Who knows about Rolling Blocks?

[sigp220.45]

I just got my first Rolling Block. It had been at a local shop for a year or two and they finally got tired of it and sold it to me for two hundred bucks.

It has seen better days. Lots of surface rust, but the action is good.

Not much in the way of marks. There is a faint cartouche on the right side of the stock. I think it means it is a Spaniard (Oviedo?).

"R" on top of the chamber.

A crown, smooshed together AR.0., and 1883 on the right side of the receiver.

It has some fine wood carving on the right side of the buttstock.

The only reference I could find to "Kasilawan" is that it is a city in the Phillipines. Maybe this old boy served with Private Q P of Spain in the Philipines, or maybe it belonged to Billy Bob Roy Kasilawan of Doglick, Kentucky.

The rear sight and cleaning rod have left the building.

I know it isn't worth much. The bore is filthy but I think it will clean up when I find a long enough cleaning rod.

So - thoughts? It should be a .43 Spanish if my limited reading is correct.

I really like it. The action is really strong, and the thing is deceptively light and well balanced.

Any other fans?

 

[Iggy]

I had one years ago that had been recreated as a .357/38 spec. It had been restocked with a Monte Carlo stock and a P.O. Ackley barrel.

It was a fun gun. Great for badgers and pasture poodles and a coyote or two.

There was a feller that wanted it more than I did, so it went down the road.

 

[ColbyBruce]

Roy Bertalotto, Author at RVB Precision

Roy Bertalotto restores old single shot and lever action rifles, he might could help you.

 

[DWalt]

These things can turn into money pits if you are not careful. I'd probably just keep it as an interesting wall hanger/toy.

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

I know only a little about Rolling Block Rifles. I have 2, 1 is like yours. It is not a Remington, but a made at a Spanish arsenal. The cartridge is 11.5 x 57R, commonly called 43 Reformado. It uses a conical .454" bullet of around 400 grains and 75 to 80 grains of FFg black powder.

The Remington Rolling Blocks all have a Remington address on the top tang, even military contract rifles. the cartridge these were made in is 11.15 x 58R commonly called 43 Spanish. It uses a 375 grain bullet of .439 Diameter and about 78 grains of Fg black Powder.

The cases are of the same rim diameter and very close in length, If you have reloadable brass, you can form one out of the other! 2 1/4" or 57/58mm is the same range as the 45-90 (300 grain) Winchester or 45 2 1/4 Sharps. The European military rounds have a thick lubed wad below the bullet, that makes up the major difference in powder capacity.

I've been off and on trying to make ammo that shoots well for about 25 years, I'm still trying!

My other RB is a Remington contract for Egypt. The barrel was so huffed my gunsmith cut the barrel off even with the front of the action counter bored this stub barrel and silver soldered a Springfield barrel in 50 Carbine AKA 50-50 US. I make cases from 50-70 brass, use a crude 425 grain mould and 50 grains of FFg Goex. This gun shoots 4 to 6 inches at 75 yards consistently and very close to the 1861 Springfield sight I put on it.

CH-4D make reasonable priced dies for all these cartridges.

Ivan

E.T.A.: your rifle looks a lot nicer than mine!

 

[cgt4570]

Thankfully someone else had already done the hard work on mine. Re-stocked and re-barreled (octagon) in .45-70. I put a Marble's tang sight and a windage adjustable front sight on it and a few finishing touches.

 

[damienph]

Mine is chambered in 7mm. It actually is a pretty accurate rifle. Hard on brass though.

 

[Hang-Fire Hank]

GUESSING SOMEONE'S PROJECT RIFLE

I found one at a gun show 6 1/2 yrs. ago for $550 that had been rebarreled to a 30" octagonal .38-55 (one of my favorite calibers) & restocked with a nice piece of wood that has a Monte Carlo cheek rest & a checkered steel SG butt plate. Weighs 10#12oz. Has a mint .375 groove diameter. Cast & fire a traditional Lyman 375249 bullet sized .377 that hits a 200 yd. "gong" w/no problem (if I do my part). Mounted a vernier tang sight & a globe front sight on her. Invited a 20-something "youngster" shooting an AR over to my bench to shoot a few rounds & got a BIG GRIN from firing an old rifle! Like introducing old guns to young shooters.

Hank M.

 

[deadin]

Mine is chambered in 7mm. It actually is a pretty accurate rifle. Hard on brass though.

Same here.
Might I suggest that you don't full length resize its brass. (Just neck size) Many of these 7x57mm Remington RB's have "hinky" chambers.

 

[2152hq]

Many of the 7mm Mauser cal Rem RB have extra long chambers for some reason,,.010 to .020 excess headspace is not uncommon to find in these.

Then another one will come along and it'll be fine. That'll blow the theorys about early cartridge specs being different or rifles w/ chambers cut purposely oversize to handle poor quality ammunition, ect.

I've always told people to go easy on them in the first place,,keep pressures in the 40K psi and under range for them. Smokeless in 1902 may not be what smokeless in 2018 is, and the history of many of these is murky at best.
They can blow open if a head separation or primer lets go and gas slams the firing pin back hard driving the hammer backwards and out of the down and locked position. That allows the breech to open.
It has happened.
The Scandanavian copies of the RB have a firing pin lock on the hammer to prevent that.

Drop a factory loaded round into the chamber if you don't have a headspace gauge and just observe where the base sits in reference to the back edge of the chamber. The real bad ones are very obviously sitting low in the chamber that most anyone can clearly see.

Many shooters don't even bother with factory brass as it takes such a beating in fireforming by stretching. Instead they form it from 270 generally which gives them a chance to set back a new shoulder altogether. 30-06 is also commonly used.

Neat rifles with a lot of history.

 

[Sylvaticus]

I know only a little about Rolling Block Rifles. I have 2, 1 is like yours. It is not a Remington, but a made at a Spanish arsenal. The cartridge is 11.5 x 57R, commonly called 43 Reformado. It uses a conical .454" bullet of around 400 grains and 75 to 80 grains of FFg black powder.

The Remington Rolling Blocks all have a Remington address on the top tang, even military contract rifles. the cartridge these were made in is 11.15 x 58R commonly called 43 Spanish. It uses a 375 grain bullet of .439 Diameter and about 78 grains of Fg black Powder.

The cases are of the same rim diameter and very close in length, If you have reloadable brass, you can form one out if the other! 2 1/4" or 57/58mm is the same range as the 45-90 (300 grain) Winchester or 45 2 1/4 Sharps. The European military rounds have a thick lubed wad below the bullet, that makes up the major difference in powder capacity.

I've been off and on trying to make ammo that shoots well for about 25 years, I'm still trying!

My other RB is a Remington contract for Egypt. The barrel was so huffed my gunsmith cut the barrel off even with the front of the action counter bored this stub barrel and silver soldered a Springfield barrel in 50 Carbine AKA 50-50 US. I make cases from 50-70 brass, use a crude 425 grain mould and 50 grains of FFg Goex. This gun shoots 4 to 6 inches at 75 yards consistently and very close to the 1861 Springfield sight I put on it.

CH-4D make reasonable priced dies for all these cartridges.

Ivan

E.T.A.: your rifle looks a lot nicer than mine!

Great summary! Paper patching the bullets, as is commonly done for Springfield .45-70 trapdoor rifles, might help with accuracy.

These are fun guns. Sorry I had to sell all four of mine. But my kids have nice straight teeth!

 

[LedFowl]

I've got a little .22 Remington Model 6.

 

[deadin]

Remington (and Remington clones) weren't the only makers to use the rolling block system. Here is an example by J Ancion of Belgium. (Ancion was one of the quality makers that combined with several others to form Fabrique Nationale)
I never have figured out just what the intention of this gun was. It is quite high quality (fully case colored, timed screws, fine line chekering, etc.) but in a totally wrong chambering for "Target shooting". (Indoor or outdoor).

 

[Muley Gil]

My first centerfire rifle was a .43 Spanish carbine, bought at the Baltimore gun show in 1970. I bought a few original cartridges as well. Most of them fired.

As I was already shooting muzzle loaders, I improvised my ammo a bit. I would load a cartridge with black powder, place the loaded round in the chamber, half cock it and then load a round ball from the muzzle. Later, I would charge a cartridge with powder and then put a .451" lead round ball into the mouth of the case. It would hit a tin can at 25 yards.

If you wonder how I re-primed the fired Berdan rounds, I would lay a large pistol primer on top of the anvil. It fired fine.

Once I wore out the anvils in my Berdan cases, I reamed the primer pockets and used 209 shotshell primers.

I took my RB to college with me, stored in the closet in my dorm room. I found a gun shop in Phenix City, Alabama that had all sorts of stuff. There I met a retired Army Lt Colonel who was a custom reloader. He loaded a few rounds for me, using .45-70 brass. They were a little short, but shot fine.

I wound up trading the carbine for a .30-40 Krag rifle. It was easier to find dies and ammo for it.

Twelve years ago, I bought a Uberti rolling block carbine in .357. I also found a reasonable M4 in .22 Long Rifle. I have a .32 Rimfire M4 that I started to convert to .32 S&W Long. Just need to finish it up.

I really, really want a rolling block in .32-20, but those seem to as scarce as hens teeth or priced waay up there. Maybe someday...

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

Stevens also made a Rolling Block in Center and Rim fire. (Not positive, but I think it is the #44 action and the 44 1/2 was a Falling Block)

There is a great book caked "The Military Remington Rolling Block Rifle" by George Layman 3rd edition 1996 and cost about $30 then.

I checked the book about Reformado rifles and cartridges and found this out; In 1866, Spain ordered 10,000 Rolling blocks that ended up being in the 58 Berdan and had converted Springfield barrels. Spain wanted all their rifles to be in the 43 Reformado cartridge, and Remington refused and talked them into the 43 Spanish (Remington) cartridge. All further Remington Spanish contract rifles were in 43 Spanish. The 10,000 first contract rifles were returned to Remington and reworked (it isn't clear how) into 43 Reformado. Afterward Spanish arsenals made RB rifles (without ever paying a royalty), all of these were in 43 Reformado!

For all intent and purposes, if you shot 45-70 with 500 grain bullets, all three feel about the same. The 43 Reformado has a thin brass jacketed bullet (one of the earliest military rifles to do so) and that is one reason Remington refused to make them or ammo for them! All Remington 43 Spanish factory ammo has lead bullets. If you can get one to shoot well enough to hunt with, you can easily take anything native to the Spanish Empire!

Ivan

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

Several (also about 12) years ago my best friend built a 32 S&W long Rolling Block on a 32 Rimfire action. It was for his then teenaged daughter and was set up to hunt small rodents (Rats and rabbits) in a barnyard environment. Short distance (75 yards max) and low noise. The 90 grain SWC bullet was the ammo the peep sights were set to.

Ivan

 

[Wyatt Burp]

delete duplicate

 

[Wyatt Burp]

I have 2 band Remington 7MM that my dad bought in the early 60s for $14 I think it was. It’s pretty nice. The other was a 3 band Egyptian .43 wallhanger with no buttstck that cost $7. He made a buttstock for it. It’s in the corner about 3 feet from me. Both were mail order. Yours looks pretty good, and you are right. These are lighter and less unwieldy than they would appear.