Originally posted by S/W - Lifer:
"I do not trust any expanding handgun bullet to actually expand on a human target."
Many shooters don't. They didn't used to expand reliably until you got into magnum loadings from 6 inch barrels, and then only sometimes. We used to figure that 1,000 fps was the bare minimum to see expansion of handgun bullets in people.
I don't believe that anymore.
In December, 2001, I was involved in a shooting with a couple of bank robbers leaving the branch with a teller for a hostage. I fired four rounds of Federal's 230 grain .45 ACP-Plus-P "Tactical Bonded" loading (their catalog number LE45TI) from a Colt Commander with a 4-1/4 inch barrel.
Two rounds penetrated fully, one a front-to-back torso shot that hit no bones, the other a shot very high in one thigh that missed the femoral artery. I spotted both those bullets laying on the ground before they hauled me away. I also got to examine them closely in person later. They could have come from an ammo maker's magazine advertisement, classically mushroomed to well over .75", and held onto pretty well all of their original weight.
A third shot hit the side of a skull, just above and behind the ear, caused a depressed skull fracture and then DEFLECTED (!!!!!) down into his shoulder, where it penetrated several inches and was removed by a trauma surgeon. The hollowpoint's opening was stuffed with several layers of clothing material. The bullet expanded just like the other two above.
Shot number four angled down through the torso, from under the arm, through a lung, and ended up down in the fellow's lower abdomen. It is still there. The X-rays make it appear that it expanded fully, as well. It travelled about 18-22 inches after entering the skin.
Those bullets expanded and performed very well, from a cartridge that isn't considered to be a high-pressure/high velocity round, fired from a shorter-than-standard length barrel.
My department issues the bonded Federal in 9mm, .40 S&W and .45 ACP. We used to issue it in 10mm Auto before discontinuing the carry of guns so chambered.
I worked my department's robbery-homicide unit from 1998-2003. We are my state's oldest and largest law enforcement agency, although only medium-sized by "big city" standards. I was the unit's "gun guy" and got to weigh and measure a lot of bullets during that time. I then supervised our crime lab for a few years and got to weigh, measure and photograph a lot of other bullets.
The Federals we issue seem to work well, performing as designed. One officer-involved shooting involved two deputies putting four 9mm and three 10mm rounds into a large, cocaine- and alcohol-fueled fellow with a couple of large knives. All were recovered either from the deceased or the wall behind him. All expanded classically and retained about all of their original weight. All were torso shots; about half, I recall, exitted. The 9mm was, I believe, the 129 grainer Plus-P while the 10 was the 180 grain "FBI Lite" load.
Handgun bullet expansion is generally a good thing, as most FMJ loadings from .38 Spl. on up will usually exit the torso. Some expansion limits this but doesn't eliminate it. It also punches a bigger hole and, because it makes the frontal area of the bullet larger, more likely to rupture a major aorta or sumsuch vital part, leading to more rapid ceasation of hostilities.
Hangun bullet development has come a very long ways in the past 25 years. It is more effective. But, keep in mind, compared to most rifles and shotguns, handguns are still pretty weak sisters when it comes to stopping the action.
I would also like to extend a friendly invitation to any of our forums members, who plan on being gunshot or otherwise seriously injuured traumatically any time soon, to plase come to any part of the unincorporated Salt Lake (UT) County or any of the fine cities we contract with, to be shot. The emergency medical services provided by the former Salt Lake County Fire Department (now named the Unified Fire Authority) is superb. Our highly trained, state-of-the-art paramedics and firemen will do the utmost possible to keep the blood inside and you breathing, convey you to one of several fine state-of-the-art trauma centers in a timely fashion, to give you the greatest possible odds of surviving.
The shooting of mine related above occurred on about 9:00 a.m. of a Friday morning, about 150 yards from a fire stationed manned by these great folks. Both of the shootees survived their wounds (!!!!), albeit at taxpayer expense, due to the efforts of both the fire folks and the hospital surgical staffs.
We in the unit, having witnessed the medical care provided by other, lessor fire departments in the valley, then made a pact that, if any of us were shot or otherwise damaged in another, non U.F.A.-grid municipality, that our buddies would throw us in a car and transport us to an area U.F.A. serves, and call them from there!
