Shipping C&Rs

Grayfox

Grayfox

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Ok, I know that for us lowly citizens that if you ship a gun its supposed to go UPS or FedEx Overnight.
BUT, if you have a C&R License AND the gun you're shipping is C&R AND its going to a FFL or C&R holder, can you ship it priority mail?

I'm thinking seriously about thinning the herd a bit and most of them will be C&Rs. The high cost of shipping is what's holding me back. I'm looking for cheaper options here.
 
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if you have a C&R License AND the gun you're shipping is C&R AND its going to a FFL or C&R holder, can you ship it priority mail?
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Long guns Yes, handguns No. Only FFL01's and their ilk (02's etc.) can use the USPS for handguns
 
That's what I was afraid of, but thought I'd ask just to be sure.
Yes, they are all handguns and mostly S&Ws that I was gonna list here. But its hard to just break even on them, much less show a profit, when the shipping can easily run $50 or more per gun.
Maybe I can work something out with a local dealer. If not, I guess they'll just sit in the safe.
 
Grayfox said:
That's what I was afraid of, but thought I'd ask just to be sure.
Yes, they are all handguns and mostly S&Ws that I was gonna list here. But its hard to just break even on them, much less show a profit, when the shipping can easily run $50 or more per gun.
Maybe I can work something out with a local dealer. If not, I guess they'll just sit in the safe.
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The guns I end up shipping myself,I just add $50 to,and make that clear in my ad.
 
H Richard said:
That is the one thing that needs to be corrected. FFL's can ship handguns by USPS, but 03 FFL's (C&R) can't. Can any one tell me the logic behind that?
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It boils down to just one word... "dealer".

432.23 Manufacturers, Dealers, and Importers

Handguns may also be mailed between licensed manufacturers of firearms, licensed dealers of firearms, and licensed importers of firearms in customary trade shipments, or for repairing or replacing parts.

A C&R FFL does not convey any authority to be "engaged in the business", which is the key phrase the BATF uses to define a dealer.

BATF C&R FAQ's

I have a 03 FFL too, and it's frustrating... if only the Postal Service would change the language to say "licensed dealers and collectors", but then, being in California it would not buy me a hill of beans either if changed. Only FFL dealers here can receive handguns... period.
 
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The Guy at Our Post Office told Me to make the Hand Gun inoperable and I could send it using My C+R License. All I had to do was sign a Form stating that it could not be made to fire in it's present condition so He was satisfied when I removed the Slide from the Frame as He said it met the conditions for sending it and He shipped it.
 
e3mrk said:
The Guy at Our Post Office told Me to make the Hand Gun inoperable and I could send it using My C+R License. All I had to do was sign a Form stating that it could not be made to fire in it's present condition so He was satisfied when I removed the Slide from the Frame as He said it met the conditions for sending it and He shipped it.
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I wouldn't take that advice. The frame is still a firearm.
 
I have seen that said before about sending a hand gun that is not in working order. One or two places that does work mentions this, I think Magnaport was one of them. I can't find anything to support this and I think it may be something that was allowed long ago.
 
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Grayfox said:
I'm thinking seriously about thinning the herd a bit and most of them will be C&Rs. The high cost of shipping is what's holding me back. I'm looking for cheaper options here.
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There are numbers of FFL dealers who will ship handguns via USPS for a nominal fee. You can find lists of them on the Gunbroker and Shotgun News websites.

You should expect to pay $15 to $20 each, plus the actual shipping cost.
 
This question comes up from time to time and responses seem to
reflect opinions rather than hard truths. A few basic facts as I know
them and I'm sure that opinions will vary. A C&R license is an FFL.
There are dealers on the auction sites with thousands of feedbacks
who primarily ship handguns by priority mail, including C&R eligible
guns to C&R holders with no extra charges. I have bought numerous
C&R handguns from these sites and every single one has come
directly to me. I have sold a few C&R handguns by auction and all
have been shipped in flat rate priority boxes to 01 or 03 FFL holders
by me with a copy of my C&R included. Whenever I ship any package
by priority mail I have been asked if there were any liquids or
hazardous materials inside only. Never once have I been asked what
was inside. I think much confusion comes from the common practice
of using the word "dealer" when refering to any FFL holder by those
who are not highly familiar with the various licenses and the firearms
scenario in general.
 
deadin said:
I have a FFL03 and have been through this question many times. A FFL03 may not send or receive a C&R qualified handgun via the US Postal Service.
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You have to supply facts here and not a random link since I can not find your reference to not being able to receive a gun from an FFL in the USPS. I do beliieve that a FFL03 can receive a C&R handgun from an FFL directly in the mail. Some of the largest Auction Houses in the business have directly sent me C&R qualified firearms through the USPS, as well as FFL dealers on GB and other online auction sites. I need to see that statement that says i can not receive C&R guns via the USPS.

Here is what I read on the USPS site:

431.5 Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL)

Federal Firearms licenses are issued by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (ATF), U.S. Department of the Treasury, under the Gun Control Act of 1968, and are defined as follows:

a.Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL) manufacturer, dealer, or importer of firearms means a manufacturer, dealer, or importer duly licensed by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (ATF) under Chapter 44, Title 18, United States Code (U.S.C.).

b.Curio and relic collector means an individual licensed by ATF to transfer or receive only those firearms defined as curios or relics by ATF under Title 27, Code of Federal Regulations (CFR), section 478.11.
 
alwslate said:
. . . I have sold a few C&R handguns by auction and all have been shipped in flat rate priority boxes to 01 or 03 FFL holders by me with a copy of my C&R included. Whenever I ship any package by priority mail I have been asked if there were any liquids or
hazardous materials inside only. Never once have I been asked what.
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I do believe, however, that a FFL03 can NOT legally send a C&R handgun via the USPS. Here are a couple of excepts from the USPS:

432.21 Authorized Persons

Subject to 432.22, handguns may be mailed by a licensed manufacturer of firearms, a licensed dealer of firearms, a licensed importer of firearms, or an authorized agent of the federal government or the government of a state, territory, or district, only when addressed to a person in one of the following categories for use in the person’s official duties, and upon filing the required affidavit or certificate:

432.23 Manufacturers, Dealers, and Importers

Handguns may also be mailed between licensed manufacturers of firearms, licensed dealers of firearms, and licensed importers of firearms in customary trade shipments, or for repairing or replacing parts.

432.24 Certificate of Manufacturers, Dealers, and Importers

A federal firearms licensee manufacturer, dealer, or importer need not file the affidavit under 432.22, but must file with the Postmaster a statement on PS Form 1508, Statement by Shipper of Firearms, signed by the mailer that he or she is a licensed manufacturer, dealer, or importer of firearms. The mailer must also state that the parcels containing handguns, or parts and components of handguns under 432.2d, are being mailed in customary trade shipments or contain such articles for repairing or replacing parts, and that to the best of their knowledge the addressees are licensed manufacturers, dealers, or importers of firearms. Registered Mail service is recommended.

Postmasters may forward an unsatisfactory mailer statement to the PCSC for a ruling.
 
You have to supply facts here and not a random link since I can not find your reference to not being able to receive a gun from an FFL in the USPS.
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Gary,
It seems that you just quoted back the same references I posted. While it nowhere specifically states that a FFL03 can't receive a handgun in the mail, 1508 states that any mailing of handguns need to go from dealer to dealer.
The dealer should never have mailed it to a non dealer in the first place. Participating in the commission of a crime (the receiving of an illegally mailed handgun) is abetting and could make you culpable to charges.

Just because someone gets away with it doesn't make it right.
 
My local FFL shop charges me a few bucks to document each transfer, which is perfectly OK with me. Business is business. Then the parcel goes out via USPS Priority Mail, usually costing about $12.00.

Much less expensive than FedEx or UPS next day air delivery.
 
I have solved this problem with the USPS and their strict interpretation of the rules.

Their rules say you must be a "dealer".

So what I do when I have a C&R gun to ship or receive, I call a bunch of my buddies over to my house and we play poker. Since it's my house and my game, I am the "dealer" for all hands.

As long as the gun ships or arrives while I am the "dealer" I feel that I am covered. ;)
 
when the shipping can easily run $50 or more per gun.
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I wish it was only $50.00, or so. The last handgun I shipped FedEx was $197.00.
You are correct, with shipping costs it's almost impossible to sell a firearm at a fair price, for both the seller and buyer unless it's FTF.
 
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