Stove piping.....?

[G.T. Smith]

Mods, I ain't sure where to post this as it is not a S&W smithing question, although it may be similar in nature. Please move it if you want too.
My question for all you folks that know this kind of stuff is, what is the most common cause of stove piping. I only own one semi automatic and it is a Colt 1908 vest pocket .25 made in 1922. It is the only handgun I own that is not a S&W.
It shot fine for the first box or so and then it started doing this a couple of times per magazine thereafter. The gun is spotless clean around the ejector and the magazine seems fine and clean as well. It tried to feed another round into the chamber but couldn't close because of the spent shell not being completely ejected. Do you think it could be the ammo (Blazer 50 grain FMJ's)? I have read that the way you hold a semi can affect the cycling but I believe that I'm holding it tight enough to let the slide go all the way to the rear. It's no big deal because I don't carry it but it bugs me anyways.
Any input is appreciated,
Thanks People,
Gordon

 

[ordy]

I'm no gun smith by a long shot but if it were mine, I'd look at the extractor and the recoil spring

 

[Oldiron]

G.T. So many things can cause that. Hold is one of them as you mentioned. Check the spent case and see if there are marks across the rim where the extractor has been ripped past. Check to see if the ejector has chipped and not hitting the case. check the ejection port for burrs. You mentioned it was clean, is it mayby too clean and need a dab of grease on the slide. From the top of my head those are just some thing to check. Hope it helps.
Larry

 

[jlrhiner]

Try the above, and a different ammo. The Blazer may not be hot enough to make everything move all the way.

 

[H Richard]

It is a blow back operated slide, so the energy to properly cycle it is not enough. That can be caused by a "limp wristing" (not keeping the wrist & arm stiff enough when firing). Or, the recoil spring may be too stiff. Or, accumulation of residue may be slowing down the cycling.

 

[Pete99004]

I had this problem with my Kel-Tec P11 when I used the extended mags. Seems I was holding the grip so tight I was actually pulling the mag. down a bit against the stop and it would cause it to stovepipe.

I think limp wrist would also be something to look at.

Don't know if this will help you but thought I would mention it.


Pete

 

[SMSgt]

Stovepipes are often associated with cycling speed.

I'd start with changing ammo. Get something more potent than Blaser (Right .25 potent).

Then I'd try changing lubricants. Use a light grease applied sparingly to the rails or some 3-in-1 oil.

If still malfunctioning and not seeing any obvious physical damage to the extractor or ejector, I'd take a chance on the recoil spring weakening. They're relatively inexpensive, and the gun is 90 years old.

Don't try a bunch of corrections all at once or you won't know what fixed it.

 

[Packard]

To check for limp wristing have a couple of experienced shooters use the gun. If both of them also have stove pipe issues the it is unlikely to be caused by limp wristing.

 

[G.T. Smith]

After checking it closely with a magnifying glass I found that the ejector has a small chip in it. I am hereby on the lookout for an ejector. I did not notice the chip earlier and it only recently began the malfunction. I shot two boxes of 50 through it without any problems when I first got it and it ran smoothly. Oh well, like I said, it ain't for SD anyhoo.
Thank you all very much for your help and suggestions. I truly do appreciate it.
Peace,
gordon

 

[George9]

I have a old Beretta Mod.1935 that would stove pipe on every mag. My fix was to shorten the extractor by 20 thousands of a inch. I had a old Italian .32 round and I used a caliper just under the rim and found that the Italian rounds were 20 thousands thicker then any US rounds I could find.. I went with a Winchester .32 ACP now functioning is 100% only took me 25 years to figure this out!! LOL!! But realy it could be anything.. I had remembered a gunsmith told this to my dad years ago so I thought I would give it a try.. My dad always had issues with the gun stovepiping when he had shot it.. It was handed down to me and I found the issue years after his passing much wasted ammo and thought.. George

 

[2152hq]

Try different ammunition. The Blazer 25acp stuff is known for not being reliable in many of the tiny pistols.
I just tried some in a Bernardelli 25auto I was working on and got nothing but stove pipe jams as well.


The guns will generally fire and eject w/o an extractor in place. Blowback operated.
That part does nothing during the firing sequence to pull the case from the chamber. It's there to remove it manually.
The case slams back against the slide face all by itself in any blowback and pushes the slide rearward.

Ammo w/a smaller than normal extractor cut in the case can cause stovepipe jams during firing because of the extractor.
At the point where the slide is at full recoil, the case is slammed back against the extractor.
Normally the claw of the extractor is just hooked around the case rim and into the cut. No or very little sideways pressure.
If the extractor cut is too small, the extractor is pivoted out under it's spring pressure and pushes on the base of the case to the left side of the slide. That can swivel it around sideways before the ejector can bump it out of the gun or cause it to so when the ejector contacts it and the stove pipe jam results.
I have a feeling the Blazer ammo may have this problem, but I haven't looked in to it. The shape of the extractor claw comes into play also of course.

The ejector surface itself (pinned onto the frame) can be a problem area. Check it closely for wear, being loose or even being bent slightly.
If it is worn on the right front edge or bent to the outside (left) of the slot in the slide face,,it can cause poor ejection and stove pipe type problems.
Add to that ammo with base diameters just a few .000" under normal spec and you have the constant annoying problem.

Check the breech face countersink in the slide for anything from a burr to hard packed dirt & crud that would keep the case from seating squarely and as deeply as it should.

A magazine that has had the feed lips opened wider will add to or cause ejection and feed problems also.

The cartridge in the mag sits a bit higher than it needs to be.
It may feed OK,,though occassionally it will jam against the feed ramp or partially into the chamber.
It can slow the slide speed down during fireing also cause problems.

Just some things to look at...the points actually apply to any semi auto.
But the little autos can be tedious little machines to work on!

 

[George9]

Yes this is the point I was making.. Little to no extractor presser is needed and to much for whatever reason can cause issues.. My issue is fixed as I stated.. Cause was to much extractor pressure do to a long extractor pin.. Again years of issues fixed.. All great info!! thanks for posting! george

PS one correction I made I think I should point out as it may be confusing..

(Ammo w/a smaller than normal extractor cut in the case can cause stovepipe jams during firing because of the extractor.
At the point where the slide is at full recoil, the case is slammed back against the extractor) Correction here, ejector not extractor.

 

[BigBill]

First did you load it, chamber a round them close the slide and put the mag in before you started having problems? Every auto pistol should be loaded from the mag only. Otherwise you de tune the extractor. Its unsprung now so the extraction of the fired round is too loose to pop out completely. I learned this on the 1911's and fixed it from the dvd's.

There is an extractor tention on the 1911's so your extractor should hold the case firm but not too tight. I would tention it so the case won't fall out when the slide is turned upside down. Just a little will do.

I been told its the extractor first then it could be the mag next if the extractor doesn't fix it.