What is this that came out of my Winchester Box?

[Mr. Fahrenheit]

So I picked up a 100 count box of Winchester 9mm from Walmart or Academy about a month ago. I shot off 40 rounds at the range and as I was putting the remainder in a plastic ammo box I noticed that the familiar 9mm stamp wasn't on the casings.

What did I just shoot down range? Are these Nato rounds?

There is nothing on the box to tell me that these aren't 9mm Lugers at 115 grain. In fact, that's exactly what the box says they are.

Any reason for concern?

There were no malfunctions. The casings are the exact length of my Federal and Remington 9mm's.

 

[JJEH]

I do have some boxes with WCC 124gr Nato rounds and they have the same markings, but with a "10" instead of a "12" like in your case...

The last WCC target 115gr box I have shows "9mm Luger" on it.

I wouldn't be concerned... just shoot it and be happy

 

[pete950]

thats winchester Nato!!

 

[805moparkid]

thats winchester Nato!!

you can tell as it has that 4 dot "cross" in a circle... pretty sure that NATO on any round...

EDIT

you need to call win and let them know... that could be a big deal if in a light frame gun not deisgned for nato rounds... and also its mis boxed...

 

[-db-]

If those are indeed NATO rounds and not 115 gr. bullets somehow accidentally loaded in NATO brass, they're 124 grains, not the 115 the box states, as there's no such thing as 115 gr. 9mm NATO.

Most say the 124 gr. NATO round falls between standard and +P, pressure-wise. I doubt it would blow up anyone's gun, but the package is clearly mismarked and should be brought to Winchester's attention. It's good ammo, I'd keep it and shoot it.

 

[JaPes]

Maybe they just had an overrun of NATO brass, and loaded 115gr w/thier normal load.

The pain in the butt is the crimped primers. Not fun when reloading.

 

[Cerberus62]

The NATO headstamp and "12" (2012 production) don't necessarily mean a mistake.

Winchester can use any cases they make and may have had these availabe for that production run. The heavy military use is winding down now that we have win the War On Terror

I'd guess these cases are most likely leftovers from a military contract.

 

[Mr. Fahrenheit]

Thanks everyone.

I guess I'll send off some correspondence to Olin Corp.

I think I may have gone through a box or two of these already. I'm hoping I didn't put a couple of hundred rounds of higher pressured rounds through my favorite XDm and Shield.

 

[JRWnTN]

Years ago, I bought a 50 round box of 115 gr. FMJ at Wal-Mart. Headstamps were mixed commercial and WCC with the NATO cross. Same bullet. No difference in recoil. I'm betting the factory used whatever cases that were handy.

 

[SMSgt]

Run the tip of your chamfering tool thru the primer pockets and they're good to go.

 

[CTG_COLLECTOR]

Don't panic people. Winchester is well known for using NATO stamped brass for their USA brand 9mm target ammo.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Don't panic people. Winchester is well known for using NATO stamped brass for their USA brand 9mm target ammo.

While that is very true I'm wondering why they crimped the primer pockets on target ammo...

 

[Mack]

Uh, because they had leftover "primed" NATO brass they needed to use up.

 

[CTG_COLLECTOR]

Uh, because they had leftover "primed" NATO brass they needed to use up.

Exactly.

And if someone is concerned that they actually got 124gr NATO loads, one can simply pull a bullet or two and weigh them or take a known 115gr bullet load and weigh the two. A 124gr load will be noticeably heavier. This is what I often do to an unknown bullet weight load to help determine if it might be a 115, 124 or 147 grain bullet load without pulling the bullet and destroying the round for my collection.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Uh, because they had leftover "primed" NATO brass they needed to use up.

Sure, that makes sense... I wasn't thinking of already primed brass.

 

[-db-]

Good to know. I would have assumed any 9mm ammo with the NATO stamp would be the 124 gr. stuff.

 

[CTG_COLLECTOR]

Not all ammo with the NATO symbol is actually NATO qualified.

NATO's Sub-Group 1 (SG/1) is responsible for qualifying and maintaining STANAG qualified small/medium caliber ammunition and weapons. Presently (as of 2007) there are only 5 qualified 9x19mm NATO loads. I presume one qualified loading is the US 124gr load by Winchester/Olin and by ATK/Federal. The other 4 I haven't a clue as to the design/manufacturer.

http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2007smallarms/5_9_07/Geddes_1120am.pdf

 

[125JHP]

Well, I will bet that at least one of those other 4 are of European origin.

 

[Frank46]

I bought a box of 45 hardball and all of the rounds in the box had the wcc nato cross stamp and last two digits for the year they were made.
No biggie, after firing just dumped them in the bucket marked "mil surp 45 auto"

 

[duppie]

While not the same issue,We on the East coast had some incidents with the same White box ammo in 9mm not having flash holes and causing death jams.Olin was notified and to their credit issued call tags and replacement ammo immediately. We have yet to hear anything further,and apparently it was not widespread.