the 9mm and the BIG 165 gr bullet......

[Nevada Ed]

A few years back there were a few people talking about this HUGE bullet
and some were thinking of loading it and see if it would work or if
it was just a pipe dream.

Did this idea, ever take off and fly ?

Does enyone here shoot this monster of a bullet in their pistols?

I started gathering info and data but the storm sort of blew over
and I don't remember any articles about this loading.

Good day, to you.

 

[colt_saa]

I have gone through many thousands of that projectile over the years.

I have loaded all of mine into the 9MM Parabellum cartridge at subsonic velocity for suppressed use.

5.6 grains of AA#7 yields 880 FPS as measured from a S&W M&P Spec Ops which has a 4.5" barrel

Prior to this projectile becoming availble, I used to load a 158 TC for 9MM Parabellum suppressed use.

 

[Forrest r]

Nothing new here.

A link to the lyman 44th manual. On page #116 you'll find reload data for there 358311 158gr rn bullet in the 9mm.

Years ago (1990's) I had a 4-c mold that cast a +/- 162gr 358311 bullet that I used in the 9mm/38spl/357mag.
http://marvinstuart.com/firearm/Man...oading Handbook --- 44th Edition --- 1967.pdf

 

[AJ]

My question is why do you need a bullet that heavy? The heaviest that I have ever seen was the 147 grain that we used in the Corps. It was subsonic for use in fully silenced HK MP-5's, and it worked well.....

 

[reddog81]

My question is why do you need a bullet that heavy? The heaviest that I have ever seen was the 147 grain that we used in the Corps. It was subsonic for use in fully silenced HK MP-5's, and it worked well.....

Realistically 140 & 147 will work well and probably better than the giant bullets. I have shot the 358311 in 9mm and it doesn't really do anything a 147 grain bullet can't do. I pulled a couple of the 358311 bullets from a couple different headstamped brass and the base of the bullet was getting swaged down from having to stuff it so deep in the case. .353 or smaller was normal for bullets that started out at .357.

It's nice to have options, but once you get too far out of the parameters a cartridge was designed for you start to run into problems with case capacity, fitting into the magazine, feeding, etc.

 

[rockquarry]

Using a 165 grain bullet in the 9mm seems to be more of a it-can-be-done stunt than anything useful unless the bullet provides exceptional accuracy. Perhaps it does.

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

When I was feeding a suppressed MAC-10, I loaded a few thousand 158 gr JHP Hornady's in 9mm at sub sonic velocity. I was using AA#5, I tried the 180 gr FMJFP silhouette for more energy, but it had too much pressure. It blew out the case walls, before it went fast enough to exit the 6" barrel!

Ivan

 

[.455_Hunter]

The 158 and 165 gr 9mm loads can be used in guns that have fixed sights, but for whatever reason, tend to shoot low with "normal" ammo.

 

[rockquarry]

I've tried many cast bullets in 9mm pistols in the last thirty or more years. The most accurate I've found to date were cast using an obsolete Lyman .38 Special mould, #358212, a 150 grain (wheelweight alloy) round nose bullet and Bullseye powder. This bullet will shoot to point of aim at 25 yards in a Beretta, a Sig, and a Walther and feed perfectly.

I've never tried the Lyman #358311 design, except in the .38 Special, but it's around 155-160 grains depending on alloy. This is probably the maximum practical weight for the 9mm if you want a decent velocity. I realize the difference between 160 and 165 grains may seem hairsplitting, but it's really not considering the very small case capacity of the 9mm cartridge. Right on the edge.

 

[colt_saa]

I do not know about the OP, but I am not talking about a cast bullet here.

I am referring to the plated round nose projectile from X-Treme

Prior to this 165 grain bullet becoming availble, I used to shoot the IMI 158 grain subsonic or my hand loads with plated 158 grain truncated ones

Strange thing is that these 158s came from a Company also called eXtreme but located in South Africa

 

[rockquarry]

I do not know about the OP, but I am not talking about a cast bullet here.

I am referring to the plated round nose projectile from X-Treme

Prior to this 165 grain bullet becoming availble, I used to shoot the IMI 158 grain subsonic or my hand loads with plated 158 grain truncated ones

Strange thing is that these 158s came from a Company also called eXtreme but located in South Africa

It seems the thread got sidetracked toward cast bullets way back and I just followed. Regardless, bullet weight is the important point here. 165 is too heavy for me, and some don't care for plated bullets, but, if they shoot well for you, no argument here.

 

[Nevada Ed]

Thanks all, for passing on your knowledge and loadings.

I had just started loading the Speer 147 TMJ bullet, when this all came about.
It worked well until I ordered the longer Berry 147 RN plated bullet that took a lot of case volume up.

That was when I started thinking on how on earth a HUGE 165 gr. bullet would fit in the tiny 9mm case?

I don't shoot steel, so maybe it was a good deal that this idea died out, for me.

Thanks for the help and God Bless.

 

[Forrest r]

I'm the 1 that got this thread sidetracked with my comment on cast/lead bullets, sorry about that.

We were fitting 6" 9mm bbl in our 38super raceguns and using the heavy bullets to make major.

Myself, I've never had an issue loading the long/heavy bullets in the 9mm cases. But then again I don't use the short expander button that comes with the factory reloading dies that is designed for the shorter/smaller in diameter jacketed bullets.

If I ever got an ar chambered in 9mm with a 16" bbl or any 9mm carbine with a 16" or longer bbl. My 1st choice in bullets would be a +/- 160gr bullet.

 

[GBertolet]

The 165 gr bullets are popular in the action shooting sports. They make power factor, with less recoil. Especially popular in the revolver divisions.

 

[243winxb]

My 163 gr doesnt seem to be a good match for 9mm Luger? Its great in 38 & 357 mag.

 

[jcelect]

Another use for 165

Not a 9mm but 38 Super and not an auto but a revolver! I use the 165 Xtreme Plated Bullets in my revolver for bowling pins! 5.4grs of Herco and I crimp into the side of the bullet. In a revolver the OAL is not as important as in an auto so there is no need to stuff the bullet way down into the case! In pin shooting you need the moving mass to push the pins off the table!
jcelect

 

[Nevada Ed]

The main problem with the 9mm case is that it is not a "straight wall" design
and that the case 30% of the way down, starts getting fatter and fatter
the deeper you go, which can cause problems.

As posted above, some of you have gotten very good at getting 5 pounds
of apples into a 4 pound bag.

 

[teletech]

I'd be interested in seeing if these heavies would work well to run a spinner as used in many of the action shooting matches (2-gun, etc.).

 

[STORMINORMAN]

A 9mm 165gr @ 880fps vs. the Mighty 38 S&W from Buffalo Bore with a 125gr HC Lead bullet @ 926fps from a 4"...?

Wouldn't want to be shot by either, but I can understand paying $1.74 per round if my only PD choice is in 38 S&W: with a 9mm and all those other bullet choices, not so much...

If they do knock the pins down that's a totally different application and one with which I have no experience. Then there is the question about loading heavier, typically sub-sonic bullets for PCCs and the dangers of possible over pressurization & squibs: these at the opposite ends of the reloading spectrum!

147gr is about the heaviest I feel comfortable reloading: just a personal preference.

Cheers!

 

[Ignatz]

Here's my 929 with a moonclip full of Bayou 160gr round nose bullets. I load to 1.200" and around 3.1 of WST. 10's of thousands of rounds over the years.
The 160's, being heaver, drop into the 929 real nice.
160's are popular in USPSA revolver division.