Source for 250gr Keith .44s ?

[Mr.Gato]

The title says it all, I am looking for a source for 250gr Keith .44s.

Suggestions appreciated.

Thanks

 

[AR_Black]

ACME 44 CAL 240 Grain SWC COATED

I've reloaded a test batch for 44 Magnum and 44 Special using these coated bullets with Unique.... a low dose of Unique for mild plinking/pleasure loads. I've only shot about 50 rounds so far, very comfortable and good accuracy. I do plan to chronograph several variations, hopefully this month.

ACME 44 CAL 240 Grain SWC COATED

ACME 44 BULLETS

However, I'm not exactly sure if these are a true copy of the Keith profile. Perhaps others can comment?

 

[rockquarry]

I've reloaded a test batch for 44 Magnum and 44 Special using these coated bullets with Unique.... a low dose of Unique for mild plinking/pleasure loads. I've only shot about 50 rounds so far, very comfortable and good accuracy. I do plan to chronograph several variations, hopefully this month.

ACME 44 CAL 240 Grain SWC COATED

ACME 44 BULLETS

However, I'm not exactly sure if these are a true copy of the Keith profile. Perhaps others can comment?

If I didn't cast my own, I'd order samples of at least three or four, maybe a hundred bullets of each (if that's possible) from different sources. Even though they will be similar in design, one will likely outshoot the others. I would get a diameter of .431" or even .432" unless you know for sure your gun needs a different diameter.

Don't worry if the best bullet is "Keith" or not; accuracy and freedom from leading are of much greater importance.

 

[HeavyLoad]

When I buy cast bullets I get them from here. Quality bullets.
GT Bullets!, Fine Hand Cast Lead Bullets
No bevels bases here, square all the way around.
44 Caliber : GT Bullets!, Fine Hand Cast Lead Bullets

 

[smithra_66]

The best source is dropping out of your own molds. Outside of that, you're at the mercy of the commercial guys which is a **** shoot. They are in and out of stock all the time.

I've had luck with Montana Bullets, but they are expensive. Also note that most of the commercial guys today don't cast true Keith bullets. The design has been watered down over the years. You can order a mold from Accurate Molds which is the true Keith design and then crank them out in whatever quantity you want, at whatever size you want, whatever hardness you want, using whatever lube you want, if you cast your own.

 

[AR_Black]

Missouri Bullet Company also has some, not the true 429421 (sorry Keith Purists)

"Keith Style with Bevel Base"

Missouri Bullet Company

and

Missouri Bullet Company

-------------

Thread on these bullets here:

Missouri .44 Elmer K(430240EK) loads

 

[STORMINORMAN]

"Real" bullets (or, Unreal?): I would opine that your average target, and any two- or four-legged predators would be able to tell the difference...?

Cheers!

 

[GBertolet]

The original Keith 250 gr bullet had a square grease groove. Lyman altered (rounded) the grease groove, to make the bullets drop easier from the mold, as the square groove bullets, tended to stick a little more. I imagine the other manufactures followed suit for that reason. This doesn't mean the rounded grease groove bullets don't shoot fine.

 

[smithra_66]

The original Keith 250 gr bullet had a square grease groove. Lyman altered (rounded) the grease groove, to make the bullets drop easier from the mold, as the square groove bullets, tended to stick a little more. I imagine the other manufactures followed suit for that reason. This doesn't mean the rounded grease groove bullets don't shoot fine.

That's the most minor change. The bigger change is that the nose of the bullet was shortened and the first driving band is smaller than the bottom two. This was so they would fit into all cylinders.

This was an even bigger problem in the 38/357 guns with that bullet.

The shorter nose bullet doesn't perform as well at longer range and the smaller front driving band doesn't have the same wiping effect as his original with equal sized bands. (all according to Elmer Keith, of course).

He was always perturbed when he came across a mold without the pure design of his originals.

 

[daverich4]

Brian Pierce recommends these as being close to the original Keith bullet.

255 Grain Semi-Wadcutter Keith (.430)-430-255-SWC

 

[dwh]

Rim rock make a good Keith bullet. I believe they have them in 2 different hardnesses.

 

[IAM Rand]

I make my own Keith 44s so I got nothing. I have used Missouri before for 38/357.

 

[Nick B]

Go with GT or Matt's Bullets . Good soft lube , not that junk Magma crayon wax . Also their lead isn't that overly hard stuff that most of the commercial casters use .

 

[smithra_66]

For reference, here's the "closest" thing I've found to the true Keith design. You can compare this to the other bullets of similar type. The diagram has the nose lengths and the front driving band lengths which can be compared to the other bullets of similar weight in this catalog:

Bullet Design Details | Accurate Molds

 

[alwslate]

If you must have the "Keith" SWC they can be had but are a bit more expensive than the more common Magma SWCs.

 

[murf205]

Matt's bullets 255 looks very close to the Elmer Keith bullet. He didn't like beveled base bullets and I never had any luck with them either. The drop from a mold easily due to the radius on the base and that's why Magnus mold machines use them--production. They do start into the cases easier but that is of little consequence when you are cleaning the leading out of a barrel or they don't shoot as accurately as you would would like. I know...there are some who have had great luck with them and I applaud your efforts but IMHO, the Lyman 429421 is a better design. I've darned near gone broke trying to prove it inferior but it just accurate. If...you decide to start casting your own, it will be well worth your time and effort to use the Accurate Molds clone. You didn't say what gun you were shooting these in but I suggest that you slug the cylinder throats or at least try to push a bullet of known diameter through them with finger pressure or using a pencil. A lot of commercial casters offer sizing to fit your particular application and I strongly suggest you take advantage of this no cost option. Some also offer powder coat bullets as well and while they wont let you get by with poor fit, they are a great leading deterrent. Good luck

 

[dogdoc]

Lyman 429421 and clones have always grouped better for me than the commercial cast magma bullets that people call Keith bullets. Those common commercial bevel based cast bullets are not even close to the Lyman or rcbs keith bullets. Even the rim rock bullet is not a Keith as it is significantly different. I have shot many 25 yard groups with that rim rock bullet, and while it is ok, the Lyman or rcbs constantly groups better.

 

[Nick B]

The Lyman 429421 and the RCBS 250K are as far as I know an exact copy of the original Keith design .

 

[elpac3]

Check Western Bullets as well as Matt's Bullets. I have the Westerns and they shoot fine.

I have also shot the Rim Rock 265 grain Keith style, although not a true Keith bullet they always performed very well

 

[murf205]

A lot of people will tell you that the original Keith had a square grease groove and it is a must if you want an original. In my experience (and I started casting with this cal/bullet) in 1974, it does NOT have to have a square grease groove but it needs the sharp base-not beveled.
Mr Gato, I don't know your situation but if I needed what you are looking for, I would buy a Lee casting pot and a mold and never be at the mercy of anybody for my 44 bullets again. Help is here if you need it.