Just saw the new M&P pistol ad in Guns and Ammo Magazine, March 2013 issue. The ad states:

Positive, Tactile Trigger Reset

So it looks like S&W is finally now producing all the M&P's with the same trigger pull/reset, as in the Shields.

Bob

That's awesome! I'm waiting on my M&P 9 FS, I surely hope it comes with updated trigger system.

Here's hoping the one I just ordered has it.

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Damn...I just got my M&P FS 9 a few weeks ago...oh well...I'm in the minority I guess as I don't mind the trigger..BUT like anything else when something new comes out you sort of go...hey I want the new stuff too! lol

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M&P 9mm FS
M&P Shield 9/40

So, for a novice, what, exactly, does this mean???

I'll attempt an answer here. In the self defense shooting classes
I've taken, they stress "shooting to the reset" for faster follow
up shots. This means after a shot only allowing the trigger to
return just enough for the trigger to reset. On some M&Ps, the
reset is pretty vague. Adding a RAM(reset assist mechanism)
helped my 40c. I've got a Shield 40 on order & I'm sure looking
forward to checking out the trigger! Hope this helps.

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What's all this then?

As you release the trigger, most pistols have a "click" you can feel when you have released the trigger enough to fire another round. This way you dont have to release the trigger completely. the trigger pull shortens and follow up shots can occur quicker. Old m&ps didn't have this. The shield does. Many M&P owners installed a part from APEX to introduce this click, but it appears that S&W listened to the consumer and added this feature.

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It's harder if you're stupid

Is it a new trigger assembly or did S&W just add the RAM to it?

What is important is the "tactile feel". When the trigger is pulled back far enough to cause the sear to release the striker, the point where the gun would fire (break point-boom), the slide then cycles and re-cocks the striker. As you release the trigger, the trigger jumps about 1/32 inch at reset. This is the tactile feel, the trigger jumping. You can feel this in your finger. At that point the trigger has reset and you can pull the trigger back, to fire the gun again. The fact that you can hear the reset does no good in a noisy, shooting environment. But since you can feel the reset, you know when to stop releasing the trigger, for reset, and can pull to fire again.

As previous posters stated, this eliminates wasted trigger movement and speeds up additional shots. You no longer have to nearly fully release the trigger, as you are not sure if the trigger has reset. The tactile feel lets you know exactly when the reset has occurred.

Bob

In my last armorer recert they told us that the "new" standard "trigger" consists of the Performance Center sear, a new slide stop assembly and a revision to the trigger bar.

The PC sear would seem an obvious refinement.

The revised slide stop assembly ought to help with the "tactile reset" due to it adding some additional pressure against the trigger bar, pushing it inward (left) with a bit more tension. This has been accomplished via adding an inward bend/angle to the bottom rear corner of the right side of the slide stop assembly. Nifty idea, accomplishing their goal (and answering customer demand) of making the trigger bar snap under the sear nose during sear reset a bit more briskly ... and they didn't have to add more parts to do it. Nice.

The new slide stop assembly also incorporates the yellow (painted) wire spring, which is heavier than the previous springs they've used on the slide stop lever assemblies.

The change to the trigger bar wasn't described in detail, except to say they made a modification to it so the addition of the PC sear didn't drop the trigger pull weight below what the original trigger pull weight was intended to be (since the standard M&P is designed to be a service-type trigger, after all).

Last I heard the "new triggers" were being introduced into the 9/.40/.357 guns sometime late last year, but we were told that due to ongoing testing of the .45 trigger bar's revision, the .45's won't be receiving all of the revision until maybe the end of this year.

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Retired LE; instr/armorer

I wonder if S&W would retro fit our old style M&P pistols with this upgrade? I love the gun but hate the trigger compared to my PPQ. I just don't want to give APEX what they want for their parts. It is ridiculous the price they charge.

i just picked up my m&p40c last week. it was test fired in dec 2012. it seem that it has this. i'm happy so far.

I don't think it's a new trigger assy. I believe it's a new sear housing. Apex says the RAM will not fit in the newer M&P pistols due to redesign.


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I have two full size 9's, one with a firing date of Dec '12 and the other one dated 2010 (both bought in the past month, the older one has the safety). I swear I can't tell a difference in their triggers.

I suspect that during a SD situation you will not be able to feel the reset because you will have other things on your mind.

I know that last year they redesigned the sear.

I had a .40 FS that I sent in for repair, and when it came back it had the newer style sear installed. The newer style has a more pronounced lip on the back side of it.
I am sure of this because I had an Apex sear in it and I put the OE sear back in before I sent it in for repair. When I got it back and went to reinstall the Apex sear, S&W had installed the updated sear in it.

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Oh, George! Not the livestock.

It could be several parts. I have a Shield and can compare that trigger bar to the prior M&P trigger bar. The Shield's trigger bar has a small bump at the front outside, that rests against the side of the frame. The bump is not on the prior trigger bar. This bump forces the rear of the trigger bar more towards the side of the sear. The spring post on the trigger bar is lower, that the prior trigger bar, which also forces more inward pressure to the rear of the trigger bar. These two changes would cause the trigger bar/loop to snap harder into reset, under the sear. I do think that snap is what causes the tactile feel. I have seen posts that the sear face may have changed, but that should have nothing to do with the reset feel.

Bob

I took the armorer class in December 2012 and got to play with the updated model. It is like the Apex trigger with the RAM installed with a 5.5lb pull. It is a rolling change and the newer ones will have it. They are nice, I held off on buying the Full size 9 and the Compact 9 so I could get both of them with the newer factory parts.

So if I just ordered one from an online retailer who sells a high volume, going in and out of stock regularly, my chances would be decent its the upgraded model? Will know soon.

Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2

Would be nice to be able to view the video but it just sends me to download the pgm...

Got mine in Jan/2013 and it definitely has been improved. It is the 9c

According to a note/review on the Apex site regarding the upgraded RAM, M&P's June 2012 and newer use a redesigned sear block. No idea how accurate that is.

...but with their FSS & trigger kit, it feels like a whole new gun with the actual performance and aluminum trigger . Well worth it IMO. Especially if you install it yourself to keep costs down.

But I am interested to feel what S&W's new trigger feels like on a full size or compact.

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9mm, 5.45X39, 7.62X39

If your handy, you can go to Dan Burwell's site and learn how to do your own. No special tools required and the results can be impressive.

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Dave

Could we get drawings or photos of the old vs. new versions?

I just bought my M&P9 FS in January. SN HAF70**, with a test fire date of 10-08-12, so it's fairly recent. I do feel a slight "hitch" at the reset point, but it's not a very positive indicator, and I have nothing to compare it to to know if it's any different. It would be helpful if S&W could give us serial numbers or manufacturing dates to tell us when updates were made. This might easily become an issue when ordering replacement parts from S&W, let alone knowing what aftermarket parts will work or not.

I had the gun out to the range for the first time yesterday. I don't care for the trigger action AT ALL! Looking closely at some the engagement surfaces in the trigger assembly, I can see why. Nothing has a proper final finish! I can understand the complaints I see on the forums and why so many are swapping in after-market parts, but I'll try some simple polishing first on this one before I start replacing parts and experimenting with different spring values.

The gun was reliable, fits my hand comfortably, and points "naturally". I think it's just going to take a little "tuning" to make it right.

Will S&W offer an upgrade service?

Got the 40c on Tue. Test date 1/21/13 got a 9c back in Nov. and I'm new to shooting and I can tell the difference not gritty and quick reset on the 40c I really like it and I like my 9c a lot was going to be my EDC if my CCW ever gets here but now looks like the 40c will be.

I just picked up a used M&P 9 FS a couple weeks ago and it has a test fire date of Oct 2012. I've shot other M&P's in the past and from what I can tell this is a different trigger. It definitely has a very short and tactile reset. I should be able to compare it to my friends FS 9 shortly to see what the differences are. My only complaint is the gritty take up, but I've been spoiled by my Sig and Kahr which are smooth as butta.

So if the spring is painted yellow then we have the updated version?

Depends.

All that might be said (without actually examining the rest of the gun) is that the yellow slide stop assembly spring, if present, is the latest revision. The original wire spring was unpainted, and then it was followed by a red one, and then a light blue one, and then the yellow one.

The red one remained in the 9's when the .40's & .45's received the light blue one, and then the yellow one came about during some further testing of the .357's, and then was selectively used for repair purpose in some .40's. Now it appears they're going to standardize on the yellow spring in all the standard models.

The original slide stop assembly with the yellow painted wire spring was being used before the slide stop assembly was itself recently revised to add the angled bend on the right/rear bottom corner. I replaced a slide stop assembly with the yellow spring in one of my M&P's with the new revised slide stop assembly with not only the yellow spring, but also with the new beveled corner on the right side lever.

Now, for everyone else who is eager to have a noticeably tactile "reset" ...

All this talk of trying to discover the absolute latest & greatest revisions (plural) in any particular production vintage of M&P's is all fine and dandy, but I've been handling and shooting random models made over the last several years, including some pretty recent ones (and including a M&P VTTC 9) ... as well as some that have had the popular aftermarket parts added to them (by armorers) ... and I've listened to other instructors & armorers express their opinions that they've all started to feel pretty much alike when you stand around on the firing line trying the triggers in both dry & live-fire. Especially in dynamic live-fire drills, when you aren't standing around carefully listening and feeling for "tactile trigger reset".

The whole "sear reset issue" may be popular on the internet, and to slow-fire target/competition shooters ... and the market demand for such a feature has prompted S&W to try and meet the perceived desire for this feature ... but shooting to trigger recovery in dynamic, past-paced & demanding training & qual drills seems to be something you hear discussed more often by LE firearms instructors, compared to trigger reset.

I've seen at least my fair share of folks try to keep their fingers on the triggers of their pistols after firing an intentional shot (or shots), trying to hold them at the "reset point", and then experience their guns unexpectedly firing. Sometimes it's seemed it was them unconsciously rocking the triggers during recoil ... or being startled (which having the weapon unexpectedly discharge can really do to someone, yet further lending itself to another "startle response") ... or experiencing a muscle tremor (yip, etc).

Losing balance momentarily (balance destabilization was the popular term for a while), or hand/finger confusion (mixing up tasks being done by one hand with the other) may also be factors. I've known a couple of highly trained and experienced LE folks end up putting holes in things they didn't intend to shoot when their "trigger fingers" mirrored what their other index fingers were being told to do, performing other tasks in high stress situations.

It's just that if the gun fires without the shooter having made a conscious decision to fire that specific round, the round is still going to land somewhere, and the shooter is still going to be responsible for it ... and being in the position of saying that their finger had been deliberately on the trigger, trying to hold the trigger at the "reset point" when the weapon discharged, isn't something anyone probably wants to try to explain. Especially in a legal proceeding.

Hey, just some thoughts. Sorry for going off-topic, but I sometimes feel this whole "trigger reset" thing is often blown out of proportion and taken out of context by some folks.

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Retired LE; instr/armorer

Just picked up an M&P 45 fs today with born on date of Jan 2013.
This new gun has a slightly gritty trigger pull. It also feels as if the final bit of the trigger pull is slightly heavy. The reset is definitely much shorter and has more of a click feel when pulling the trigger than my 4 other M&Ps that are all 4-5 years old.

The older pistols are challenging to feel the reset well. I have been focusing on that alot over the last year when I go to the range.
While this new trigger on the 45 is a little gritty, I expect it will begin to smooth out with use. My older M&Ps all have atleast 2-3000 rds shot through them and now have a buttery smooth pull.

I have Sigs with Short Reset Triggers and I have Glocks. I shoot competition and not slow fire and my M&P 40c trigger has zero feel to me. I have the opposite problem, not knowing the limit I am often surprised by my shot or lack of shot. I just really want to know if I can send it in to get the parts upgraded. While it may not matter to you, it matters to me and others.

I'm told S&W doesn't have enough of a surplus of the new parts for anything more than trying to keep up with new gun production and some repair use (as older parts are exhausted).

They apparently don't even have the surplus parts to think about sending out "kits" for existing LE agency customers, if they were to want to start installing revised parts in their older M&P's.

Maybe sometime later on ...

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Retired LE; instr/armorer

Part of me doubts that they will consider this to be a warranty service, because there is functionally nothing wrong with the older style sear, etc.
I think the updates were to address a common customer complaint, but the gun is not unsafe otherwise.
If they did offer a freebie, it would be out of the kindness of their hearts.

However, last year I sent my M&P40 FS in for repair, and they replaced the sear while they had the gun.

Your best bet would be to call them & ask.
1 (800) 331-0852

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Oh, George! Not the livestock.

If S&W was interested in customer service they would. Glock retrofit the complete trigger assembly for free on my Gen I G19. Sadly I have already spend about a $100 on my M&P9 produced in Oct-12. It took the complete Apex carry kit to get the trigger to what my Gen III glock had from the factory.

BTW, if you enter a Glock match, a factory armorer will check out your pistol and replace and/or retrofit any worn or obsolete parts. All for free.

This is very exciting to me as the 9C is on the very short list for my first handgun purchase. Great timing.

Now I just have to save my pennies and find one for sale.

Any ideas on how one would identify the updated version? Dry fire and hopefully detect a click at reset?

Yes, this.
Dry fire the gun and keep your finger on the trigger with the trigger pulled back.
With your finger still on the trigger, pull the slide back about 1/2" to reset the striker. Let the slide go forward again.
Now, release the trigger slowly, and you should feel and/or hear the reset. It may take a couple tries to notice it.
If there is a noticeable and audible >click<, it likely has the updated parts. If it is vague and not noticeable, it is probably the older style.

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Oh, George! Not the livestock.

Ok my FS 9 which has a rest fire date of Oct 26 behaves like this.....dry fire, hold trigger back, pull slide back 1/2 inch and then let trigger out.....after maybe 1/4 to 1/2 of release I hear a click.... It isn't a sharp click , sort of subtle but the trigger is reset and I can fire again

Can I assume this October 12 build has the updated parts? Reason I ask is the trigger still feels diff compared to my Shield

Getting snowed in here in NH so mind has time to think up these type of questions lol

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M&P 9mm FS
M&P Shield 9/40

If you hear it, it's most likely the newer style.
The old style was almost unnoticeable, and you couldn't really hear it.

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Oh, George! Not the livestock.

My Shield has a very positive tactile feel, at reset. The "click" sound is very noticeable in a quiet room, but I cannot hear it with muffs or earplugs on. What everyone likes is the "feel" of the reset. My trigger feels like it jumps forward about 1/32 inch, at reset. This jump gives me immediate sensation, to my trigger finger, that I can stop releasing and pull the trigger to fire again. It is not a vague feeling, but a definite jump, which anyone would be able to feel. It is a great improvement to the original M&P's vague reset.

Bob

I went to the Smith & Wesson site and under Gn Smithing the offer the trigger installed and reworked for $150.00 I think I might go that way

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STAND AND FIGHT

Thanks for the explanations everyone.

For $150 I would think you would have to consider purchasing Apex parts. Wouldn't that be equivalent or better?

Don't forget to add your expense of shipping your gun back and forth to the factory.
S&W only pays shipping on warranty service. Elective gunsmithing is not covered.


Another vote here for Apex updates. Cheaper, faster, and you don't have to live without your gun for several weeks.
If you have (or know somebody that has) moderate mechanical skills and basic tools, the Apex parts install in minutes.

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Oh, George! Not the livestock.

I bought my M&P 40 in January 2013 and it has a fired date of July 2012. The trigger was very gritty with little or no reset feel. I purchased the Apex fully machined sear ($42) and ultimate striker block ($36) for a total of about $86.50 (this price includes $8.50 shipping). Ordered on Sunday and received on Wednesday. It took about 30 minutes to install both. I don't have a trigger gauge so I couldn't say what the actual trigger pull is now, but there is a noticeable difference. I can feel the reset, as it is more evident now. The trigger grinding noise is gone, too. Can't wait to try it on the range.

If you guys drop by the XDTalk forum they can show you how to post pictures LOL JK

Do all Shields have the better trigger?

I got a new m&p9fs and 45fs in January. The test fire on the 9 was Jan 2013, and the 45 Nov 2012. The 9 has a definite trigger reset. There is a solid click that you can hear and feel. The trigger reset on the 45 is pretty soft. Though, I can't say say for certain, since they are my first m&ps and I haven't really handled the "old" style (other than my NEW 45?) . This is just my observation to add to the conversation.

The Shield 40 and 9mm are identical in all ways except for the barrels, slide opening at the sight hole, and markings on the slide. They both have the "new & improved" trigger action. When the Shields came out in April, S&W told several magazines and gun television shows that they would eventually incorporate the Shield trigger action into the rest of the M&P pistol models. The Guns & Ammo advertisement states “Positive, Tactile Trigger Reset." So hopefully all M&P pistols will be shipped with the new & improved trigger action.

Bob

I just got my new M&P 9 today and wanted to provide some feedback. The date on the slug was 1/16/13. After dry firing several times and checking out the trigger, the reset was pronounced you could definitely feel and hear it. The trigger feel was slightly gritty however so I will shoot if for awhile and perhaps look into adding some apex parts, possibly just the striker blocker.

So far the striker block is all I've put into my M&P9c and I love it.
The Apex striker block removes the gritty feeling.

Before I change the sear I am going to compare my trigger to a friend's gun that has the Apex sear to see how the new style compares.

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Oh, George! Not the livestock.