Warning about a seller on GunBroker....

webfarmer

webfarmer

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Michigan
You'd think everybody these days that deal with firearms would be honest but it's not to be I guess. Short story - I ordered four .308 P-Mags on GunBroker.com on 11-30-2014. He shipped, USPS lost them (somebody there is enjoying them) and I'm out $112. Vendor said he had to chase the cheapo $50 insurance money (means he did not insure them - comes free with the shipment) and as of 2-24-2014 - 86 days later - I have nothing to show for my money. Neither PayPal nor GunBroker will do anything about it. So, just a warning to anyone that sees his deal on GB. If USPS loses them - kiss your money good-bye. Good luck all!
 
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I ALWAYS ship with insurance for the value of the Contents...The USPS has been very bad lately..Promising 2 or 3 day service...It usually takes an extra day...

I have a Check coming from NY...Guy sent it the 16th Priority...It ended up in Arizona and has been there ever since...Still no tracking update...

How does a package go from NY to AZ when it should have gone to WI...Thank God you can stop payment on a Check..Money Order and you could really get screwed..

Anyways...Long story short..>Ship Legally and Always Insure...Its worth it when you need it!!!
 
Back to your first sentence, how is the seller not being honest?
I agree with jj, the USPS has become extremely undependable regarding time of delivery.
 
smith17 said:
Back to your first sentence, how is the seller not being honest?
I agree with jj, the USPS has become extremely undependable regarding time of delivery.
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He's the shipper and the only one who can request the insurance. Nothing is happening with this. He waited until January to make the claim (if I even believe that). You would expect a business to man up and take care of the customer. Not make them wait like this. Hell, I would have bought more mags even after this happened if he'd taken care of me by reshipping the 4 mags and handling USPS himself. That is business.

I have no proof he actually did request the insurance from USPS other than one email he sent. Honestly it all looks phony. And yes - USPS sucks these days. I don't trust them one iota either anymore. Would you wait 86 days with your money gone and have nothing to show for it? Or stand up for him?
 
Webfarmer, there are essentially 3 procurement elements that you have to question:
1) Were the items actually packaged and given to USPS? IE, can the vendor produce a paid receipt for shipping the package that denotes a package tracking number and weight? If so, does the weight of the package on the receipt correlate to the weight of the all the items plus a little more for packing material?
 
2) In the purchasing agreement, were there terms included that determined when the title of property changes hands. A common term used is FOB or Free On Board ... basically meaning you own the goods once the Seller puts it in the Carrier's possession. When you negotiate terms, its best to negotiate written terms for FOB DESTINATION whenever possible.
3) Are you aware of the legal name and address of the Supplier? If so, and provided you discover any details that might be deemed as Deceptive Trades Practices or Mail Fraud, you will need to contact the Attorney General or Postmaster respectively with jurisdiction over the Seller's legal address.
 
apiccola said:
Webfarmer, there are essentially 3 procurement elements that you have to question:
1) Were the items actually packaged and given to USPS? IE, can the vendor produce a paid receipt for shipping the package that denotes a package tracking number and weight? If so, does the weight of the package on the receipt correlate to the weight of the all the items plus a little more for packing material?
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Apiccola, I do believe he shipped them initially. I have a tracking number which showed they arrived at the distribution center in Allen Park, MI. It ends there. Allen Park is known for "lost" parcels. USPS is definitely the root cause of the problem no doubt. Oddly, no weight is shown on the USPS tracking page.
 
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apiccola said:
2) In the purchasing agreement, were there terms included that determined when the title of property changes hands. A common term used is FOB or Free On Board ... basically meaning you own the goods once the Seller puts it in the Carrier's possession. When you negotiate terms, its best to negotiate written terms for FOB DESTINATION whenever possible.
3) Are you aware of the legal name and address of the Supplier? If so, and provided you discover any details that might be deemed as Deceptive Trades Practices or Mail Fraud, you will need to contact the Attorney General or Postmaster respectively with jurisdiction over the Seller's legal address.
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I couldn't find anything concerning your question # 2. I do have his legal address (it's his home address) though. I'd hate to go that far unless he simply refuses to at least give me the insurance payment. That makes it a $62 loss which is a little easier to bear. He has far more A+ ratings than 'D' like I gave him as their PO's actually deliver parcels LOL.
 
Comrad said:
The guy's got A+ feedback and hundreds of good deals.
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Yep I know, that's why I ordered from him in the first place. He sells, he ships but not taking care of this customer. I now know he's just a guy selling stuff out of his house. Oh well.
 
webfarmer said:
I now know he's just a guy selling stuff out of his house. Oh well.
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Well, I do the same until I can afford a store front. Not all businesses that run from a home are bad.

What was the agreement on insurance?

Fyi, I always insure my stuff and I always get a tracking#, no matter if you order a rifle or just a magazine.
 
JJEH said:
Well, I do the same until I can afford a store front. Not all businesses that run from a home are bad.

What was the agreement on insurance?

Fyi, I always insure my stuff and I always get a tracking#, no matter if you order a rifle or just a magazine.
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There wasn't an agreement on insurance. Priority mailing gives you $50 insurance free. Anything more than that you'll have to pay for. He charged $20 shipping which likely only cost him $9 in reality. I knew that up front of course and didn't give how much went to insurance a thought quite honestly. I did have a tracking number after asking him a couple times for it.

You always assume the package will be delivered. This is the first time in my 61 years a package wasn't delivered that I paid up front for. I know all home businesses aren't bad obviously and didn't say it. I'm just deflated a bit as I don't see recourse now. Thanks for responding and good luck!
 
webfarmer said:
There wasn't an agreement on insurance. Priority mailing gives you $50 insurance free. Anything more than that you'll have to pay for. He charged $20 shipping which likely only cost him $9 in reality. I knew that up front of course and didn't give how much went to insurance a thought quite honestly. I did have a tracking number after asking him a couple times for it.

You always assume the package will be delivered. This is the first time in my 61 years a package wasn't delivered that I paid up front for. I know all home businesses aren't bad obviously and didn't say it. I'm just deflated a bit as I don't see recourse now. Thanks for responding and good luck!
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Yeah, I understand. That's just wrong and insurance doesn't cost that much. But to be fair, it needs to be addressed before purchase. I do it anyway and luckily never needed it so far.
 
Webfarmer, the cruddy thing here is that $50 should be reasonably close in covering replacement of the PMAGS at dealer cost ... if not the 4 purchased, perhaps 3. If the vendor a) pocketed the insurance claim (which insured items you owned and should have inured to your benefit under the premise of uniform commercial code), b) is non-responsive to your reasonable attempts to contact him, and c) there is a means to identify his legal identity and his personal involvement in the matter (whether through subpoena of Gunbroker or PayPal records), you should either threaten or actually pursue fraud claims through the attorney general and the postmaster to get his attention back on curing your loss.
 
apiccola said:
Webfarmer, the cruddy thing here is that $50 should be reasonably close in covering replacement of the PMAGS at dealer cost ... if not the 4 purchased, perhaps 3. If the vendor a) pocketed the insurance claim (which insured items you owned and should have inured to your benefit under the premise of uniform commercial code), b) is non-responsive to your reasonable attempts to contact him, and c) there is a means to identify his legal identity and his personal involvement in the matter (whether through subpoena of Gunbroker or PayPal records), you should either threaten or actually pursue fraud claims through the attorney general and the postmaster to get his attention back on curing your loss.
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Yeah, right now he's not answering emails and I contacted Gunbroker again. If I don't hear from him in the next week or so, I am going to contact USPS and file fraud charges. It should be interesting to see how that shakes out :) Thanks for the suggestions!
 
My guess is that the seller will make good on it eventually, even if it is only giving you the $50 insurance. However, my bet is that the USPS hasn't even begun to investigate it, thus not paying off on the insurance they claim they supply. And if you think you are going to get the post office to file fraud charges over 4 mags of minimal value, you are going to be waiting for a long, long time. Been there, done that, for an item of a lot higher value. I bet they show up at your doorstep eventually.
Ed
 
smith17 said:
My guess is that the seller will make good on it eventually, even if it is only giving you the $50 insurance. However, my bet is that the USPS hasn't even begun to investigate it, thus not paying off on the insurance they claim they supply. And if you think you are going to get the post office to file fraud charges over 4 mags of minimal value, you are going to be waiting for a long, long time. Been there, done that, for an item of a lot higher value. I bet they show up at your doorstep eventually.
Ed
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Huh, interesting. I highly doubt I'll see the mags shipped initially. However, hadn't considered USPS has to do an investigation. They likely won't put 2 and 2 together and use the complaint I filed against them on those very same lost mags long ago. I see 2 scenarios - one is they're with some PO dude and his .308 rifle or two is some anti-gun nut figured out what they were and destroyed them. I highly doubt the label fell off so hard to figure what else it could be.......
 
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