Scathing report on today's gun show in Louisville

rburg

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OK, you're not going to get it. Today's show was surprising in how good it was, how many people attended, the great guns I managed to see, and the money that seemed to be flowing even if we do have a recession. Generally worth the drive, the $8 parking fee my son paid, and the long walk inside.

So the worst part was already covered, except for the Christmas flea market next door. The one that used the hall we're normally in for the larger shows. The last couple of years were terrible and one even had the promoter apologize for how few customers attended. Today was different. He didn't manage to draw as many vendors as we'd have liked, but it just means he made the aisles wide enough. Or he thought he did. Even the wide aisles were packed people. We had a lot of folks who have never been out to the big city (as if Louisville qualifies) and don't have a clue how to walk in a crowd. I even had some nasty thoughts about the bulk of weight many were packing in their lower regions (see, I can say that nicely).

We have a thread running about guns on our wish list. My list is now about zero. I took a bunch of money out of my retirement, converted it to cash, and went to the show. I already knew of a seller with a really nice Winchester M21 who had priced it very attractively. When he saw me this morning, he instantly reduced it by another $300, putting it nearly as cheap as I've ever seen one seriously for sale. It was priced to sell, not just for show. Too much for me to take, so I just went over and started counting out $100 bills. He was happy, I was happy, and we parted ways.

It seems there are different classes of sellers. I couldn't believe the prices some folks are asking for things like gun cases. Even beat up old ones the guys seem to want $500 to $1000 for. The seller of the gun, out of the kindness of his heart...loaned me a case to take the gun home in. I did make a good effort to find something that pleased me, but ended up empty handed. I'll find one or at least I'll be looking. This is gun show time of year with one at the end of the month and more in early January.

The M21 is just a standard grade gun, nice wood, beavertail fore end. 26" skeet barrels. Exactly what I've been seeking for about a decade now.

My son found a nice Lyman 4 cavity 358 semi wadcutter mold for $25 and an RCBS luber sizer for $75. He seems to want both, so I think I bought them and he has an early Christmas present. He found me a Colorado Saddlery holster. The seller had a tag on it saying 5 1/2" Colt. Flip it over and you can see plain as day the 38-44 6 1/2" ball point pen indentation. Even if a Colt fits it, I have an idea that a S&W will fit it better. Anyone here a holster expert? It doesn't have the leather block sewn in for an adjustable rear sight to rest on. That might mean its for a 6 1/2" HD. Well, except that my impression is the folks from H H Heiser moved over and formed Colorado Saddlery in the very late 1950s to 1960 time frame. I wonder if they just dropped the nicety of that leather chunk and its really for an Outdoorsman. Doesn't really matter all that much, the quality seems to be sewn in.

Didn't buy much else. I did pick up 2 entree's from MREs. No not the inedible main course, but the Cherry Blueberry desert. I'm old and eat what I want. I don't have to choke down something else before desert. If I'm hungry, I'll eat two deserts!

David Carroll made a short appearance with his grand son. Hunter is getting to be a big boy now.

Maybe the best gun of the show award goes to Blake. He's worried that I'll identify it here and everyone will know what he's got. So I won't. But if you see him, ask him what he had that seemed to impress me (and David) so much.

I guess we didn't buy anything else, but a lot was tempting. The survival food tables were doing a big business. Our tables weren't anywhere in line with the doors from those tables, yet a bunch of folks were carting out the large square tubs of food. The reloading tables were stacked 3 deep out and blocking the aisles. Those boys were selling stuff.

The in show food was awful as expected. But the Christmas show next door had a food court that wasn't stacked too full of waiting people and the prices seemed reasonable. The only disappointing part was the cheeseburger combo wasn't being sold because they were out of cardboard fries. I took my revenge by loading up on dill pickles. Back in the gunshow my grand daughter ate them all. There are just things grandma's don't teach young girls. She had a cheeseburger earlier, but only put 2 pickles on it. That's just foolishness, so she got to munch about a half cup I brought her back. Better than salty old fries.

All considered, it was a really good show. Anytime you get one of your holy grail guns, and at a discount, is a good show. Now I've got to start thinking what I need next, if anything. Maybe its time for another purge of stuff I don't need. Right now I've got to go read the book on M21s. Anybody know when they were making guns in the 12,500 serial number range? The books all say that prior to WWII they stopped at 11,300 or so. I don't think they were making many during WWII, so I'm guessing very early postwar.
 
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Congratulations on acquiring your grail gun. The older I get the harder that is to do.
Here is part of a commentary I posted on Colorado Saddlery.
"CS was started in 1945 by 4 former Heiser employees;their primary business was making saddles & other horse equipment but they also made custom holsters that were very similar to Heiser holsters.CS was one of three makers that made holsters with the Abercrombie & Fitch stamp,the other 2 being Heiser & George Lawrence."
I checked a number of Heiser & Colorado Saddlery catalogs & neither maker spelled out sewn in sight projectors in the extra charges. We both know Heiser provided them when specified; I looked at all of my Colorado Saddlery holsters & none of them had one. The CS holsters made for target sighted revolvers were all made to accommodate the rear sight-the sight would ride outside the top of the holster. You have brought up an interesting point about one of the better old makers & I'll sure be looking for a sewn in sight block on a Colorado Saddlery holster from now on. So far I'm thinking they may not have offered them at all.
Let me know if your new holster accommodates the rear sight on an Outdoorsman when you have a chance to check it. I'll start looking hard at CS holsters I run into.
Regards,
Turnerriver
 
Must be something in the air...... I just got back from our monthly Washington Arms Collector show in Puyallup and the place was packed. Biggest crowd I've seen in years. What's amazing about it is that a few months ago the State decided the show was getting too big so they instituted (or began enforcing) a rule that if you took a table for more than two shows a year, you were considered a "vendor"(even if you weren't a FFL) and would require a State business license ($20.00) and are required to collect and submit sales tax on all sales. The first few months after this started it looked like the show might just dry up and blow away. Seems that isn't going to happen. There do seem to be more "non-gun" tables then there used to be, so we have lost some of the non-FFL "dealers".
Might have something to do with applying for a State business license without benefit of a Federal license....... Also, due to the rules of the club, you can't buy or sell a gun unless you are a member. ($35.00 per year and a NICS check.) Ammo and accessories are OK.
 
Here in Kentucky the sales tax people are a plague on gun owners. The way everyone solves it is they have partners on the table and only one registers. Then its the next guy and so on. We double up on the tables so no one looks like they've had more than maybe one table per year.
 
Dick your M21 could easily be a pre-war. No way to tell without Cody letter. They were like some S&W's with no particular order on SN's. As an example, 16,561 letters final inspection in Aug. 1943 and 6,515 letters in Oct. 1948. I remember seeing a 3 digit that shipped in the late 40's. Congratulations, you will enjoy that one!
 
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Dick-
Was this just a semi-rant about the show or a Gail Find? Anyway, I've known you for years so I always read your gun show reports.

M21 11,8XX was 1936-37 so yours is getting close. Take care, pard....dan
 
According to my book on the 21, frame numbers 12105 through 13121 were produced in 1937. When the frames were actually completed and assembled is not in the book. I have had this book for about five years, and just opened it for the first time.
 
i was at the show for awhile today. got there around 8:30 and left around noon. Pretty good turn out for it being early. Picked up a few reloading supplies, the book "No Easy Day" and decided to add to the gun collection....I wasnt looking for anything fancy, just something. Ran across a SKS with a price tag of 225 and picked it up for 200. Found a m1 garand in ok condition for 800 and picked that up as well. All in all I had a great time.
 
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I saw some decent deals but have yet to spend a buck. The old stuff wasn't moving nearly as brisk as new guns, Sherwoods 16 table section was 2 and 3 deep all day and my table neighbor said all the people toting cases of ammo on their shoulders looked like squirrels salting away nuts for winter. Bud's Guns had an ammo subsidiary business display that was more elaborate than any I've seen. The display was the typical pallets but then there was a framework of shelving for by the box sales. Those guys from Bud's sure seem to know what they are doing and they were selling the ammo like it was going out of style!

People watching was great and the vendor table count was down so the center area in each block of 16 tables is a full 8 ft instead of the usual 6 ft. I like the elbow room. I don't have anything cooking today except for one beback on an old Lafever 20ga SxS that I hope he still thinks he needs. Sunday it pays to be early to get an easy getaway spot so I'll head out in about an hour.
 
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sales tax, admission fees and a general lack of descent items at descent prices has kept me away from most gun shows.

jerky, indian work working art, grandpa's attick stuff, cheap switch blades, war paraphernalia, and retail prices......

God bless gunbroker.
 
Admission fees, parking and a general lack of descent items at descent prices has kept me away from most gun shows.

Glad to hear you had a good show. Sounds like the show has been listening to comments about making isles wider or Fire Marshall made them.

I am sitting here trying to decide if I want make the drive or not, I am looking for a Super Blackhawk in .44

Dave
 
Our show has wider aisles because they are not selling enough tables to crowd more in. (Kind of like small stuff the comes in big boxes so you think you are getting more for your money.)
But I will admit it's nice to have more room to move around in.
 
Well, rburg and deadin at least had decent shows to go to. I went to the show in Hilliard, Ohio satruday and could have saved the money. Stopped at the gunshop in Hilliard after I left and they probably had a better selection of guns and accessories than I saw at the show.

I can agree about the greed of state tax depts too. Ohio has also decided that anyone getting a table at a show, fair, etc needs to have a vendors license and collect sales tax for them. They claim that if you're selling "tangible personal property" you're a business! I wonder how that conflicts with ATF rules for "being in the business of gun sales"? I suspect that might be contributing to the shrinking gun shows around here (and maybe the increase in people walking the aisles selling, some of whom, I know, used to get tables).
 
Mr. Burg, I always read your posts. A man who can make cardboard fries and pickles interesting is a man who should be encouraged.

Having said that, I would also enjoy a picture of that Model 21...

Congrats on the find. A 21 is about the stoutest SxS ever made and an absolute classic. Twelve gauge I assume?
 
Gotta' love the gun shows. I took the weekend off. Didn't feel like driving to Tucson after the big three day show in Phoenix last weekend. Did manage to pick up three five screw N frames at the Phoenix show.
 
the last two gun shows i went to were in batesville? Va. and got a good deal from a deal called dark sun, descent show.

went to another in Montgomery Al. and it plain sucked. im sure there was at least one gun for sale at a deal price but i couldnt find it.
 
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