People who live in Hurricane areas?

Sometimes the last thing anyone can do is convince mountain people in TN and NC that a hurricane in Florida will drown them. It's just not conceivable in their minds. I imagine people in Noah's time thought the same thing. And then it began to rain.

On the flip side, the forecasters here in SE FL would convince you the end of the world was coming tomorrow. we had some wind and a few showers. They can cry "Wolf!" only so many times until they are ignored. It's called sensationalism, and they practice it daily. Viewer count is all important. As I type the late-night weather reporter is briefing on a possible hurricane that isn't going to hit the US at all, yet it's on the news . . . again.

Yes, our local ABC affiliate is notorious for doing the "we're all gonna die" stuff for even summer thunderstorms. Urging caution is one thing...inciting panic is another. One reporter laid on his back with a cameraman over him during a minimal tropical storm some time back and it significantly damaged his credibility. Then a Weather Channel guy was in another minimal storm and acted like he was being blown all over the place while people were walking behind him in a normal and casual manner looking at him like he was a moron.

In situations like tropical storms and hurricanes, I go to the NWS/NOAA sites on line. Bit more complicated? Yes. But a heck of a lot more accurate without the weather forecaster all but having "Nearer My God To Thee" or "My Heart Will Go On" in the background.

Nowhere on this planet can you not escape something whether it be tornadoes, mudslides, earthquakes. In the end, all we can do is prepare as best we can and include a healthly supply of common sense in our survival gear.
 
Just wondering about the nearly 100 people killed in the recent hurricane and am hearing most people drown in their house or cars and curious if its because they don't understand the level of danger or just ignore the warnings. It seems like with several days warning notice everyone would jump in their car and leave or get in tall building or something to reduce the risk?
In 1989 Hurricane Hugo came through much of the same area that Helene just hit. Hugo was still a Category 1 hurricane when it came through Hickory NC, where I live now. I was living in Raleigh back then but my parents were here. It's the storm everyone around here still talked about, 35 years later......until this past weekend. Hugo was mainly wind and there are places in the woods still clogged with rotting trees blown over 35 years ago, and homeowners point out the trees they replaced and what parts of their home had to be rebuilt after Hugo passed.

Helene was a totally different animal, partly because of its track, compared to Hugo's track. Hugo came in from Charleston, from the southeast, and the eye passed over west-central NC, so the rain event was to the north, but it wasn't as much rain as Helene brought from the Gulf. Helene's eye passed west of Asheville, it was moving faster, and even though Helene had dropped to tropical storm strength, there were still hurricane strength gusts, and the northeast quadrant of the storm crossed the western portion of NC and the NC mountains. Mountains tend to pull the moisture out of a storm such as this and we had been in a stalled front dumping heavy thunderstorms for the four days before Helene reached us. I measured 6 inches of rain from Monday afternoon to Thursday night at midnight, about the time Helene made landfall in the Big Bend area of Florida. From Midnight Thursday until noon Friday , just 12 hours I thought might never end, I got another 8 inches of rain. It only took Helene those 12 hours to travel from the Gulf to the western Appalachians, and everyone along the way got flooded. We had a lot of trees that fell over instead of broken off, because the ground was so saturated. A 50 mph gust was all it took. I had two large pines along my property line that were blown over, the roots sticking out of the ground. Nothing hit my house, but my chain link fence was flattened in two places plus a drive through gate destroyed. I never lost power or cell service, internet was down from late Thursday until this morning. I was one of the lucky ones.

I'm glad we live at about3,000 Ft. elevation. We do not need flood insurance. Wind, snow and earthquakes are another thing.
Boone NC is at 3300 feet and was almost washed away. The main street was a river a foot deep.

Actually, the NHC did forecast this event. Either nobody got the memo or nobody wanted to believe it.

From Hurricane HELENE issued 0700 CDT Thursday, 26 September, 2024
For once, NWS was close in its estimate, but they usually overestimate what we get. In this case they underestimated the rainfall. Some isolated areas of western NC got over 20 inches of rain in about 24 hours. The eastern slopes of the Appalachians has three major rivers (Yadkin, Catawba and Broad) to drain the entire eastern mountainside from Georgia to Virginia and I'm not sure about what drains the western side, it's under TVA control. Those rivers were all out of their banks before reaching the foothills and they drain into the Atlantic at the SC coast. The New River has its own drainage system into the Ohio and drains the far northwest corner of NC. Everything else goes into the Tennessee River system managed by TVA. All the Catawba River lakes were already full to capacity from the several days of thunderstorms prior to Helene. Lake James, the first lake in the Catawba system reached its highest-ever level since it was first filled in 1919. Of the seven lakes on the Catawba River from Lake James to Lake Wylie just southwest of Charlotte, only Lake Hickory, Lake Norman and Lake Wylie can regulate the river flow to any extent, the rest only have overflow spillways and a single hydropower chase inside the dam. At Lake Hickory, where I live, five of the ten flood gates were fully open on Saturday afternoon. The highway bridge in front of the dam (about 150 yards downstream) was closed due to the volume of water running under it, for fear of a possible collapse. I've only seen that much water come over that dam once, over 50 years ago, and the bridge in front was flooded, damaged and replaced a few years later.

Why don't people pack up and leave when warned? Home is all they have, and I suppose they feel better about being lost with it than to leave and come back to nothing.
 
My life has been defined by hurricanes. Hilda, Betsy, Camile, Juan, Andrew Lillie, Katrina, Rita, ....... to name the major ones. One way or the other, each changed my life forever. It's part of life down here. You do the best you can, make what you think are the best decisions and then just trust in God and deal with it.
Also it helps to have extra chainsaw chains, two stroke oil, gas, water and scotch. And a boat. Gotta have a boat.
 
It's easy to say, "Why don't they just move away until the storm passes?" First, to where? Storms change course. Second, a lot of people don't have the financial means to pick up and leave home for an unknown period of time and choose to ride out the storm. Third, there's always some idiots who choose to ride out the storm because they made it through the last one okay. My wife and I moved from the beach to get away from the hurricanes (I retired from law enforcement and was never home when they hit-my wife was always home alone with the kids) yet here we are. We were very blessed in that we lost power from Thursday afternoon to Saturday morning. Many neighbors had trees down (uprooted because of soggy ground) but not us this time. The lady across the street had a pretty big oak tree blocking her driveway I was able to help cut up enough to let her get out but other people weren't so fortunate. Since we've moved here to the foothills I've learned that although hurricanes aren't the main problem tornadoes and flooding ARE. There are many people with medical conditions stuck in homes with no power (think oxygen systems, think diabetics, and many more) and rescue teams are using helicopters and ATVs get to them in the western part of the state. Just keep them in your prayers and thought!
 
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It over til it's over. There's a brand new one churning in the Gulf as we speak. Right now it's projected to come ashore near where Hellene came in. That may change as it probably won't get here until next Wednesday as a Cat 2....or more.
 
It's a good thing fema has a plan and the monetary resources to get things done for these folks.:rolleyes:

I love the volunteer and philanthropic spirit of regular citizens towards their fellow Americans. It is heartwarming and has saved lives.
God bless all of those effected by Helene.
 
Eastern Tennessee and western North Carolina were hit with something unprecedented in recorded times. Living in the high country of the Arkansas Ozarks I can relate to a lot of what those folks were probably thinking before the storm. Yes, we get high amounts of rainfall from time to time. Yes, they cause flash flooding and wash a bridge now and again. But nothing like the amount of water that Helena dumped on those mountains in such a short period of time. All that water had to go somewhere and it went downhill.
 
The ammount of rain was apocalyptic. Lake Hartwell with 56,000 acres went up 6.1 feet. Here is the math on how much rainfall that represents

Lake Hartwell water inflow from Helene.

The unit used to measure lake and rivers volumes is usually the Acre foot, an acre of water one foot deep. An acre-foot is equal to 325,851 gallons of water.

Hartwell elevation was 653.30. on 9/25
Hartwell elevation rose to 659.46. 9/30

Rise of 6.16 feet in the lake level

Wikipedia gives the surface area of Lake Hartwell as 56,000 acres citing the Corps of Engineers

56,000 X 6.16 = 344,960 acre-foot of water increase

344,960 X 325,851 =112,405,560,960 gallons of water poured into Hartwell from Helene

Or 112 trillion, 405 million, 561 thousand gallons of water

Thats a lot of water
 
I live in Moore, OK which has been known as Tornado Alley and if there's a possibility of a Tornado, it's on every news channel and nearly everyone is talking about it and is aware of the danger. We have sirens that are absolutely brain scrambling LOUD and many people have above or below ground safe rooms or storm shelters. Just wondering about the nearly 100 people killed in the recent hurricane and am hearing most people drown in their house or cars and curious if its because they don't understand the level of danger or just ignore the warnings. It seems like with several days warning notice everyone would jump in their car and leave or get in tall building or something to reduce the risk?

The majority of the fatalities came from areas in North Carolina, Tennessee, northern Georgia, etc. Basically, Appalachia. We have family in all of those areas and fortunately for them nothing worse than lost power for a few days. All finally found it - it was usually behind the couch! :D

In the Asheville area, there was a large amount of rainfall even before the storm came through. Plus when you are in the areas people generally evacuate TO, few have a real plan to evacuate FROM there. And unlike New Orleans during H. Katrina where evacuations were recommended/ordered up to nearly a week prior, there was no real expectation of evacuations and certainly not many good routes out once the storm hit, few pre-storm warnings that were heeded, and the worst of the dire warnings came DURING the storm.

As for those who perished in Florida were I live, every storm there are always some folks who either don't have the resources to evacuate, don't think it's as serious as it actually can be, or think they can ride it out (usually accompanied by a lot of rum!). You know, Florida... :cool: Need I say more? :rolleyes:
 
The ammount of rain was apocalyptic. Lake Hartwell with 56,000 acres went up 6.1 feet. Here is the math on how much rainfall that represents

Lake Hartwell water inflow from Helene.

The unit used to measure lake and rivers volumes is usually the Acre foot, an acre of water one foot deep. An acre-foot is equal to 325,851 gallons of water.

Hartwell elevation was 653.30. on 9/25
Hartwell elevation rose to 659.46. 9/30

Rise of 6.16 feet in the lake level

Wikipedia gives the surface area of Lake Hartwell as 56,000 acres citing the Corps of Engineers

56,000 X 6.16 = 344,960 acre-foot of water increase

344,960 X 325,851 =112,405,560,960 gallons of water poured into Hartwell from Helene

Or 112 trillion, 405 million, 561 thousand gallons of water

Thats a lot of water

And that's only the water that fell into the Keowee-Toxaway drainage basin. Most of the floodwaters drained into the Catawba/Wateree River system, Yadkin-Peedee River system or west into the TVA rivers.

Below are two short videos. The first you can fast-forward through most of, it is just to show what the river and dam are like 99% of the time. The second video is quick but shows what the dam and river looked like on the Saturday after Helene went through the day before. This is Lake Hickory and Oxford Dam on the Catawba River system, over 50 miles east of Lake Lure, and 70 miles east of the Asheville area. None of those flood waters BTW came down the Catawba system. This water all came from north of Morganton and east of Black Mountain/Montreat.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u50CjvGcgEQ[/ame]

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jISdfYlOhs[/ame]

The floodwaters from Lake Lure continued down the Broad River, which flows through Columbia, SC and eventually into Lake Marion, Lake Moultrie and on to the Atlantic at Charleston via the Cooper River.
 
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Funny thing about people who live in areas that are prone to natural disasters of one sort or another, they get used to it. They go through it time and time again, with differing levels of intensity, and their usual version of nature trying to kill them seems easy to deal with compared to what others go through.
I worked with a guy whose brother lived close to the OP in OK. He asked his brother to move out here and start a business with him. His brother turned him down flat. You know why? Because, "That mountain blew up!" This guy nearly gets wiped out by the wind every couple of years, but a place where a mountain blew up once in 200 years is too dangerous to comprehend living there.

As far as Helene goes, she was a bad girl, and not in a good way. Due to the sudden turn, the areas hardest hit weren't prepared to face the brunt of the storm as the models showed it going elsewhere. With the already soaked ground from the previous thunderstorms and the truly unprecedented amounts of rain, everybody was, I think, caught off guard as to the destruction all that water would unleash on it's way back to the sea. Like someone said, those were the places you went to ride out a storm.
My heart goes out to those affected by Helene and I'm hoping everyone stays safe when Milton makes his appearance.
As far as the governments "response" to the storm and it's victims? Well, that's all I got to say about that.
 
Live on the sound just off the Atlantic in the curve of Florida/ Georgia. Storm has not come directly in here in over 100 years but who knows what may be next? The national “ weather guessers” have overblown most storms for years and years as they think its “cool”. I’m looking to move next year.
 
And unlike New Orleans during H. Katrina where evacuations were recommended/ordered up to nearly a week prior, there was no real expectation of evacuations and certainly not many good routes out once the storm hit, few pre-storm warnings that were heeded, and the worst of the dire warnings came DURING the storm.

As early as the Wednesday evening the NHC used these words in their forecast.

Over portions of the southeastern U.S. into the southern Appalachians, Helene is expected to produce total rain accumulations of 6 to 12 inches with isolated totals around 18 inches. This rainfall will likely result in catastrophic and potentially life-threatening flash and urban flooding, along with significant river flooding. Landslides are possible in steep terrain across the southern Appalachians.

Source: Hurricane HELENE
 
FEMA....

It's a good thing fema has a plan and the monetary resources to get things done for these folks.:rolleyes:

I love the volunteer and philanthropic spirit of regular citizens towards their fellow Americans. It is heartwarming and has saved lives.
God bless all of those effected by Helene.


...yeah right. When we got Hugoed FEMA took their sweet time showing up around here and when they did......well, I'm going to stop there.:mad:

Oh, I'd like to add that I'm sure that the people in the path of Helene had absolutely no idea what it was going to be besides a really bad storm. Flash floods in the mountains are always a possibility, but I never expected that Asheville would be submerged.
 
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This recent hurricane seems peculiar in that it may have cause more damage and fatalities inland than at the coasts. I have no proof of that beyond what I have seen in the news. I do not imagine folks in the Appalachians are used to worrying about hurricanes.
 

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