code having a '3' stamped along with it indicating 'Factory Service Repair'
There is often a geometric or other symbol following which is the individual Repair Inspectors mark at the time.

These Repair Code(s) are usually stamped on the same side as the Bbl Date Code and in front of it (towards the muzzle).
The '3' often looks like an '8' for some reason as the punch mark is very small.

Look on both sides of the bbl up close to the action.
Normally these codes are stamped on the left hand side. But they appear commonly on the RH side on the Model 30 for some reason,,yours included.

FWIW,,the 'Bbl Date/Yr' stamped on the bottom of Winchester bbl's is the actual Yr of Mfg of the bbl itself,,and not the gun it is attached to.

So on Winchester's, a bbl can have a bbl Date several yrs older than the gun's serial number indicates what the production yr of the gun itself is.
The bbl's were simply made, stamped and shelved in some instances and not used in assembly for some time there after.
Old(er) bbl on a newer gun.

Congrats on the new GrandChild.

 

[explorer13421]

Thank you.

No repair code info stamped on barrel. I took the barreled action out of the stack and carefully checked the barrel. No info on left side.

Assuming the cock on closing modification to cock on opening relates to the bolt, possible it would not be noted on the barrel?

The stock does have a cut-out or space on the barrel where a band might have gone. The barrel itself does not have a dovetail, screw hole or other place where a barrel mounted sight would be, at least as far as I can tell comparing to photos of Model 30 rifles on line with barrel mounted sights.

I live 41 highway miles from the former Remington factory in Ilion NY. If I had come into possession of the rifle a few years ago it would have been very interesting to visit the Remington museum there to see what they could tell me.

I think the rifle is usable, and do intend to shoot it. My plan is to take care of it and pass it along to someone in a later generation of my grandfather's descendants who shows an interest in firearms and family history. My grandfather, father and older brother all had the same first, middle and last names, differentiated by Sr., Jr. and III. Remington has a long history in Central NY. The M1917 and M30 have an interesting history, one that includes what in WWI might have been considered a military weapon of war morphing into a 1920s modern sporting rifle. Three generations of my family possessed and took good care of this rifle.