Took an Advanced Pistol Class

[Protected One]

I took an advanced pistol class which basically covered material that had been offered in other classes. At the end, the instructors did something that was kind of fun. They called it the "Last Man Standing" competition.

They had all 10 class participants toe the line 5 yards from their bladed targets. On their signal the targets all turned, and we were to draw and fire ONE round at the target, reholster and take one step back. Anyone who's round was outside the blue area was disqualified and stepped off the line. The procedure was repeated until there was only one person left.

After 25 reps I ended up the SECOND TO LAST man standing when the instructor dq'd me for the round in the triangle he circled on the lower left. There was a lady to my left who was shooting a bersa thunder that her dad gave her, and she had nothing but trouble with it all night. She was a terrible shot, and was dq'd early for a round that missed her entire target. Unfortunately, they didn't notice that her round hit MY target - in the triangle.

I kinda wanted to win that thing.

 

[sotexas]

396477[/ATTACH][/QUOTE

She wasn't a bad shot she was just looking out for you, taking care of your bad guy.

 

[chiefbob81]

You should have kissed her, lit a cigarette, and rolled over a gone to sleep!

 

[CB3]

That’s good draw-and-shooting. Good placement and group. What’s most important is that you know how competent you are. You know how well you shot compared to others less skilled, but you also may have gained some confidence that could transfer to a real world situation. Others apparently may have learned less.

 

[Protected One]

396477[/ATTACH][/QUOTE

She wasn't a bad shot she was just looking out for you, taking care of your bad guy.

LOL. Yeah....except she MISSED my bad guy as well!

 

[Dump1567]

My agency ran one of those drills during training a few years back. I actually won, but I was just having a good day.

Sorry to here about your woes. I've had people shoot my target at the indoor range before.

My buddy took a class that required them to clear live rounds. At the end of the drill, you picked-up your live ammo. He ended-up with a reload from the shooter next to him. Which of course caused his Glock 26 to kaboom.

During the Academy, I had a recruit have an ND with a Shotgun next to me. Let one go through the roof.

All that to say, things happen when others are on the line next to you.

 

[Gamecock]

Protected One, reminds me of my M-16 qualification in the Air Force.

I had 70 hits on the 100-yd silhouette with 60 shots.

 

[Rastoff]

On their signal the targets all turned, and we were to draw and fire ONE round at the target, reholster and take one step back.

Was there a time limit? If there wasn't, how would anyone ever be eliminated?

She was a terrible shot, and was dq'd early for a round that missed her entire target. Unfortunately, they didn't notice that her round hit MY target - in the triangle.

I kinda wanted to win that thing.

What caliber were you shooting? If it were me, I'd have them check the size of the hole. It's easy to see the difference between a .45 and a .380Auto.

You should always want to win. Otherwise, why compete?

 

[Protected One]

Was there a time limit? If there wasn't, how would anyone ever be eliminated?

What caliber were you shooting? If it were me, I'd have them check the size of the hole. It's easy to see the difference between a .45 and a .380Auto.

You should always want to win. Otherwise, why compete?

There was a 2 second time limit.

I was shooting 9mm. She was shooting a .380.
Ultimately, it wasn't that big of a deal. I shot pretty good that night...and everyone knew.

 

[Ole Joe Clark]

Much better to leave it alone. Classy guys do what you did.

Have a blessed day,

Leon

 

[Smoke]

There was a 2 second time limit.

I was shooting 9mm. She was shooting a .380.
Ultimately, it wasn't that big of a deal. I shot pretty good that night...and everyone knew.

Sometimes you just got to tell yourself "A hundred years from now nobody's going to care"

 

[fredj338]

There was no Cadillac. I am surprised anyone that cant hit a target at 5y in 2sec would be allowed into an advanced class? Btw, if the target presents for a full 2sec, you actually have almost 3sec. It is partially visible before & after full presentation.

 

[Wise_A]

I am surprised anyone that cant hit a target at 5y in 2sec would be allowed into an advanced class?

Protip: "advanced" is a word we use to fill classes.

 

[S&WIowegan]

I can relate to your experience next to a bad shooter. I took Clint Smith's course at Thunder Ranch(TX) about 20 yrs. ago. There were at least 24 shooters on the line. I had a woman next to me who was absolutely dangerous to the rest of us. Her husband was brow beating and berating her. I finally went to an instructor and asked to get her off the line. They took her to another range(w/o husband) and she got much better.

I also took a revolver course at TR(Oregon). They had us draw and shoot steel; one shot and back up. I made it beyond 50 yds. with an S&W Model 22-4. Finally the front sight completely covered the target and I couldn't hit reliably.

 

[fredj338]

Protip: "advanced" is a word we use to fill classes.

Understood but there is usually a basic min for being in such a class. For safety reasons alone, see post #14.

 

[Wise_A]

And I would point out that nothing was done, either about the shooter or her waste of life husband, until after another customer complained. Nothing I haven't witnessed first-hand.

"Advanced" doesn't mean anything until you get to an instructor/organization that can reliably fill every class they run, whilst running as many classes as they care to. At that point, it means "Before you take my three-day $1500 course, I require you to first take my $500 one-day course."

I mean, c'mon. These are the same people that think it's smart to run people on a range, drawing from concealment, for 6 hours a day, starting at 8:00AM, with most participants driving at least an hour to get to the class.

That any of you think that firearms or CCW training is some hallowed hall of ethics and wisdom is hilarious. It's a business--safety is a by-product of insurance and the amount of hassle/expense a dead body will generate.

 

[fredj338]

Several advanced classes I have been to require a certain skill level to attend. it is often gaged by previous classes from that instructor or a level of experience gaged by something like your IDPA or USPSA ranking or LE position. I have been to so called adv classes though where there were definitely shooters that should not have been there.

 

[Protected One]

I can relate to your experience next to a bad shooter. I took Clint Smith's course at Thunder Ranch(TX) about 20 yrs. ago. There were at least 24 shooters on the line. I had a woman next to me who was absolutely dangerous to the rest of us. Her husband was brow beating and berating her. I finally went to an instructor and asked to get her off the line. They took her to another range(w/o husband) and she got much better.

Yeah. I'd guess that many of us have had a similar experience. Without an industry standard for the definition of what constitutes "advanced" training (which is certainly not forthcoming), it is fairly commonly accepted to be anything above basic.

Lets face it, the number of people committed to regular training...and by that I don't mean shooting paper at the range, is less than enough to fill all the various classes being offered across the country. But there are instructors that will only allow qualified shooters in their classes, whether they are vetted by having attended that instructors previous classes or providing certificates from other known/trusted instructors.

I also took a revolver course at TR(Oregon). They had us draw and shoot steel; one shot and back up. I made it beyond 50 yds. with an S&W Model 22-4. Finally the front sight completely covered the target and I couldn't hit reliably.

Impressive!

 

[Rastoff]

Protip: "advanced" is a word we use to fill classes.

Sad, but true.

It's a business--safety is a by-product of insurance and the amount of hassle/expense a dead body will generate.

Also true and even sadder. Safety should be paramount by itself.

Several advanced classes I have been to require a certain skill level to attend.

An "advanced" class that doesn't have a skill requirement probably isn't worth taking.

I've been to a few advanced classes myself. At one school there is a tough requirement that must be passed at the first level to be able to take the second level. Then there are a few second level classes that have to be taken to get to the third level. It took me three years of hard work to get to level three, worth it.

Moreover, at the advanced classes it was a real honor to in a squad with those that really can shoot vs those that just say they can. A lot of students complain that the test at level one is too hard, but I like it. It means that when you get past it, you've really accomplished something.

I can post the requirements if anyone wants to try.

 

[Protected One]

I've been to a few advanced classes myself. At one school there is a tough requirement that must be passed at the first level to be able to take the second level. Then there are a few second level classes that have to be taken to get to the third level. It took me three years of hard work to get to level three, worth it.

Last summer I was fortunate to meet a guy at a LGS when buying ammo. He was there to give them HELL because he sent a new student there to buy a revolver...and they talked him into a semi-auto! He wadn't happy.

While he waited for the manager, a few of us customers got into a conversation that ended with him inviting us to his upcoming Concealed Carry Tactics - Level I class. We all took his card, and I went home to do some homework. I found out that he is a U.S. Department of Diplomat Security Services officer, a certified Master Instructor (Int'l Assoc. of Law Enforcement Firearms Instructors), and a civilian instructor when his schedule allowed. I was the only one to take him up on his offer.

His Level I (Fundamentals) class included MORE SKILLS than any 'advanced' class I've taken, and while there was no live fire - that's reserved for Level II, we were in motion ~90% of the time...and hydrating and dehydrating the other 10%. LOL
Still waiting for a Level II class to be scheduled this year, and HOPEFULLY I can take the Level III class (which is by 'invitation ONLY') next year.