S&W cuts off California

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S&W announced today that they will no longer sell new semi-automatic center fire pistols in California due to the ridiculous AB1471 microstamping law. I'm glad I've got mine, and I hope you got yours, if you live in the formerly great state of California.
 
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Ruger has made announcement. Wonder what other brands will stop due to requirement. Well good luck with second amendment allowing use of common arms there. . .
 
This is EXACTLY what the anti gunners want. If they can't outlaw them outright they will back door ban them by imposing ridiculous requirements that have absolutely nothing to do with safety. One purpose only and that is to ban them by whatever means possible. I feel their pain as we here in MA have been dealing with this nonsense for some time.

The powers in MA imposed a slew of nonsense requirements about 10 years ago. If the maker doesn't comply they are banned. Many makers gladly said adios. No Glocks,Les Baers Kimbers.....on and on. The ultimate goal is achieved.

Every gun owner in the country must join the NRA.
 
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Spot on, couldn't agree more...NRA is our best line of defense against this kind of legislation and to preserve our 2A rights.

This is EXACTLY what the anti gunners want. If they can't outlaw them outright they will back door ban them by imposing ridiculous requirements that have absolutely nothing to do with safety. One purpose only and that is to ban them by whatever means possible. I feel their pain as we here in MA have been dealing with this nonsense for some time.

The powers in MA imposed a slew of nonsense requirements about 10 years ago. If the maker doesn't comply they are banned. Many makers gladly said adios. No Glocks,Les Baers Kimbers.....on and on. The ultimate goal is achieved.

Every gun owner in the country must join the NRA.
 
As long as the manufacturers hold the line and refuse to sell to the State, ie: law enforcement, this just might hurt. I think they should refuse to do business with them altogether to include selling spare parts for those guns they already have. Sort of a reverse boycott. This seems to have the feel of the anti gunners reaching the saturation point out there.
 
As long as the manufacturers hold the line and refuse to sell to the State, ie: law enforcement, this just might hurt. I think they should refuse to do business with them altogether to include selling spare parts for those guns they already have. Sort of a reverse boycott. This seems to have the feel of the anti gunners reaching the saturation point out there.

I seriously doubt anyone's going to cut off govt contracts. The decision to abandon CA probably has more to do with economics than principle . The law was passed in 2007, so they've had almost 7 years to object. The fact that mfrs waited till now says they were probably waiting till the last minute to see if the technology would be feasible by the time the law was implemented. Otherwise, why did NSSF and SAAMI wait until this week to file suit? Besides all that, LE is exempt from the rule.

I'm still glad to see manufacturers of any product abandon the nanny state. I always wonder how much extra I'm paying for something when I see that stupid "Complies with CA blah, blah, blah" label.
 
Sad but Law Enforcement and other agencies are exempt for the Handgun roster and micro stamping.

I doubt that SW will halt sales to LE, aside from money, there are legal contracts they have with agencies i am sure. I suspect Barrett was quite small compared to SW.

That being said.. it would be nice!
 
As long as the manufacturers hold the line and refuse to sell to the State, ie: law enforcement, this just might hurt. I think they should refuse to do business with them altogether to include selling spare parts for those guns they already have. Sort of a reverse boycott. This seems to have the feel of the anti gunners reaching the saturation point out there.

Might work except law enforcement is outside the DOJ list and AR restrictions.
 
S&W did not cut off California, California cut off S&W - which is exactly what they wanted - reduce sales of handguns in California - except to LEO. Anti-gunners win.
 
S&W did not cut off California, California cut off S&W - which is exactly what they wanted - reduce sales of handguns in California - except to LEO. Anti-gunners win.
Agreed - better wording for a title.

I'd be more curious to know if ANY mfg is going to implement the microstamping to meet this requirement. If none do then Ca will have to decide what is most important - guns in the hands of criminals only or guns for others (LE and citizens) too.
 
I could care less is California LE is exempt from the Microstamping requirement.

I hope every manufacturer cuts off all Government Agencies in California.

The unreasonable requirements need to stop. The Approved List is another sore point. Only in the Land Ran by Fruits and Nuts.

Bob
 
You know, I was thinking--I think the only thing that can save CA from total destruction--is a massive and sudden influx of a million or so-Southerners moving into the State. Then when elections come up--they have the power to change things for the better. After they normalize the situation there, leave the State and move into another ruined State. :-)) Yeah, I know--wishful thinking.
 
There is nuance here the OP did not address.

S&W did not cut off California. They continue to make fine handguns, and of course make occasional midstream production changes. Additionally, this microstamping stuff only applies to revolvers.

Calif. DOJ regards these midstream production changes [outside of sights and grips] - however trivial - as being a new gun model, which in turn requires new rounds of testing, fees, etc - and, for pistols - microstamping.
Even a change in location of parts manufacture - even if parts are of identical material & dimensions - is regarded as triggering of "new part" and thus triggers, in turn "new gun" - requiring re-Rostering.

S&W simply can't 'freeze' its production in old history. Tooling and material improvements and simple changes of machinery happen all the time in today's manufacturing environment - and today's "continuous improvement" mantra, the hallmark of most manufacturing operations worldwide - is precisely _stopped_ by CA DOJ.

While this offensive newer tack by DOJ also applies to revolvers, at least revolvers can be retested/reRostered in California without microstamping, a technology only the CA DOJ says exists reliably and yet which real-world manufaucturers can't implement (regardless of cost).

S&W has, luckily, gotten all streamed-in production changes to the M&P Shield guns and got them - along with the Sigma-derived SDVE 9/40 guns - Rostered before microstamping regulatory requirement was recently triggered. These guns _WILL_ be sold for the foreseeable future in California and re-Rostered. Revolvers that are Rostered (or re-Rostered or newly Rostered) will continue to be sold in California, and since microstamping is not required on revolvers, things are less severe in that field.

[Ruger's situation is similar but they may not have any designs that have been frozen without production changes, and thus all their autoloaders may disappear due to new microstamping requirement. Their DA revolver situation will likely track S&W's revolver status in CA - and their single-action Blackhawk/Vaquero line is exempt from Rostering in CA.]

I will note The Calguns Foundation is litigating (in a joint effort with SAF) the complete Roster regime in Federal court (major constitutional failboat). Alan Gura, of Heller and McDonald fame, is lead counsel.

Anyway, to review, details matter... S&W and Ruger are not 'pulling out' - they tried to do biz and tightened regulatory enforcement strictures do not allow them to participate nearly as fully in the CA market. For S&W, some autoloader product (Shield/SDVE) will continue to be present, and revolvers will continue to be sold and developed for CA.


Bill Wiese
The Calguns Foundation
 
There is nuance here the OP did not address.

S&W did not cut off California. They continue to make fine handguns, and of course make occasional midstream production changes. Additionally, this microstamping stuff only applies to revolvers.

Calif. DOJ regards these midstream production changes [outside of sights and grips] - however trivial - as being a new gun model, which in turn requires new rounds of testing, fees, etc - and, for pistols - microstamping.
Even a change in location of parts manufacture - even if parts are of identical material & dimensions - is regarded as triggering of "new part" and thus triggers, in turn "new gun" - requiring re-Rostering.

S&W simply can't 'freeze' its production in old history. Tooling and material improvements and simple changes of machinery happen all the time in today's manufacturing environment - and today's "continuous improvement" mantra, the hallmark of most manufacturing operations worldwide - is precisely _stopped_ by CA DOJ.

While this offensive newer tack by DOJ also applies to revolvers, at least revolvers can be retested/reRostered in California without microstamping, a technology only the CA DOJ says exists reliably and yet which real-world manufaucturers can't implement (regardless of cost).

S&W has, luckily, gotten all streamed-in production changes to the M&P Shield guns and got them - along with the Sigma-derived SDVE 9/40 guns - Rostered before microstamping regulatory requirement was recently triggered. These guns _WILL_ be sold for the foreseeable future in California and re-Rostered. Revolvers that are Rostered (or re-Rostered or newly Rostered) will continue to be sold in California, and since microstamping is not required on revolvers, things are less severe in that field.

[Ruger's situation is similar but they may not have any designs that have been frozen without production changes, and thus all their autoloaders may disappear due to new microstamping requirement. Their DA revolver situation will likely track S&W's revolver status in CA - and their single-action Blackhawk/Vaquero line is exempt from Rostering in CA.]

I will note The Calguns Foundation is litigating (in a joint effort with SAF) the complete Roster regime in Federal court (major constitutional failboat). Alan Gura, of Heller and McDonald fame, is lead counsel.

Anyway, to review, details matter... S&W and Ruger are not 'pulling out' - they tried to do biz and tightened regulatory enforcement strictures do not allow them to participate nearly as fully in the CA market. For S&W, some autoloader product (Shield/SDVE) will continue to be present, and revolvers will continue to be sold and developed for CA.


Bill Wiese
The Calguns Foundation

The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.
 

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