Speed of cast tumble lube?

[gehlsurf]

Hey guys,

Picked up a Ruger 77/357 and started reloading for it, heavy subs (have a form 1 suppressor waiting on ATF). Some good results, some..... well bad, lol.

Point is, I found a heavy sub I like, now its onto full speed, so what the fastest I could get out of a cast tumblelube bullet?

Thanks for any help!! If you have some pet loads for rifles, please let me know. I'm not looking for max loads, just trying to get the speed more than my subs.

 

[Engineer1911]

Ben's Lube with Dexron III automatic transmission fluid added. I drive plain base 158 SWC at max powder charge with no leading. My 245 gr 44 mag load is what my wrist can handle. I don't believe you will have a problem with rifle velocities. You run out of powder volume before you hit "too fast".

Go to Cast Bullet Forum home page, scan down page to "Boolit Lube' forum, open and at the top of the page are "Stickies", find Ben's lube it's about 15 pages long. Everything you want to know is on page 1 and 2. For an in-depth Doctoral Dissertation on boolit (lead bullet) lube read to the end --WARNING-- it gets painful.

 

[BC38]

Ben's Lube with Dexron III automatic transmission fluid added. I drive plain base 158 SWC at max powder charge with no leading. My 245 gr 44 mag load is what my wrist can handle. I don't believe you will have a problem with rifle velocities. You run out of powder volume before you hit "too fast".

I like Ben's Liquid Lube too, mixed with very close to equal parts mineral spirits, Lund floor wax, and Alox

How much Dexxron do you add? What's percentage or quantity of the 4 ingredients do you use for your mix?

 

[DumpStick]

I'm shooting a 7.62x54R, cast of CWW, and lubed with BLL (Ben's Liquid Lube) at just under 1800 fps with no leading.

I can't speak to your projectile in your rifle, only you can find that number.

 

[Dieseltech56]

I powder coat now and I'll never go back to regular or tumble lube.

 

[smoothshooter]

Ben's Lube with Dexron III automatic transmission fluid added. I drive plain base 158 SWC at max powder charge with no leading. My 245 gr 44 mag load is what my wrist can handle. I don't believe you will have a problem with rifle velocities. You run out of powder volume before you hit "too fast".

Go to Cast Bullet Forum home page, scan down page to "Boolit Lube' forum, open and at the top of the page are "Stickies", find Ben's lube it's about 15 pages long. Everything you want to know is on page 1 and 2. For an in-depth Doctoral Dissertation on boolit (lead bullet) lube read to the end --WARNING-- it gets painful.

How hard are your bullets?

 

[Psweigle]

I happen to have that very rifle, and i can tell you that about 1100 fps is all alox will handle. I use range scrap lead. I powdercoat all my cast bullets for 357 magnum,and alox my 38's. Ive found if you add a little mica powder after you tumble lube,and roll them in it, they arent near as sticky. If you powdercoat them successfully, you can run them as fast as a full charge magnum can go without leading. Hope this helps.

 

[Forrest r]

I happen to have that very rifle, and i can tell you that about 1100 fps is all alox will handle. I use range scrap lead. I powdercoat all my cast bullets for 357 magnum,and alox my 38's. Ive found if you add a little mica powder after you tumble lube,and roll them in it, they arent near as sticky. If you powdercoat them successfully, you can run them as fast as a full charge magnum can go without leading. Hope this helps.

+1^^^^^^

Powder coating is the way to go.

I have used a luber sizer and several different lubes over the decades including a batch of "ben's red". The only time I use the luber-sizer anymore in for rifle bullets in the +/- 2700fps range with lbt blue lube.

I've used strait lee tl in the past and opted for the 45/45/10 tl instead. I still use the 45/45/10 lube to this day. But I only use it in conjunction with either lbt blue or over pc'd bullets (pc ='s powder coat). The 45/45/10 isn't as sticky and doesn't gum up your reloading dies as bad.

PC'd bullets are user friendly, are not alloy dependent & are faster than their traditionally lubed counterparts. They don't gum up your reloading dies, there's no smoke from lubes burning off when the rounds fired. PC'd bullets can be used in can's, semi-auto's (gas guns) ported bbl's, etc without any fouling/leading issues. The firearms are cave man simple to clean after a range session.

A 1911 chambered in 9mm after a 500+ round range session with 25,000+psi loads doing +/- 1100fps from the 5" bbl.

What the bbl looked like when taken out of the 1911 pictured above.

1 wet patch (hoppe's #9) and 1 dry patch is all it took to clean that bbl. No brushes or scrubbing of any kind. Simply wet a patch and run it thru the bbl and over the muzzle. Then wipe everything dry with a dry patch.

What the inside of a 308w bbl looked like after 30 rounds from a 40,000+psi load doing 2700fps+ with a cast & pc'd 165gr bullet.

Nothing 1 wet patch of bore tech couldn't handle.

 

[BC38]

I happen to have that very rifle, and i can tell you that about 1100 fps is all alox will handle. I use range scrap lead. I powdercoat all my cast bullets for 357 magnum,and alox my 38's. Ive found if you add a little mica powder after you tumble lube,and roll them in it, they arent near as sticky. If you powdercoat them successfully, you can run them as fast as a full charge magnum can go without leading. Hope this helps.

Red's Liquid Lube (RLL) is (approximately) 1/3 Alox, 1/3 Lundmark (or Johnsons if you can find it) Liquid Floor Wax, and 1/3 mineral spirits. I haven't tried pushing it yet, but people claim to have got up in the 2000fps range with no leading using it. The mineral spirits makes it dry quickly, and the floor wax makes it dry hard and slick - no stickiness.

I'm set up to powdercoat too, and it is an effective and interesting alternative. HOWEVER, tumble lubing with RLL is an order of magnitude easier and faster. I use it a lot more than powdercoating these days. In fact, I've been using it to re-lube my commercial lead that already has some other form of lube on it.

 

[mtgianni]

I have used both LLA and Bens Red but don't push either over 1300 fps. My conventional lube holds up well at 2500 fps.

 

[rockquarry]

Hey guys,

Picked up a Ruger 77/357 and started reloading for it, heavy subs (have a form 1 suppressor waiting on ATF). Some good results, some..... well bad, lol.

Point is, I found a heavy sub I like, now its onto full speed, so what the fastest I could get out of a cast tumblelube bullet?

Thanks for any help!! If you have some pet loads for rifles, please let me know. I'm not looking for max loads, just trying to get the speed more than my subs.

Maybe your question has been answered to your satisfaction, but...

I think it depends on several factors like bullet fit, right alloy for the pressure/ velocity, etc. I'm not a fan of tumble lube, having tried it years ago and saw no advantage over conventional lubricating and sizing. However, lots of people like it and it apparently works well for them.

With perfect bullet fit and an alloy of the right mix and hardness for your load, you'll be able to successfully push a load harder than someone who doesn't have all the important stuff just right. So, velocity/ freedom from leading, and decent accuracy may be limited to 800 fps in one case and twice that (or more) in another.

Best to do some experimenting; time spent will be worth it. It may work very well for your purpose from the start or you may have make a few adjustments along the way. Good luck-

 

[Qc Pistolero]

Like everything else in life,nothing comes in cheap or easy.
In most handguns shooting loads at or below 900 fps,I got vg to exc accuracy.Above 1000fps,different guns kind of show their preference;some sooner than others.Generally,when combined with hot burning powders(Titegroup,Power Pistol),accuracy tended to diminish at or around the 900fps mark by showing heavy deposits in the barrel(altough even at 1300fps they were easy to clean).And even there, accuracy was not bad;it just showed that while the limit of the lube was attained,it(the lube)did not let go all at once but only started to be less performant on a slowly declining way(like a car's peak power giving less HP past a certain RPM).
Yes Liquid Lube is good but one must experiment if he wants to extract the most out of it and it has got it's limits not very much like those of conventionnal lubes...exept that it is so much easier to put on and in some cases,it gives much more accurate bullets.