.455 Picture Thread

[Goony]

I can't find that there has ever been a thread on the .455's that was deemed "notable", so I thought I'd start one up where these could be viewed and compared.

I'll get this going with a Second Model (sometimes referred to as a Mark II) in the 63000 serial number range. It does not appear to have been altered or modified in any manner. The only non-factory applied markings I can see are the opposed broad arrows denoting deaccession and a crown over 30 on the butt.

 

[Texas Star]

Gee, that looks GRAY! not blued. Was it refinished, Parkerizing? Bad photo? Have you shot it?

I think your .455 thread idea is a good one, and hope that many post photos of these good guns.

 

[Goony]

Gee, that looks GRAY! not blued. Was it refinished, Parkerizing? Bad photo?

It's actually a nice, original blue. I had lightened the photo a bit so that details would be more readily visible, but I've now replaced that shot with another one that gives a truer impression as to the state of its finish.

 

[tekarra]

Fine looking revolver Goony. Have you any history?

 

[Texas Star]

That looks better. Thanks.

 

[Goony]

Fine looking revolver Goony.

Thank you. Actually, even the latest photo I've posted doesn't do it justice. It retains probably 98 to 99% of its original blue.

Have you any history?

Not really, nor have I lettered it. I do remember where and when I found it, in a gunshop in Eau Claire, Wisconsin way back in 1989. I suspect it was originally intended for issue to Canadian forces (hence the map in the background), but there's nothing about it that would confirm that.

Edit: I thought I had a really nice example, but the others since posted below make mine look like a beater, albeit it would appear none of these others actually saw any service. There are just some astonishing guns in collections out there....

 

[CptCurl]

Just last December I posted an array of photos of my .455 Mk. II Second Model H.E. at this thread:

http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-ha...455-mk-ii-hand-ejector-2nd-model-69234-a.html

Here's one of my photos. The rest are at the linked thread.

 

[Toyman]

2nd model HE shipped to Winchester to use as a test gun. Photo of box and rollmark tool for master carton of cartridges.

 

[Waidmann]

Altered .455

I have an uncut .455 but I also have one .38 Special.

Don't know why but three attempts to upload were rejected, its a no.2 frame with an HD barrel and cylinder dating to 1934.

 

[Goony]

2nd model HE shipped to Winchester to use as a test gun.

I'm presuming this was done because W.R.A. had been contracted to be an ammunition supplier to the British Commonwealth for these revolvers?

Also, are my eyes deceiving me, or has that front sight been lowered (by flattening the top)?

And finally, what's with that "455 Colt" marking?

Fascinating piece of history, thanks for sharing.

 

[gripper]

Here are a couple.

SN# 52554 Shipped April 1916

SN# 53541 Shipped June 9, 1916

Both of these guns have the crown over 30 stamped on the bottom of the grip frame. The first gun may or may not have been fired, if it was only a handful of times. The second gun I believe to be unfired. How they stood the test of time as well as they did, we will never know.

Chad Gripp
SWCA #2323

 

[Toyman]

Goony: S&W would not put .455 COLT on the gun and Winchester would not call their cartridge ELEY so Winchester called the cartridge .455 Colt. From what I have found most of the Winchester .455 Colt cartridges were shipped to Canada. I have a photo of the .455 Colt box and I have found 2 rounds with WRA .455 head stamp. Dominion cartridges in .455 Colt are eazier to find.

 

[ButchG17]

Though I have two .455 revolvers, I don't (yet) have one that has "Smith & Wesson" stamped on it. Bummer huh?

.455 Colt reloads:

 

[glowe]

My 455 has original chambering and was shipped May 1916. Bought it several years ago from Jim Supica, and should have bought several at the low prices these revolvers used to sell for.

 

[Waidmann]

????? 4 lines

This is a pic I saved for curiousity's sake

 

[DCWilson]

This is a pic I saved for curiousity's sake

A factory refinish from the era (late '60s and early '70s, I think) in which S&W was re-stamping the guns that came in to make them compliant with current marking standards.

 

[Texas Star]

I believe the reason why S&W guns were proofed by Winchester with .455 Colt ammo is that it was in normal commercial production at Winchester, as Colt made the New Service in that caliber, and also sold many of those guns to the British. The RCMP used the New Service in both .45 Colt and in .455, and much of that Winchester ammo was probably being sold north of our border, even before the war.

The .455 Colt gives higher velocity than the MK II, about 700 FPS to a nominal 620 FPS from a six-inch barrel. It also uses the MK I case, which is longer, but any MK I ctg. can be fired in the .455 gun. The .455 Colt is just Colt's marketing of the .455 MK I Webley or Eley cartridge.

Officially, the reason for going to the shorter case is that it handled smokeless powder more efficiently. But the cylinders would accept either case length. I think the wadcutter (Man Stopper) rounds were only loaded in MK II cases, though. They were widely used in places like India, but I think for Euro service, only the regular round-nosed lead bullets were employed. They were intended to tumble in a body, causing added wounding power. MK VII .303 ammo is also meant to be marginally stable in flight, to also create more massive wounds in tumbling within a human target. This was meant to give added killing power on wild fanatic tribesmen.

In the case of the ,303, I suspect that it's deadly on smaller antelope with a heart/lung shot, but might not hold a true course in shooting larger game, for which regular softnosed sporting ammo should be used, even where the GI ammo might be legal.

The .455 had a good rep for stopping men at close range. I think the bullet weight and diameter, as well as the tendency to tumble helped a lot. But I've read that enough British officers bought guns in .45 Colt that the supply system in India stocked that ammo, too. Also, .44-40. Don't know when that stopped. Probably in the 1920's, when new regs specified that they carry only the issued revolver. That was probably part of the gun control scheme that reared its head at that tme and just got worse.

 

[Texas Star]

Though I have two .455 revolvers, I don't (yet) have one that has "Smith & Wesson" stamped on it. Bummer huh?

.455 Colt reloads:

Your .455 reloads look like they're made from auto pistol cases. Why?

I bet they'd knock a man down at normal combat range...are those Keith style bullets, about 260 grains? Meant originally for .45 Colt? Or for the .45 auto? Any idea of the velocity that you're getting?

 

[Texas Star]

BTW, I loved seeing those boxes. Had no idea that the company was marking those as "Government Model." They must have had a good laugh at Colt over that name.

 

[Cyrano]

No picture, but an interesting story. I was at the Albuquerque gun show a few weeks ago and an old friend told me this. He is a good machinist and has a nice shop full of tools.

Some years ago, when they were cheap, he bought an old Smith, probably a 2d Model, in 455. It was in nice shape with a good bore and he wanted to shoot it. 455 ammo was a lot scarcer then than now. He decided he'd rechamber it to 45 Colt. He had it all cinched up in the holder and was about to machine it when his daughter, who was watching said: "Daddy, what's this marking on the butt: RFC?" He looked, turned a little pale , took the cylidner out of the die, reassembled the pistol, oiled it carefully and put it away. He still has it. He says he's never heard of another revolver marked to the Royal Flying Corps, the ancestor of the RAF. The change occured in 1918.